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How would you contradict this high fiber low fat diet guru?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created July 23, 2012 at 6:26 PM

I watched this video from a vegan doctor who claims that obesity in US stems from a low fiber high fat diet, abundance of processed foods that are high in calories.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAdqLB6bTuQ&feature=g-vrec

Here is a movie "Forks over Knives" that he endorses:

http://www.movie2k.to/movie-950706-Forks+Over+Knives.html

I know he is wrong about being a vegan, but I am not so sure if he is wrong about eating high-fiber foods first. Somehow his logic seems off/skewed. But I cannot pinpoint exactly where he goes wrong.

The videos are a bit lengthy, but I am really interested in hearing your response to his high-fiber vs processed foods claim if you are willing to listen to it.

54f75fb54778cfa947990bec1175307a

(665)

on July 24, 2012
at 03:43 AM

Great article! Very smart and funny. Denise Minger is amazing.

0faecc3397025eab246241f4dcd81f5e

(2361)

on July 23, 2012
at 11:29 PM

I do on the other hand eat a high vegetable diet with lots of fibre. I actually think this is healthy, unless of course you have an adverse reaction like you. Fibre is pre-biotic and filling, and for most of my clients it does make a difference to satiety adding a lot of starch and non starch veg

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 23, 2012
at 10:40 PM

@Karen....that was my point. LC can make it easier to have the right calorie intake without all the calculating and cravings.

0faecc3397025eab246241f4dcd81f5e

(2361)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:52 PM

He feeds his cat vegan food, says it all really. Poor kitty. Cats are obligate carnivores, and thrive on whole small animals. They don't get overweight on that diet either.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:36 PM

In other words, by eating LC, we can actually stay comfortably in the right calorie range, often without even thinking about it.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:35 PM

In my experience a very small percentage of LC people believe that. Many of us have found though that the satiation of LC keeps us satisfied and without cravings much longer. LC is also ideal for those of us with insulin resistance.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:31 PM

I wonder which part of obligate carnivore he doesn't get.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 23, 2012
at 09:03 PM

Not sure why you were downvoted, so I put you back to zero. you are correct on an isocaloric diet, but I feel that lowering your carbs and changing your macronutrient ratios makes it easier to be in a calorie deficit for weight loss. I am a moderate carb person though.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 23, 2012
at 08:34 PM

Um, that's a really big "except." Starving pets is wrong and doing it under the guise of morality or health is stupid and also wrong.

3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on July 23, 2012
at 08:00 PM

I might be able to find a few: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12077732 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21978979 ; http://www.ajcn.org/content/early/2010/08/04/ajcn.2009.29146.abstract ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12761364 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12761365 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15632335 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17341711 ;

3a9d5dde5212ccd34b860bb6ed07bbef

(1782)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:47 PM

Could you show the data that says "fats without excess carbs" are not correlated with weight gain? Also, carbs without excess fat are correlated with weight loss. The key word is excess in both statements.

Ef9f83cb4e1826261a44c173f733789e

(13635)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:45 PM

Honesty, if it were practical to do that I would give it a shot.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:38 PM

I just found the cure to obesity epidemic! IV feeding tubes for all! Problem solved!

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:15 PM

The video is not about how good it is to be a vegan. The video explains the mechanics of why people get obese. It is quite interesting and the doctor is not an idiot (except for feeding his cat a vegan diet). His theory on fat receptors is different.

0a9ad4e577fe24a6b8aafa1dd7a50c79

(5150)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:05 PM

This, except I'm WAY more bitter and mean about the whole situation and my mentality on vegans is: "Muhaha, it'll be so funny when your diet starts to kill you."

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7 Answers

4
C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 23, 2012
at 07:48 PM

The principle of eating processed foods that are high fat will make most people fat. But we are not comparing apples to apples, we are comparing grass-fed ribeye to twinkies. Also most Americans would see some benefit from getting more vegetable fiber in their diet. Once again we are looking at a SAD standard American diet of overly processed junk, where eating more fiber will probably help. But so would eating more unprocessed, humanly raised natural meats. He has some valid points, but PUFA's and transfats are not comparable to natural healthy animal fats.

3
3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:05 PM

I'd agree that process foods and that "gaming" the system with scientific derived fats (like trans fats and PUFA) are making us fat.

Naturally occurring fats, when consumed without excessive carbs, does not seem to have a correlation with weight gains in healthy adults.

Why try to argue past that? We are in agreement in principal as to the cause, we differ as to the solution and there is no evidence that supports either conclusively.

3a9d5dde5212ccd34b860bb6ed07bbef

(1782)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:47 PM

Could you show the data that says "fats without excess carbs" are not correlated with weight gain? Also, carbs without excess fat are correlated with weight loss. The key word is excess in both statements.

