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Vitamins E and K on Ray Peat diet?

Commented on September 28, 2017
Created April 11, 2012 at 1:34 AM

Been plugging in all the Ray Peat staples to cronometer, vitamins E and K seem to be the only ones not making the cut. Best sources when following the recommendatinons of Ray Peat?

9558a94ac1f139e1c65b5360afe3b85a

(0)

on September 28, 2017
at 04:27 AM

 I have discovered throughout the years that everybody is different. One diet may be wonderful for one person and for another person it could be pure hell. I have suffered from insomnia since 2004 using heavy dose of prescription medication for 10 years. It stopped working . I did the Paleo diet. However for me it made my insomnia worse. When I read about gelatin in the works of Dr. Ray Peat I tried it in May 2017 . I was afraid to add salt, white sugar, lots of fruits, dairy while cutting out my favorite: avocados, nuts, vegetable oil.  Almost 5 months later, yesterday my doctor has cleared me from severe insomnia. I was able to send his letter along with my letter and the bottles of medication back to the pharmaceutical company.  When people asked me how was my severe insomnia cured I simply tell him: beef gelatin, salt, orange juice, sugar, dairy, and lots of food fruit.  I will say that he was right about PUFAS which nuts has tons of them and how PUFAS don't allow one's body to get the sugar it needs.My insomnia started in 2004 when I went to physical therapy for my ankle and the physical therapist told me to add more nuts, avocados, salmon.  I cut out the dairy at that time too because I did not want to gain weight from the nuts so something had to be cut out. However now I discovered that my body needs dairy. If your body doesn't need dairy go for it and don't take it. But like I said every single person is different. I wanted Paleo diet to work for me but all it did was increase My insomnia problem and weight gain.it's Paleo or another diet works for you, that is great. Stick with it. But also be sensitive to other people's diet as everybody's genetics and health problems are completely different from everybody else's.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 06, 2012
at 06:47 PM

Evidence???????

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on June 04, 2012
at 10:22 AM

*"There is non medical or scientific reason to believe sugar is therapeutic. "Real" Orange Juice."* Oh come on, there's plenty. *"Does this ever sound like 80/10/10? If it makes you sick YOU DID IT WRONG MATE"* True, but I wasn't saying the diet has to work, just wondering if you did a silly mistake, because drinking enzyme-treated OJ is a big mistake.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on June 04, 2012
at 10:16 AM

No I was suggesting sugar might not be as pointless as you think it is.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on May 30, 2012
at 11:10 PM

You are actually suggesting white sugar isn't a highly refined food? Really? Now my head hurts.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on May 13, 2012
at 05:30 PM

Hey, I wasn't saying you did it wrong or that you have to try it again. All I'm saying is that, if you're gonna criticize Ray, don't just say *"To suggest you need this sort or amount of carb is silly."* or *"It's highly refined and a really pointless food."*, especially if you ask us to provide you with studies about the raw carrot and afterwards criticize that study because it isn't perfect.

2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on April 12, 2012
at 07:41 PM

The only halfway right thing to say is that little may be required to avoid vitamin e deficiency. It is still neccessary.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 12, 2012
at 04:30 PM

I never he recommended 400g. As far as minerals the most white sugar has is copper and at 1000kcal of sugar you'd still be getting so little you'd end up with copper deficiency. It's highly refined and a really pointless food. There is non medical or scientific reason to believe sugar is therapeutic. "Real" Orange Juice. Does this ever sound like 80/10/10? If it makes you sick YOU DID IT WRONG MATE.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on April 12, 2012
at 07:52 AM

I should have said *"vitamin E is unnecessary in the context of a diet without PUFA"*. http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-fats/good-fats-bad-fats-separating-fact-from-fiction : Chris Masterjohn says that *"Animal experiments suggest that we should obtain 0.6 milligrams of vitamin E for every gram of PUFA we consume."*

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on April 12, 2012
at 07:43 AM

Peat does never say you *need* 400g of carbs, he literally said *the amount is not really the most important thing, it's the quality* (said this in one of the East West Healing podcasts). White sugar is handy as a therapeutic aid. Ray never says it's necessary, and actually even says fruit is better due to minerals. I agree the carrot hype is not very scientific (can't find good references either), but it works for me nonetheless. Did you drink real orange juice or did you buy it? Dr. Peat said the juice nowadays is treated with enzymes so you do have pulp in it.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 03:12 PM

Korion - I said flat out that I followed his protocol. My PUFA was always sub 2% and had been prior to Peat because I was experimenting with starches. White sugar barely qualifies as food. It has no value outside pure calories with no nutritive value. I had a friend test the two juice only, not from concentrate OJ available in BC. Both were essentially sugar water, they did not resemble eating an orange at all. I see no reason to think orange fiber is bad while carrot fiber is magic.

