4

votes

Dairy and weight loss

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created October 22, 2011 at 9:43 PM

In many of the questions I've read here on "how to lose weight," people have advised against consuming dairy. What is it about dairy that prevents weight loss?

F1b39d4f620876330312f4925bd51900

(4090)

on October 24, 2011
at 07:13 PM

Believe me I am working the whole Ray Peat big picture. I am following his personalized diet recommendations to the T, plus thyroid supplementation/progesterone/etc. Weight gain was an unwanted side effect.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 24, 2011
at 05:42 PM

Peats recommendations don't really work that great if you isolate his recommendations and don't look at the whole picture.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 24, 2011
at 05:40 AM

Goat milk, yogurt and other dairy products are not that mainstream but you can find them easily in most stores and in baazar. For sheep, its not widely available and you need to go to specialized stores.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on October 23, 2011
at 10:15 PM

@maj, yogurt making practices interest me. I make my own using scalded 2% fat cow's milk in a thermostatically controlled (45C)yogurt maker. I have had poor success with sheep or goat milk, and would like to know whether these are commonly available in your country (Serbia?).

Medium avatar

(10611)

on October 23, 2011
at 07:38 PM

This is about weight loss dairy, and if you take away the fat cheese is nearly pure protein. In most cases that means bad cheese. But I like fat free feta as well as regular, with cottage cheese it makes no difference either. And the whey cheese (such as real ricotta) are quite low in fat, too.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32564)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:42 PM

Cliff-In a hot country, you either need to heat the milk or ferment it. I make raw milk kefir from goats milk I buy at the farmer's market. It keeps a long time that way, has very little lactose and is a good pro-biotic. Indians probably heat the milk because their sanitation in their dairies is not optimal. All the raw milk farmers in the US that I have visited have been extraordinarily meticulous in the cleanliness/sanitation of their milking parlors.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:16 PM

Yea I always hated that about raw milk it would taste like crap after 1 or 2 days of opening it. My pasteurized is good.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:07 PM

Everybody cooks milk tho. Its very easy to get spoiled. Many people even stop buying cheese during summer days. All older people check on baazar the type of person that sells it, how clean he/she is, does it wear special clothes and naylon gloves etc... Milk is notoriously easy to spoil if you are sloppy farmer.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:04 PM

In my country cheese and yogurt and kefir are made from uncooked milk exclusively.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 23, 2011
at 05:33 PM

Why do you think Indian people who arguably have the most experience with milk cook it before it is eaten?

C2450eb7fa11b37473599caf93b461ef

(3225)

on October 23, 2011
at 04:54 PM

Low fat? How can you recommend anything low fat? That's not real food! Better no dairy than low-fat dairy.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:37 PM

Yup, although coconut oil is half medium chain which burn very easily and aren't really stored.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:35 PM

Histidine is the only essential amino acid that doesn't cause an insulin increase.

Ed92809f18ca70e360768b4f2c9c9df6

(356)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:23 PM

if that is it, then there should be no reason for me to switch from heavy cream to coconut milk in my coffee then?

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:15 PM

If you don't get an insulin spike how do you absorb the nutrients??????

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:08 PM

Not everyone gets an insulin spike from meat or from dairy. It must be checked

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:07 PM

Plus one.........

6229cd9a7ca9882590259fae022e2647

(3209)

on October 22, 2011
at 10:30 PM

Good question. I'm curious about the answers.

  • Ed92809f18ca70e360768b4f2c9c9df6

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10 Answers

best answer

0
B9cc28905ec54389c47cde031d709703

on October 23, 2011
at 07:33 PM

I think the main thing with dairy is that it is easy to get a lot of fat quick. But I've gone for periods of time just drinking lots of milk, eating cheese, eggs, butter, beef (1-3 times a week), liver (1-2 times per week depending on how much you can choke down), and orange juice and was able to lean out just fine. However, if you over do things like butter and cheese it's easy to gain weight or stay the same on the same diet. So controlling your fat is important, it doesn't have to be rocket science though, just having a little sanity when you're preparing your foods and only using enough butter and not eating a car battery size of cheese everyday will go a long way. I've also found that if you're doing a lot of dairy is very helpful to eat liver once or twice a week if your skin is bipolar.

In times were I really want to lean out for a competition I'll get 1.5% fat milk. Over here in Europe I can get that non-homogenized.

6
Medium avatar

on October 22, 2011
at 11:06 PM

The insulin spike is the same you'd get from meat (i.e. accompanied by a glucagon spike). As such, it doesn't make much of a difference with regard to fat loss. Dairy will interfere with fat loss the same way that any concentrated source of LCFAs will. There are a lot of people who say to cut dairy and nuts if you hit a stall/plateau but those same people may not acknowledge that it's the additional fat that's the problem.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:35 PM

Histidine is the only essential amino acid that doesn't cause an insulin increase.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:08 PM

Not everyone gets an insulin spike from meat or from dairy. It must be checked

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:15 PM

If you don't get an insulin spike how do you absorb the nutrients??????

2
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:12 PM

Dairy can even help with weight loss. In local obesity clinic in Belgrade my friend was on youghurt-only-treatment for 14 days.

We are yoghurt nation. Nobody gets fat on it and many people drink around 1L each day. We have 100 different products here with vitamins, probiotics, fruit, grains etc....

I don't have to tell you that all sugary ones are BS. Regular youghurt doesn't have more then 4g of lactose per 100ml. Since lactose isn't digested fully, it doesn't rise blood sugar that fast as sucrose AFAIK.

I wouldn't be worried about it at all. No dairy is recommended as anti-autoimmune diet.

