1

votes

Underlying mystery problem -- Recurring H. pylori overgrowth, yeast overgrowth, steatorrhea

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created May 28, 2013 at 3:36 AM

Here is what I have tried and has failed. As you can tell, I am desperate at this point. Most of these helped a little bit, but the symptoms did not go away completely, ever:

  • Paleo diet since September (including lots of coconut oil regularly)
  • Several months of the Standard Carb Diet
  • Avoiding all sugar for several months
  • Raw Milk Kefir for a few months (no noticeable benefit)
  • Various probiotics (multiple brands, no benefit)
  • Fermented sauerkraut (no noticeable benefit)
  • Mastic gum + Monolaurin (significantly suppresses h. pylori seemingly but does not make it go away)
  • Yeast fighters (helpful for suppressing a yet recurrent yeast infection
  • Ginger tea for several months(somewhat helpful)
  • L-glutamine powder (questionable benefit)
  • L-theanine (helpful for anxiety)
  • SAM-e (incredibly helpful for sleep, difference between typical 4 hours and 6-9 hours of sleep!! :) although it does seem as to increase indigestion)
  • Raw Apple Cider Vinegar (Bragg's) (helps against yeast, but only temporarily) tried for several months
  • Oregano Oil (temporarily beneficial against h pylori but increases anxiety incredibly and makes sleep difficult. hence, counterproductive)
  • Ox Bile (necessary for any fat digestion)
  • Digestive enzyme mix (helpful)
  • 14 day antibiotic regimen (triple therapy) resulted in decreased sleep overtime yet decreased skin rashes, with a total about 60% net symptom reduction. Yet, after the regimen, skin rashes returned. I went to monolaurin + mastic gum for symptom suppression, yet was not as effective as the antibiotics were, even though the antibiotics in themselves did not end my overgrowth
  • Grapefruit seed extract (no noticeable benefit)
  • Kelp (iodine) (no noticeable benefit)
  • Vitamin C and HCL no benefit, just acid reflux

ALL of these problems started developing after I took deoxycycline when I was 14 years old (five years ago). Did it cause liver damage??????? What do I do?????? I fix the problem and I end the overgrowth, right?

ANY suggestions???? I have tried almost everything, I NEED help before I develop a stomach ulcer lol seriously h. pylori as I understand contributes to 80-90% of stomach ulcers....

I take about 10 supplements twice a day in order to suppress many symptoms as to allow partial functioning in my life.

Thank you!!! $1 million to anyone who can END the suffering lol :)

As to answer some questions... I took a Metametrix test several months ago to confirm the overgrowth. The symptoms of the overgrowth still reside which is why I still complain. Which include: Anxiety, constipation, skin rashes, insomnia, stomach cramping, itchy ear canal and anus.

161ffc7ad72fca7878bc5e3fe0719db7

(0)

on July 16, 2013
at 07:12 PM

P.S. Especially considering the 'high anti-gliadin (anti-gluten) antibodies'_WITHOUT_intestinal inflammation. Dr. Osborne's theories are largely based on the premise that celiac disease (with inflammation, celia die-off etc) is only _ONE_ manifestation of gluten and/or casein allergy. Other manifestations of the sensitivity include IBS, Crohn's, leaky gut (intestinal permeability), ADD/ADHD, migraine, depression, infertility, many auto-immune diseases, and the inflammatory diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis, diabetes, and even cancer (particularly lymphoma).

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on June 02, 2013
at 03:00 AM

Hmmm I'm wondering atm if the Metametrix test is complete BS? They do not appear to have a decent reputation... consider their "urinary analysis test". I am wondering now if I even have any sort of h. pylori or SIBO whatsoever?

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 09:50 PM

Please read the edited answer and let me know if you have any further questions.

048dd52752c45129c1212bfffb37ca72

(3150)

on May 28, 2013
at 08:01 PM

That sounds pretty discouraging :( Hope you can manage to get through this, keep us informed!

048dd52752c45129c1212bfffb37ca72

(3150)

on May 28, 2013
at 08:00 PM

That sounds pretty discouraging :( Hope can be able to get through this, keep us informed!

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 07:58 PM

Joanna, I am finally recovering - and I had C. diff and golden staff and some other nasty stuff. No wonder I was in so much pain and agony!