2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on April 11, 2012
at 02:49 PM

Calling a vitamin unneccessary... way to go, peatarians.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on April 11, 2012
at 12:00 PM

*He's wrong about white sugar, ice cream and Orange juice. These aren't, in my opinion, staples of a healthy diet.* Saying ice cream and OJ and sugar aren't healthy is not more than your opintion, really. Have you ever tried introducing it in the context of a low-PUFA diet?

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on April 11, 2012
at 11:56 AM

Vitamin E is non-necessary when eating very low PUFA. On the other hand, Ray Peat recommends external use of vitamin E.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 06:20 AM

dsohei - They are called veggies and fruits. I have heard the interview where Peat talks about eating 400g of carb per day mostly from milk, OJ and eating a pint of ice cream a day. To suggest you need this sort or amount of carb is silly.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:47 AM

Cliff - The study you linked to speaks of lowered cholesterol and a CHANGE in flora. It says nothing about reduced estrogen. Also, I can't see the full text. Did they say that this was an effect unique to carrots because of the fungicidal and antibacterial skin that Peat talks about or is that just in the context of SAD and adding anything with some amount of fiber helps?

05055dcbf12c81f1cce777ec365870af

(1791)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:25 AM

k: egg yolks, milk products, bone broth, liver, thorne k2 supplement e: unique e supplement, most dietary sources of e are too high in pufa, etc IMO

05055dcbf12c81f1cce777ec365870af

(1791)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:23 AM

its about context, people in extreme stress with poor digestive ability and poor thyroid/immune health. people like to bandy this starch thing but thats only great if YOU CAN DIGEST IT. if you cant, u need to get your stress-reducing carbs from somewhere.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:09 AM

I've never heard ray refer to any food as a health food. He specifies what foods he thinks are safe in the context of a nutrient rich diet. If your eating mostly white sugar or ice cream you aren't doing what ray recommends. In regards to the carrot "Endotoxin formed in the bowel can block respiration and cause hormone imbalances contributing to instability of the nerves, so it is helpful to optimize bowel flora, for example with a carrot salad"-ray peat http://www.ajcn.org/content/32/9/1889.abstract

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 03:32 AM

From my perspective suggesting that Ice Cream and white sugar are healthful food choices. I'd agree they are fine in moderation for a healthy person and probably not worth frothing at the mouth about but to suggest they are somehow health-foods is a massive exaggeration. I've also looked for sources which show that you can have a large reduction in estrogen by eating a carrot salad and I can find no literature, no study, not even a fully fleshed out, probably mechanism. If you have a study I'd love to see it.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on April 11, 2012
at 03:01 AM

Where does he exaggerate wildly?

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3 Answers

6
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 01:45 AM

Re: Following Ray Peat - In a word? Don't.

I tried his stuff, I read it all, and the references. It's pretty bogus, he exaggerates wildly.

Take aways from Peat's work and a full 30 day trial on his plan?

Seafood like shrimp is great stuff and I should eat a lot more of it.

Whole fruit is good stuff and you shouldn't worry about it. He's wrong about white sugar, ice cream and Orange juice. These aren't, in my opinion, staples of a healthy diet.

Starches and Fiber aren't all the same and aren't always beneficial. He lead me to reading about the different forms of resistant starches. Reading him helped me get these but he wasn't a good source for this himself.

60 days supplementing Vit-E 30 as Paleo and 30 as Peatarian and I felt no differences. I am just not convinced it's essential in any large amount on a Paleo-style diet.

Just my thoughts...

As far as Vitamin-K you should be rollin' in the stuff if you are drinking 32-40oz of milk a day.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:47 AM

Cliff - The study you linked to speaks of lowered cholesterol and a CHANGE in flora. It says nothing about reduced estrogen. Also, I can't see the full text. Did they say that this was an effect unique to carrots because of the fungicidal and antibacterial skin that Peat talks about or is that just in the context of SAD and adding anything with some amount of fiber helps?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 06:20 AM

dsohei - They are called veggies and fruits. I have heard the interview where Peat talks about eating 400g of carb per day mostly from milk, OJ and eating a pint of ice cream a day. To suggest you need this sort or amount of carb is silly.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on April 11, 2012
at 03:01 AM

Where does he exaggerate wildly?

