10

votes

Hack Jimmy Moore's Safe-Starch/Sweet Potato N=1 Experiment!

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created April 16, 2012 at 2:10 AM

Jimmy Moore just posted his blood sugar results from a week of introducing sweet potato into his diet: http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/jimmy-moores-n1-experiments-safe-starch-sweet-potato/13976

What are your thoughts on his methodology and results?

Dba4686e589eb5ce6bb2d69a9a0036c7

on August 17, 2013
at 01:52 AM

Anthony Colpo has already thoroughly debunked the whole 'metabolic advantage' notion.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on November 03, 2012
at 04:27 AM

Food addiction, and addiction in general, is a hormonal/compulsive issue. In other words, he needs to avoid or extinguish triggers, and that will help. However, therapy is unlikely to do much.

Ddfdaa75ac9f47e01fc71162dd0d38dc

on May 15, 2012
at 03:27 PM

Stop dieting? Jimmy's gaining - he needs to diet more. And accept his illness - he legitimately needs metformin. It's that simple. If you're as sick as Jimmy, diet isn't enough.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on May 15, 2012
at 01:14 PM

Vivian, two years ago several of us tried to advise Jimmy to do just that: stop dieting for weight loss. He was in the 265-275 range at the time. He eventually did stop dieting for weight loss sometime around March of last year and has been piling on the pounds ever since. He's gained 55 lbs since. His n=1 show that despite all the abuse, his organs are functioning pretty darned well though I suspect his liver is quite fatty at the moment.

C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on May 15, 2012
at 11:34 AM

Hey - no worries!

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 20, 2012
at 03:49 AM

Exactly. Jimmy's problems are more emotional/psychological than anything else. Food addiction indeed, Namby... Anyone expecting him to seriously alter his paradigm has a long wait. Until that cold day in Hell - http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/my-latest-light-bulb-moment-that-has-changed-my-diet-and-life-forever/8036 Rinse, repeat, etc....

Ef26f888ed248de197c37a4cb04ef4a7

(584)

on April 19, 2012
at 01:35 AM

Also, has he considered it a failure and decided against consuming starch or is he going to keep adding potatoes until his body adjusts? I know it took me about 3 weeks to adjust from adding starch and I was only VLC for about 10 months.

Ef26f888ed248de197c37a4cb04ef4a7

(584)

on April 19, 2012
at 01:07 AM

It's like he just doesn't see butter for the high calorie condiment that it is. All these years of interviewing these low carb 'gurus' has left him believing calories are irrelevant. A few heaped spoons of butter provides about the same calories nearly a pound of potatoes. Instead of recklessly drowning his food in butter to make it palatable a glob of cottage cheese could probably do the trick. You don't need up to 70% of your meal calories coming from fat to experience the satiety effects or to somewhat blunt the blood sugar response.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on April 18, 2012
at 03:39 PM

@NambyPamby, perhaps, but MY point is that he's still eating SAD-replicating meals. If I did that I would've regained all my lost weight already. I'm not eating that way--I'm actually following the radical "eat plain, whole foods" concept--and my results are diametrically opposed to his. So, either he should admit he's okay with the status quo or he should stop expecting to get different results while basically doing the same things. (stepping off soapbox)

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on April 18, 2012
at 02:51 PM

Well, that's my point. If you suffer from food addiction to the extent Jimmy does, you'll have a real problem integrating safe starches to your diet. A combination of palatability and insulin-driven hunger will make you eating all day -- trust me, yams and sweet potatoes can become palatable enough to be addictive, when combined with the insulin load. I reached my upper limit with safe starches and Jimmy already has.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 18, 2012
at 01:37 PM

Bensix, I think I owe you an apology. I was extremely grumpy the other day; the constant bagging on JM (and other "big losers" who didn't arrive at golden god physiques after years of effort) gets under my skin, and I over-interpreted, and over-reacted to, your comment. My apologies to you.

