1

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E.coli outbreak in Europe

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created June 05, 2011 at 10:52 AM

A number of dead, and many more seriously ill - does this change your attitude towards vegetables

3eb3f79868b24b3df4450ea2d4f9a5d5

(2387)

on June 06, 2011
at 06:27 AM

Over here organic ("EG Öko") doesn't mean anything at all. It is the most basic of standards and just a label to sell stuff for more money. You can get all kinds of organic foods that are total crap and that are not produced in a sustainable/healthy/reasonable way. Most "Organic eggs" come from chicken farms with 18000 layers in one house. They DO have some space to run around outside, but the opening is so small they won't find it. For example. Don't get me started on the European organic standards...

3c49f67b3c8c0b580e89fdba0b95a8e8

(211)

on June 06, 2011
at 04:44 AM

It wouldn't, as far as I know. It was more in response to this comment above: Right, it's close to impossible to get E.coli from local grass-finished beef, and pastured Chickens. Buying local and organic is the safest way for sure. – Underground Nutritionist 12 hours ago

2f54dbe892ec89b12d1db686568e885a

(919)

on June 05, 2011
at 09:45 PM

washing doesn't help when the water is absorded into the vegetable

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19245)

on June 05, 2011
at 09:10 PM

What difference would being organic make? Bacteria don't care what kind of farm it is.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19245)

on June 05, 2011
at 09:08 PM

What difference would being organic make?

9f9fa49265e03ddd2bf2bba5477a556b

(3184)

on June 05, 2011
at 04:30 PM

Most E. coli survive to make it into the intestines, which is why E. coli is normal member of the human microflora. You could get this strain from anywhere. Cattle, grass feed or not, lack the receptor for the toxin produced by EHEC strains, so they can carry it asymptomatically, just like we carry our commensal E. coli strains. There's just a lot less grass fed beef on the market relative to gran fed, thus outbreaks from grass fed are going to be much fewer. But it is entirely possible to get pathogenic E. coli from pastured chickens and grass fed beef.

E7320c552ab7453d2ff45d4be79f6b50

on June 05, 2011
at 03:55 PM

Right, it's close to impossible to get E.coli from local grass-finished beef, and pastured Chickens. Buying local and organic is the safest way for sure.

D3ff004d4a0c42b67cc2c49a5ee9c0f3

(5801)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:49 AM

Washing vegetables, cooking meat, and living a healthy active lifestyle are your best defenses.

D3ff004d4a0c42b67cc2c49a5ee9c0f3

(5801)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:46 AM

What if while preparing your meat, you don't properly wash your hands...What if the butcher isn't as sanitary as you think and your grass-finished beef is cross contaminated. What if someone has fecal bacteria on their hands and you touch a door knob after them. Life is a bunch of what ifs.

2f54dbe892ec89b12d1db686568e885a

(919)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:18 AM

what if the pathogens are in the body of the vegetable (eg cucumbers) having been grown and irrigated with contaminated water.

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6 Answers

4
3eb3f79868b24b3df4450ea2d4f9a5d5

(2387)

on June 05, 2011
at 02:10 PM

I keep ignoring the outbreak. That's because I know where my vegetables, meat and eggs come from. Thus, it does not change my view on vegetables. I still buy tomatoes and eat them raw ??? I just don't like cucumbers.

I have close relatives in Hamburg, the city where the most cases have/had been reported. Of course they are concerned but they also keep eating vegetables. They, though not "paleo" at all, buy mostly organic-ish stuff from regional producers. And we keep in mind that in this case you won't drop dead just by eating contaminated food.

As I see it the main problem in this situation is that once again there's only talk about the symptoms but not the causes. The fact that the bacteria have their origin in animal concentration camps is mentioned as a side note at best but no one is interested in adressing that problem. Fact is, Germany is a grandmaster-producer of crappy meat. So bad that enthusiasts prefer to have their meat shipped around the globe from Argentina and so cheap we export our own meat products to the poorest countries in the world.

Agriculture is completely messed up here (in fact, we shouldn't call it *culture anymore). The current outbreak is just one symptom and curing it does not change anything. This "issue" only kills quick enough for the mass media to deem it worth to covering in.

2
D3ff004d4a0c42b67cc2c49a5ee9c0f3

(5801)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:07 AM

Hate to break the news to you, but E. coli (and a number of other pathogens) is just as serious with meat. Even when you buy local, it only takes one person to not wash his hands after going to the bathroom to get a variety of food born illnesses.