See about whey and wight loss here:

http://www.1whey2health.com/whey-weight-loss.htm http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2006/mar2006_report_whey_01.htm

Medium avatar

(10611)

on October 23, 2011
at 10:15 PM

@maj, yogurt making practices interest me. I make my own using scalded 2% fat cow's milk in a thermostatically controlled (45C)yogurt maker. I have had poor success with sheep or goat milk, and would like to know whether these are commonly available in your country (Serbia?).

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 24, 2011
at 05:40 AM

Goat milk, yogurt and other dairy products are not that mainstream but you can find them easily in most stores and in baazar. For sheep, its not widely available and you need to go to specialized stores.

2
D72e9d21977363ea1850fa00555f151a

on October 22, 2011
at 11:02 PM

I think the problem most people find with dairy and weight loss is that it spikes insulin. However, I'd test on your own and see if it works for you. I've seen people lose weight while still eating dairy (mostly cottage cheese and yogurt)

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:07 PM

Plus one.........

0
F1b39d4f620876330312f4925bd51900

(4090)

on October 24, 2011
at 03:48 PM

I listened to a ray peat podcast from 2008 the other day and he was talking about how dairy is his first recommendation for weight loss. That the high calcium content powerfully stimulates the metabolic rate and if you combine it with salt you will heighten that effect. However, I went back on raw milk 3 months ago -to try to help with tummy issues/low thyroid (I was at an ideal weight) and I gained 10 pounds. I am now heavier than I have ever been in my life. YIKES! (Also broke out a ton, and had increasingly bad stomach issues).

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 24, 2011
at 05:42 PM

Peats recommendations don't really work that great if you isolate his recommendations and don't look at the whole picture.

F1b39d4f620876330312f4925bd51900

(4090)

on October 24, 2011
at 07:13 PM

Believe me I am working the whole Ray Peat big picture. I am following his personalized diet recommendations to the T, plus thyroid supplementation/progesterone/etc. Weight gain was an unwanted side effect.

0
Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32564)

on October 23, 2011
at 03:55 PM

I think it depends on the type of dairy.

If you are talking pasteurized, growth hormone & antibiotic-laced conventionally raised & processed dairy, then yes, definitely cut it out.

However, my n=1 and anecdotal experience is that raw, 100% grass-fed, hormone & antibiotic-free dairy from well-cared-for cows, goats or sheep is a great addition to a fat loss diet for some people. High CLA can help with belly fat loss.

That said, I agree with Travis & Cliff that it can be easy to eat too much fat/calories, regardless of the tyoe of dairy, if you aren't aware.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 23, 2011
at 05:33 PM

Why do you think Indian people who arguably have the most experience with milk cook it before it is eaten?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:07 PM

Everybody cooks milk tho. Its very easy to get spoiled. Many people even stop buying cheese during summer days. All older people check on baazar the type of person that sells it, how clean he/she is, does it wear special clothes and naylon gloves etc... Milk is notoriously easy to spoil if you are sloppy farmer.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:04 PM

In my country cheese and yogurt and kefir are made from uncooked milk exclusively.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32564)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:42 PM

Cliff-In a hot country, you either need to heat the milk or ferment it. I make raw milk kefir from goats milk I buy at the farmer's market. It keeps a long time that way, has very little lactose and is a good pro-biotic. Indians probably heat the milk because their sanitation in their dairies is not optimal. All the raw milk farmers in the US that I have visited have been extraordinarily meticulous in the cleanliness/sanitation of their milking parlors.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 23, 2011
at 06:16 PM

Yea I always hated that about raw milk it would taste like crap after 1 or 2 days of opening it. My pasteurized is good.

0
E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:16 PM

Its just another food for people to cut out which inevitably decreases cals

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:37 PM

Yup, although coconut oil is half medium chain which burn very easily and aren't really stored.

Ed92809f18ca70e360768b4f2c9c9df6

(356)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:23 PM

if that is it, then there should be no reason for me to switch from heavy cream to coconut milk in my coffee then?

0
F1b82cc7e6d90384ad30007dd6c1b9e3

(1187)

on October 22, 2011
at 11:15 PM

pasteurized dairy is hard to digest, gives you that bloated feel. Use it like a condiment without going overboard. Certain cheeses are low carb, but yogurt is high carb, watch the added sugar, Dr. Eenfeldt recommends high fat yogurt, but that's hard to find on store shelves in the U.S.

-1
Medium avatar

(10611)

on October 23, 2011
at 04:31 PM

I'd consider yogurt and lowfat cheeses to be helpful for weight loss dieting, but not the high fat cheeses and butter. The last two are calorie dense and I overeat them. WAY too rewarding.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on October 23, 2011
at 07:38 PM

This is about weight loss dairy, and if you take away the fat cheese is nearly pure protein. In most cases that means bad cheese. But I like fat free feta as well as regular, with cottage cheese it makes no difference either. And the whey cheese (such as real ricotta) are quite low in fat, too.

C2450eb7fa11b37473599caf93b461ef

(3225)

on October 23, 2011
at 04:54 PM

Low fat? How can you recommend anything low fat? That's not real food! Better no dairy than low-fat dairy.

-3
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on October 23, 2011
at 01:07 AM

With the right mindset and motivation anyone can shed a couple pounds with some patience and perseverance. A little bit of exercise and nutritional knowledge goes a long way. Anybody struggling with their weight should give this blog a look. He has an inspirational story of how he changed his life for the better, and ended up meeting the love of his life. I always read his first post whenever I am a bit frustrated with my dieting, Josh is a lucky man. http://www.extremeweightlosshelpnow.com/

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