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 07:56 PM

Lazza, if I were you, I would take a stool sample for dysbiosis (Metametrix or similar). Then you would discover the real reason for your ulcer.

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 05:06 PM

Thanks for the considerations harnessedinslums

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 05:05 PM

I thought an acidic environment kills h. pylori? I have taken a stool sample test. No other parasites were found, just h. pylori and yeast. Other aspects: low stomach enzymes and low symbiotic bacteria (despite kefir, saurekraut and various probiotics doing almost nothing in my intestines), high anti-gliadin (anti-gluten) antibodies. No intestinal inflammation found. See one of my other questions for further details.

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 04:56 PM

I do not remember the antibiotics from the therapy I'm sure they were the standard antibiotics

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 04:53 PM

I suppose the drug damaged my liver hence the recurring symptoms, but I do not know how to determine what it caused, or if gallstones are necessarily a potential precursor to h. pylori or yeast overgrowth. Thoughts? Thanks

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:05 PM

Tried Vit C, licorice root, spices (ginger, pepper, cayenne pepper, garlic, chili pepper, etc. etc.) and still alot of these every day (vitamin C a few times a week because it often just causes acid reflux and does nothing at all), and I still take apple cider vinegar a few times a week. They help somewhat but only temporarily. I've been taking all of this for 8 months to no avail because once I stop any benefit they've had is immediately reversed. A recurring problem any natural antibiotics effects are only temporarily effective

089dd41b18fbb95ebb5347cded708d98

(5635)

on May 28, 2013
at 10:06 AM

Thanks vb. im just struggling a lot and am trying any random thing. Cant get any doctors near me to try fecal transplant.

Cf08ad26759fdd206a2c9f9385080a57

(995)

on May 28, 2013
at 09:10 AM

Which antibiotics were used in your triple therapy?

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 06:27 AM

Joanna, be careful with iodine - there could be some side effects.

C6032b723b12cf0073ec6d22c5f4e7ae

on May 28, 2013
at 05:56 AM

Have you tried an intestinal cleanse? And have you considered parasites as another possible cause? Also, Himalaya Liver Care apparently helps support biliary function and regulates liver enzymes. Sorry, wish I could help. My health is abysmal too so I understand.

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 04:02 AM

hmmmm still idk what to do but you're definitely right about the probiotics lol. to no avail...

089dd41b18fbb95ebb5347cded708d98

(5635)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:58 AM

darn. I noticed you said kelp but not straight up iodine. I've read that kelp supplements contain high levels of arsenic. I am trying lugol's iodine solution (only on day 3) but I have had less bleeding than usual. infections are a total pain to treat. I noticed probiotics don't do crap when it comes to infections in the gut.

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:43 AM

Yes, it did not do anything.

  • B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

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9 Answers

1
75d65450b6ff0be7b969fb321f1200ac

(2506)

on May 28, 2013
at 12:04 PM

To echo others, have you been retested for H. pylori after the antibiotic treatment? Such antibiotic treatments are almost always effective. I don't see the point in worrying about ulcers and taking stuff like mastic gum if indeed your H. pylori infection is gone.

Let me share with my my experience. I suffered years with IBS and mild duodenal ulcers. Going Paleo/SCD was able to make things 70% better. I was then diagnosed with H. pylori. After antibiotics I was retested and was given the all clear. It took about six more weeks for everything to settle down and my IBS to (almost) vanish. Unfortunately I still develop ulcers. Taking ranitine (generic Zantac) twice daily keeps enough of a lid on gastric acid production to prevent ulcers. [Sometimes older folks are prone to developing ulcers. There might be a genetic angle to it.]

So get retested for H. pylori. Stick with Paleo (..actually SCD works best for me). Give your system a break for a few weeks from all your supplementing. If you are still in bad shape then revisit your gastroenterologist. Something else is wrong. Once you get a firm diagnosis you'll be able to devise a new plan of attack.

_Lazza

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 07:56 PM

Lazza, if I were you, I would take a stool sample for dysbiosis (Metametrix or similar). Then you would discover the real reason for your ulcer.

1
Cf08ad26759fdd206a2c9f9385080a57

(995)

on May 28, 2013
at 04:27 AM

Maybe talk to your doctor about Sequential therapy.