It does reconfirm my commitment to wash fruits and vegetables before eating them and to thoroughly cook meat.

D3ff004d4a0c42b67cc2c49a5ee9c0f3

(5801)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:49 AM

Washing vegetables, cooking meat, and living a healthy active lifestyle are your best defenses.

2f54dbe892ec89b12d1db686568e885a

(919)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:18 AM

what if the pathogens are in the body of the vegetable (eg cucumbers) having been grown and irrigated with contaminated water.

2f54dbe892ec89b12d1db686568e885a

(919)

on June 05, 2011
at 09:45 PM

washing doesn't help when the water is absorded into the vegetable

D3ff004d4a0c42b67cc2c49a5ee9c0f3

(5801)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:46 AM

What if while preparing your meat, you don't properly wash your hands...What if the butcher isn't as sanitary as you think and your grass-finished beef is cross contaminated. What if someone has fecal bacteria on their hands and you touch a door knob after them. Life is a bunch of what ifs.

1
3c49f67b3c8c0b580e89fdba0b95a8e8

on June 05, 2011
at 08:47 PM

This just in: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110605/ap_on_he_me/eu_contaminated_vegetables_europe

Seems, that it may be sprouts from and ORGANIC farm. Now what?

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19245)

on June 05, 2011
at 09:08 PM

What difference would being organic make?

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19245)

on June 05, 2011
at 09:10 PM

What difference would being organic make? Bacteria don't care what kind of farm it is.

3c49f67b3c8c0b580e89fdba0b95a8e8

(211)

on June 06, 2011
at 04:44 AM

It wouldn't, as far as I know. It was more in response to this comment above: Right, it's close to impossible to get E.coli from local grass-finished beef, and pastured Chickens. Buying local and organic is the safest way for sure. – Underground Nutritionist 12 hours ago

3eb3f79868b24b3df4450ea2d4f9a5d5

(2387)

on June 06, 2011
at 06:27 AM

Over here organic ("EG Öko") doesn't mean anything at all. It is the most basic of standards and just a label to sell stuff for more money. You can get all kinds of organic foods that are total crap and that are not produced in a sustainable/healthy/reasonable way. Most "Organic eggs" come from chicken farms with 18000 layers in one house. They DO have some space to run around outside, but the opening is so small they won't find it. For example. Don't get me started on the European organic standards...

1
637042e24e38a81dfc089ef55bed9d46

(826)

on June 05, 2011
at 03:29 PM

It's my understanding that the E.coli strains that are making people so ill are due to grain feeding ruminants, causing their digestive tract to become more acidic. The E.coli that grow and reproduce in that acidic environment can survive the acidity of the human stomach (which would kill off typical E.coli strains), thus making people who consume food contaminated with it quite ill. I try whenever possible to stick with grass-fed, pastured meat, be it chicken, beef, or bison.

E7320c552ab7453d2ff45d4be79f6b50

on June 05, 2011
at 03:55 PM

Right, it's close to impossible to get E.coli from local grass-finished beef, and pastured Chickens. Buying local and organic is the safest way for sure.

9f9fa49265e03ddd2bf2bba5477a556b

(3184)

on June 05, 2011
at 04:30 PM

Most E. coli survive to make it into the intestines, which is why E. coli is normal member of the human microflora. You could get this strain from anywhere. Cattle, grass feed or not, lack the receptor for the toxin produced by EHEC strains, so they can carry it asymptomatically, just like we carry our commensal E. coli strains. There's just a lot less grass fed beef on the market relative to gran fed, thus outbreaks from grass fed are going to be much fewer. But it is entirely possible to get pathogenic E. coli from pastured chickens and grass fed beef.

1
8b982d4beccca9fcb85affe8d4bd4ff2

(1585)

on June 05, 2011
at 11:18 AM

Well I do find it scary and being that I am from Sweden I think I will be avoiding cucumber mostly at least for a bit.

My family eats cauliflower, red bell peppers, spinach, mushrooms, broccoli more than other vegetables. I have read it's mainly cucumber that contains this particular virus strain. At least that is what they are telling us.

Escherichia coli is coming from all different things not only vegitables. It's scary stuff!

0
345c1755efe005edd162b770dc6fb821

(8767)

on June 05, 2011
at 03:50 PM

just confirms that I will continue to clean and decontaminate my fruits, veggies!

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