C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on April 18, 2012
at 07:06 AM

Well done Nance. Namby, Jimmy is such a victim!! he lost weight previously on low fat and can do it again if he gets real.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on April 18, 2012
at 01:32 AM

@NambyPamby, sadly that's a "sort of." I routinely drank a 2-liter or more of Coke per day and on many occasions I ate until I couldn't physically swallow because my esophagus was full of food. Not good times. My first down in the cycle of yo-yos was only 50 lbs but each peak was higher and if I reach my desired weight later this year I will have dropped an estimated 80-90 pounds. I've already lost more than 6" from my waist, yet I am still obese and it will take about another 4-5" to approach a good permanent size. Maybe more. I'm currently resting but will begin my final campaign in 2 weeks.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:46 PM

That is completely ridiculous! Has this man no sense of cause and effect?! Did he really think spinach would confound this experiment but the honey would not? Jimmy's cognitive dissonance and mental Olympics rivals that of hard-core vegans.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on April 17, 2012
at 10:39 PM

Yeah, Nance, but were you ever morbidly obese like Jimmy? We're not talking about a run of the mill obese person here but an outlier even among obese people. Jimmy used to drink 16 cans of cola daily. I don't think you did that.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 17, 2012
at 08:38 PM

That was my thought on his safe-starch "debate" too. It sounds more like a stacked pseudo-scientific lynch-mob/witch-hunt. I would feel sorry for Paul, but a debate is not a popularity contest and it gives him the opportunity to finally put this dogma to rest. It is deeply concerning that anyone new to paleo has to wade through this simplistic Taubesian garbage that promotes eating disorders just as much as mainstream nutritionism. Jimmy continually downplays the advice of the only experts on show worth their weight in salt and quickly replaces them with denialist quacks that fit his paradigm.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 17, 2012
at 06:33 PM

cont... blood sugar effect. A lot of people drop weight, break plateaus etc... simply by dropping them. This includes semi-pro bodybuilders trying to get down to 4% BF.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 17, 2012
at 06:31 PM

Firestorm - I don't get why people are so defensive. If you are getting healthy and losing weight steadily then you are golden, you are a non-responder. Kudos. Jimmy is fat, is getting fatter instead of slimmer and has massive blood sugar issues. There is a difference. Also my question to anyone skinny or fat is "Why?" Why artificial sweetner? Are you addicted to the taste? Do you really love coffee if you have to sweeten it? What is wrong with your food that it has to be bigger/better/faster. My thought/challenge is for people to dump sweetners ESPECIALLY if it has nobloodsugar cont

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 05:56 PM

I agree with Ben -- saying calories count is not jumping on the bandwagon of a few bloggers who have come VERY late to the party with that realization. I'm happy Nickoley had seen the light, but he's about the last person, hardly the first, to make the case that calories ultimately count.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on April 17, 2012
at 03:48 PM

Likeslardinmayo -- I am an obese 49 year old woman. I just finished an N=1 with stevia, with no impact on blood glucose levels over 14 days. This was particularly interesting to me because while Stevia has NO impact on my blood glucose levels, other artificial sweeteners have, including sugar alcohols (which are rife in 'low carb' snack foods that I no longer eat!).

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:47 PM

Paul Jaminet of Perfect Health Diet originally had offered to help him perform the experiment properly.

E34fbfa1bca9ae970c9c7313bf9de9f8

(1436)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:02 PM

I think he's just deranged. Deranged in thinking that calories don't count. Deranged in thinking eating sweet potato + honey + gobs of fat is an accurate way to "test safe starches". Deranged in thinking that spinach is a confounder. Deranged in thinking that cardiovascular exercise is harmful. He doesn't need to change his diet as much as he needs to change his thinking.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:15 PM

Jimmy's still popular enough to have a comment count over 100 while undoubtedly screening out all but the most innocuous dissent. He's been at that for a while now so many don't bother trying anymore. But unfortunately newbies are bound to land on his blog and reading comments -- especially by "experts" -- presents a very skewed version of the state of carbs in nutrition. That he'll be moderating the safe starches debate at AHS12 is a total joke. Not to mention the makeup of the panel is 2.5:1 against Paul -- the 0.5 is Quiltie