To test an alternative approach to H. pylori eradication, investigators in South Korea conducted a prospective, single-blind, randomized study in which 409 treatment-naive adults with H. pylori infection received either sequential therapy (pantoprazole 40 mg and amoxicillin 1 g, each twice daily for 5 days, followed by pantoprazole 40 mg, clarithromycin 500 mg, and metronidazole 500 mg) twice daily for the next 5 days or standard triple therapy (pantoprazole 40 mg, amoxicillin 1 g, and clarithromycin 500 mg) twice daily for 14 days. Eradication was determined by a urea breath test performed at least 4 weeks after the end of therapy.

The eradication rate was higher with sequential therapy than with standard triple therapy in both the intent-to-treat analysis (85.9% vs. 75.0%; P=0.006) and the per-protocol analysis (92.6% vs. 85.0%; P=0.019). Adverse events were similar between groups. The authors concluded that, in Korea, 10-day sequential therapy provides a higher eradication rate than 14-day triple therapy and might be a first-line treatment for H. pylori infection in the future

Possibly using tetracycline hcl instead of metronidazole. (http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/460038)

Or there's always.. Poop implants.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fecal_bacteriotherapy

0
6866305cf86d7a583103125bc30546f2

on June 02, 2014
at 06:08 PM

Has anyone had water retention with h phylori and inability to lose weight? Thyroid is fine as well as stool test but haven t tried apple cider first. Triple therapy didn t work on me

0
161ffc7ad72fca7878bc5e3fe0719db7

on July 16, 2013
at 06:57 PM

I know gluten intolerance/sensitivity seems like the latest health 'fad', but I would strongly suggest looking at Dr. Jeffery Osborne's website. Often gluten-sensitive people are casein sensitive (protein found in milk) as well. His knowledge is cutting edge-- he is looking at celiac disease and gut/other issues through a completely different lens. If you're really frustrated and miserable it might be worth a look-see.

www.glutenfreesociety.org

161ffc7ad72fca7878bc5e3fe0719db7

(0)

on July 16, 2013
at 07:12 PM

P.S. Especially considering the 'high anti-gliadin (anti-gluten) antibodies'_WITHOUT_intestinal inflammation. Dr. Osborne's theories are largely based on the premise that celiac disease (with inflammation, celia die-off etc) is only _ONE_ manifestation of gluten and/or casein allergy. Other manifestations of the sensitivity include IBS, Crohn's, leaky gut (intestinal permeability), ADD/ADHD, migraine, depression, infertility, many auto-immune diseases, and the inflammatory diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis, diabetes, and even cancer (particularly lymphoma).

0
91df925687e66304de8a5b506bc08f47

on June 08, 2013
at 04:34 AM

Have you been tested for Lyme (Borrelia) spirochetes or other tick-borne illnesses? Regular serum antibody-tests are useless for finding it, but it can be found through some Labs. Where are you located?

0
4d89a79465e75b38a3b5a898316d782e

(0)

on May 29, 2013
at 03:42 AM

I too had h pylori and my gastro doc told me I will always test postive for it since I once had it. I went through two rounds of the antibiotic/ppi's to get rid of it. I later read articles through google that said you can treat h pylori with pepto bismo.

0
F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 07:17 AM

Okay, so let's try figuring this out.

Your H. Pylori keeps returning, right? By the way, do you think it keeps returning because you have the symptoms or because you actually take some test to verify it?

It is important that you know 100% for sure you have H. Pylori, it is not just your guess.

If you 100% SURE BASED ON THE TEST that you have it, there are multiple things you can do:

Number 1. H. Pylori thrives in acidic environment. How to reduce your stomach acidity? Some people suggest for drinking tons of water (and by tons it means no more than 16 cups per day, and not in one sitting - you can die from drinking too much water too soon).

The constant flow of water (one half a cup every 30 minutes) will keep your stomach less acidic. From what I have read, you need to do it for 2-3 days.

However, this was from a person who had only H. Pylori listed as a medical problem. You might have others.

so Number 2. Have you been tested by parasites/dysbiosis? If H. Pylori keeps coming back because something creates the perfect environment for it, you need to figure out the cause. Could you possibly take a comprehensive stool sample and let us know what exactly is going on?

Number 3. If you have tried both 1 and 2 from the above, I have another option as well. But you need to know the results for #2 first.