3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on July 23, 2012
at 08:00 PM

I might be able to find a few: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12077732 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21978979 ; http://www.ajcn.org/content/early/2010/08/04/ajcn.2009.29146.abstract ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12761364 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12761365 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15632335 ; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17341711 ;

2
41dfb1a4fecb38d24075ff52f13ccb28

on July 23, 2012
at 08:03 PM

High fiber, low fat diets make me sick, swollen, in pain and gaining a massive amount of weight. I know when my intestines are being shredded and what it feels like to have my stomach so swollen I can't sit up straight. (Literally.)

I've been looking at some recommended menus from McDougall and the like (the guy from the video being listed as staff there), and if I ate like that, I would be in a crazy amount of pain by the end of the week. I'm not even kidding. I would be so swollen, I'd waddle instead of walk.

He can say whatever he likes, but I've lived through it and I'm sure as hell not doing it again. So his arguments fall on deaf ears over here.

0faecc3397025eab246241f4dcd81f5e

(2361)

on July 23, 2012
at 11:29 PM

I do on the other hand eat a high vegetable diet with lots of fibre. I actually think this is healthy, unless of course you have an adverse reaction like you. Fibre is pre-biotic and filling, and for most of my clients it does make a difference to satiety adding a lot of starch and non starch veg

2
B8592e62f9804ddabae73c1103d6bcb9

(1956)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:40 PM

Forks over Knives is a vegan propaganda film not based on real science: http://rawfoodsos.com/2011/09/22/forks-over-knives-is-the-science-legit-a-review-and-critique/

54f75fb54778cfa947990bec1175307a

(665)

on July 24, 2012
at 03:43 AM

Great article! Very smart and funny. Denise Minger is amazing.

2
Cf416725f639ffd1bb90764792ce7b8a

(2799)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:01 PM

I've given up on arguing with idiots. Life is too short.

0a9ad4e577fe24a6b8aafa1dd7a50c79

(5150)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:05 PM

This, except I'm WAY more bitter and mean about the whole situation and my mentality on vegans is: "Muhaha, it'll be so funny when your diet starts to kill you."

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 23, 2012
at 08:34 PM

Um, that's a really big "except." Starving pets is wrong and doing it under the guise of morality or health is stupid and also wrong.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:15 PM

The video is not about how good it is to be a vegan. The video explains the mechanics of why people get obese. It is quite interesting and the doctor is not an idiot (except for feeding his cat a vegan diet). His theory on fat receptors is different.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:31 PM

I wonder which part of obligate carnivore he doesn't get.

1
Ef9f83cb4e1826261a44c173f733789e

on July 23, 2012
at 07:16 PM

I have not watched the entire video yet, so take this for what it's worth. My experiences described here tell me there is more to being satiated than just having a full belly.

I was once fed intravenously for about a week while in the hospital. Even though my stomach was empty that whole time, I was never hungry and had no desire to eat. I was being satisfied by whatever was in the IV concoction.

A good broth, or just a little cream in my coffee, can also curb my hunger without adding bulk to my stomach.

I will feel full and satisfied (and later gassy) after eating lots of raw fibrous veggies, but my huger returns once everything settles and will want to eat more.

This is all anecdotal experiences, but I'm sure others can testify to the same.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:38 PM

I just found the cure to obesity epidemic! IV feeding tubes for all! Problem solved!

Ef9f83cb4e1826261a44c173f733789e

(13635)

on July 23, 2012
at 07:45 PM

Honesty, if it were practical to do that I would give it a shot.

-1
1c67bc28f4e44bbb8770b86df0463df3

on July 23, 2012
at 08:32 PM

Kinda how low-carbers flatly refuse to believe that low-carb diets offer no isocaloric fat loss advantage, despite over eight decades of metabolic ward trials showing exactly that. And kinda like how vegans militantly insist that their diets are in true peaceful harmony with nature despite the fact that these diets have repeatedly been shown to be sadly deficient in several critical nutrients and tend to render vegans a pack of emaciated, anaemic, sociopathic nutters who catch a cold when someone in another country sneezes and go ballistic and rabidly hurl unwashed manure-stained zucchinis (gotta get that B12 from somewhere, I guess) at their computer when someone dares criticize their illogical beliefs. Because when you belong to a religion or cult, it???s your job to be a conforming ** and abide by the dogma of that group no matter how much it flies in the face of scientific reality.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 23, 2012
at 09:03 PM

Not sure why you were downvoted, so I put you back to zero. you are correct on an isocaloric diet, but I feel that lowering your carbs and changing your macronutrient ratios makes it easier to be in a calorie deficit for weight loss. I am a moderate carb person though.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:36 PM

In other words, by eating LC, we can actually stay comfortably in the right calorie range, often without even thinking about it.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 23, 2012
at 10:40 PM

@Karen....that was my point. LC can make it easier to have the right calorie intake without all the calculating and cravings.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 23, 2012
at 09:35 PM

In my experience a very small percentage of LC people believe that. Many of us have found though that the satiation of LC keeps us satisfied and without cravings much longer. LC is also ideal for those of us with insulin resistance.

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