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on April 12, 2012
at 07:43 AM

Peat does never say you *need* 400g of carbs, he literally said *the amount is not really the most important thing, it's the quality* (said this in one of the East West Healing podcasts). White sugar is handy as a therapeutic aid. Ray never says it's necessary, and actually even says fruit is better due to minerals. I agree the carrot hype is not very scientific (can't find good references either), but it works for me nonetheless. Did you drink real orange juice or did you buy it? Dr. Peat said the juice nowadays is treated with enzymes so you do have pulp in it.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 03:32 AM

From my perspective suggesting that Ice Cream and white sugar are healthful food choices. I'd agree they are fine in moderation for a healthy person and probably not worth frothing at the mouth about but to suggest they are somehow health-foods is a massive exaggeration. I've also looked for sources which show that you can have a large reduction in estrogen by eating a carrot salad and I can find no literature, no study, not even a fully fleshed out, probably mechanism. If you have a study I'd love to see it.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:09 AM

I've never heard ray refer to any food as a health food. He specifies what foods he thinks are safe in the context of a nutrient rich diet. If your eating mostly white sugar or ice cream you aren't doing what ray recommends. In regards to the carrot "Endotoxin formed in the bowel can block respiration and cause hormone imbalances contributing to instability of the nerves, so it is helpful to optimize bowel flora, for example with a carrot salad"-ray peat http://www.ajcn.org/content/32/9/1889.abstract

05055dcbf12c81f1cce777ec365870af

(1791)

on April 11, 2012
at 04:23 AM

its about context, people in extreme stress with poor digestive ability and poor thyroid/immune health. people like to bandy this starch thing but thats only great if YOU CAN DIGEST IT. if you cant, u need to get your stress-reducing carbs from somewhere.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 11, 2012
at 03:12 PM

Korion - I said flat out that I followed his protocol. My PUFA was always sub 2% and had been prior to Peat because I was experimenting with starches. White sugar barely qualifies as food. It has no value outside pure calories with no nutritive value. I had a friend test the two juice only, not from concentrate OJ available in BC. Both were essentially sugar water, they did not resemble eating an orange at all. I see no reason to think orange fiber is bad while carrot fiber is magic.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on April 11, 2012
at 12:00 PM

*He's wrong about white sugar, ice cream and Orange juice. These aren't, in my opinion, staples of a healthy diet.* Saying ice cream and OJ and sugar aren't healthy is not more than your opintion, really. Have you ever tried introducing it in the context of a low-PUFA diet?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 12, 2012
at 04:30 PM

I never he recommended 400g. As far as minerals the most white sugar has is copper and at 1000kcal of sugar you'd still be getting so little you'd end up with copper deficiency. It's highly refined and a really pointless food. There is non medical or scientific reason to believe sugar is therapeutic. "Real" Orange Juice. Does this ever sound like 80/10/10? If it makes you sick YOU DID IT WRONG MATE.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on May 13, 2012
at 05:30 PM

Hey, I wasn't saying you did it wrong or that you have to try it again. All I'm saying is that, if you're gonna criticize Ray, don't just say *"To suggest you need this sort or amount of carb is silly."* or *"It's highly refined and a really pointless food."*, especially if you ask us to provide you with studies about the raw carrot and afterwards criticize that study because it isn't perfect.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on May 30, 2012
at 11:10 PM

You are actually suggesting white sugar isn't a highly refined food? Really? Now my head hurts.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on June 04, 2012
at 10:16 AM

No I was suggesting sugar might not be as pointless as you think it is.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on June 04, 2012
at 10:22 AM

*"There is non medical or scientific reason to believe sugar is therapeutic. "Real" Orange Juice."* Oh come on, there's plenty. *"Does this ever sound like 80/10/10? If it makes you sick YOU DID IT WRONG MATE"* True, but I wasn't saying the diet has to work, just wondering if you did a silly mistake, because drinking enzyme-treated OJ is a big mistake.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 06, 2012
at 06:47 PM

Evidence???????

1
923ed1d42c44f1a953c1aa135c9daf51

on June 04, 2012
at 10:12 AM

Vitamin E Antioxidant is a common kind of vitamin that many of us can implement. Anybody who truly wants to implement Vitamin E Antioxidant in the diet regime have to look at several things dependent upon the food products which will include that vitamin. These are definitely ingredients that could be seen in a range of completely different types. Below are some of the frequently used ingredients on the globe in terms of receiving the human body's correct amount of Vitamin E Antioxidant.

The most frequent food products that should provide Vitamin E Antioxidant are cereals. It is contained in whole wheat germ oils. In spite of this, the levels of whole grains that benefit from vitamin E are definitely more diverse than that. Vitamin E Antioxidant can be seen in a lot of distinctive food products within your grains family. It is usually included in plant seeds and walnuts of all kinds.

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greens also have E Vitamin. These particular veggies may incorporate kale and cabbage. Other sorts of greens also will provide Vitamin E Antioxidant. In spite of this, the levels of E Vitamin in home grown vegetables such as these will never be as stable as they possibly can be around leafy green veggies.

0
7841848bd0c27c64353c583fb7971242

(7275)

on November 04, 2012
at 02:19 PM

I've read that vitamin E isn't tracked very well in the USDA database. So many foods don't even have a value. You're probably getting more vitamin E than it says. But if you're worried, you could always had a few almonds or other nut to your diet.

As for vitamin K, a lot of leafy greens have it, but I also try to get some natto on occasion.

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