EDITED:

PLEASE READ:

H.Pylori THRIVES IN ACIDIC ENVIRONMENT. You have to lower your stomach acidity to kill it.

http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php/Helicobacter_pylori

Most doctors recommend combining PPIs and antibiotics. I am not a doctor but I would like to warn you against it. PPIs cause more harm than good.

I don't know where to read the other question that you have mentioned, but try reducing your acidic environment by the water treatment I got from some website. Some people suggest adding a clove of crushed garlic to water.

However, I suspect that you have other things going on besides H.Pylory. If you want, you can write to my email and I can tell you what helped me (even though I did not have H. Pylori, the treatment is very similar). By the way, the treatment is working - I am so happy!

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 09:50 PM

Please read the edited answer and let me know if you have any further questions.

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on June 02, 2013
at 03:00 AM

Hmmm I'm wondering atm if the Metametrix test is complete BS? They do not appear to have a decent reputation... consider their "urinary analysis test". I am wondering now if I even have any sort of h. pylori or SIBO whatsoever?

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 05:05 PM

I thought an acidic environment kills h. pylori? I have taken a stool sample test. No other parasites were found, just h. pylori and yeast. Other aspects: low stomach enzymes and low symbiotic bacteria (despite kefir, saurekraut and various probiotics doing almost nothing in my intestines), high anti-gliadin (anti-gluten) antibodies. No intestinal inflammation found. See one of my other questions for further details.

0
048dd52752c45129c1212bfffb37ca72

on May 28, 2013
at 05:34 AM

I find it strange that considering the amount of things you have tried, you don't say anything about coconut oil, which should be one of the first things that come into mind when you look at this community, coconut oil is, well, you know, so popular :)

Indeed, amongst its possible reported benefits, it seems that is able to fight h. pylori, see this link: http://www.hailmerry.com/blog/2011/05/coconut-oil-kills-the-bacteria-that-causes-ulcers/

Since you have tried anything I guess it's worth a try, frankly if the antibiotics couldn't make anything for you... have you retested for the bacteria? Are you sure you still have it and cannot be related to other derivative problem like any food intolerance or damaged gut?

BTW, I'd keep trying with apple cider vinegar and in general anything that can rise your stomach acid levels, this link has some info suggesting Vitamin C, licorice, hot spices and Betaine HCL between others.

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/dig10.php

Good luck!

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:05 PM

Tried Vit C, licorice root, spices (ginger, pepper, cayenne pepper, garlic, chili pepper, etc. etc.) and still alot of these every day (vitamin C a few times a week because it often just causes acid reflux and does nothing at all), and I still take apple cider vinegar a few times a week. They help somewhat but only temporarily. I've been taking all of this for 8 months to no avail because once I stop any benefit they've had is immediately reversed. A recurring problem any natural antibiotics effects are only temporarily effective

048dd52752c45129c1212bfffb37ca72

(3150)

on May 28, 2013
at 08:00 PM

That sounds pretty discouraging :( Hope can be able to get through this, keep us informed!

048dd52752c45129c1212bfffb37ca72

(3150)

on May 28, 2013
at 08:01 PM

That sounds pretty discouraging :( Hope you can manage to get through this, keep us informed!

0
089dd41b18fbb95ebb5347cded708d98

(5635)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:39 AM

have you tried iodine? that stuff is a strong antibiotic and antifungal. I started taking it a few days ago for c diff that I've had since January.

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 04:02 AM

hmmmm still idk what to do but you're definitely right about the probiotics lol. to no avail...

089dd41b18fbb95ebb5347cded708d98

(5635)

on May 28, 2013
at 10:06 AM

Thanks vb. im just struggling a lot and am trying any random thing. Cant get any doctors near me to try fecal transplant.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 06:27 AM

Joanna, be careful with iodine - there could be some side effects.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on May 28, 2013
at 07:58 PM

Joanna, I am finally recovering - and I had C. diff and golden staff and some other nasty stuff. No wonder I was in so much pain and agony!

B120d28d9620626012de121b6075ce51

(134)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:43 AM

Yes, it did not do anything.

089dd41b18fbb95ebb5347cded708d98

(5635)

on May 28, 2013
at 03:58 AM

darn. I noticed you said kelp but not straight up iodine. I've read that kelp supplements contain high levels of arsenic. I am trying lugol's iodine solution (only on day 3) but I have had less bleeding than usual. infections are a total pain to treat. I noticed probiotics don't do crap when it comes to infections in the gut.

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