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:10 PM

Actually, given as he didn't even adapt to the dietary change before testing, Jimmy's results -- as they always seem to -- indicate he's not intolerant to carbs. He has gained 20+ pounds now in 2012 eating his paleo high fat mod protein low carb diet.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:08 PM

I've actually seen that term used in peer review studies. Derangement is real -- out of whack lipids, glucose, etc., inappropriate response to dietary intake. In the case of most obese, it's the obesity/caloric surplus that causes the derangement not the other way around. Jimmy is trying to excuse his weight with a "damaged metabolism" -- that somehow he did too much damage shoving boxes of Little Debbies down his throat in his 20's. But if his metabolism was damaged, how did he lose 170+ pounds not once, but twice after all the damage?? That's a "gotcha" right there.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:04 PM

Even when Jimmy did his eggfast, it should probably have been called a butter fast as his calories from butter were higher percentage than from the eggs. I also remember when he added some veggies back in to the beef/CO diet it was mashed cauli with butter. I asked and it was like 1/4c cauli with 2T butter. Ummm ... and it's the veggies that are stalling losses/causing gain?? Same can be seen in his pics of salads in bygone years -- swimming in Ranch is his usual preference.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:58 AM

@Namby, please don't say that we're parroting somone's new observation that calories count. That fact has been around for some time, I'm betting anyone on the street would tell you that. And even here on paleohacks some of us have been quietly reminding everyone that calories always have and always will count. This is totally unrelated to paleo. Paleo is still great - making good food choices is wise and avoiding grains legumes and dairy make many feel better. That is unrelated to the fact that the amount of food you eat will have bearing on the weight you weigh.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 11:57 AM

The most excellent point made here is the length of the experiment. Of course it must be done properly too, but our enzymes and hormone production are entrained to our usual diet. Most well-designed clinical trials will have at least 1 week, usually two weeks lead-in weight stable "standardized diet" or acclimating to the new regime before testing. This is a large meal calorie-wise. If there's one thing the metabolically deranged ought to avoid it's a large meal and dietary fat bolus!

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 11:23 AM

@Namby: Jimmy is 6'3" and had a 42" waist when he was at his "goal" weight of 230 lbs. He's clearly not "getting away with" consuming 3000 cals/day (or more). I think he's around 285 in this picture from two years ago: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_er_Nmxnv4TM/S6oz5HigDsI/AAAAAAAAAZ8/7fL2f80N0Hs/s320/big+jimmy.jpg You're right that food reward and carb/insulin aren't mutually exclusive. That's how Taubes tries to divert attention away from any destruction of his hypothesis. If you really have a 300-500 cal/day metabolic advantage I'd look into it. Might not be desireable to be that ineffeci

C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:17 AM

* making fun of

C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:16 AM

No, I wasn't making of Moore's predicament. (I've got a lot of sympathy for him on the front.) But I am making light of, thus to shed light on, his methods. If you want to test the effects of a particular food you eat that particular food. And, besides, sweet potatoes don't need sweetening. I'm not even low carb and they taste like dessert in tuber form.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 11:02 AM

@PrimalDanny: Whenever I read advice for adding starches to one's low carb diet, I see the caution to cut back on the fat. I'm not sure who these "paleo experts" are he consulted, but I'm quite the suggestion to eat with protein and fat was not intended to mean two greezy brats or a chicken breast smothered in cheese and then 1/3 stick of butter on top of that.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 10:57 AM

Also, Jimmy's n=1 from last summer show that his fasting glucose has been going up for a while. It's likely from chronic caloric surplus as he's been gaining weight pretty steadily since the 2011 LC cruise. Now Jimmy has been LLVLC for 8 years now and his fasting glucose is on the rise. Another long term low carber had the same thing happen requiring metformin and Victoza after 15 years of eating VLC. Does anyone seriously think carbohydrates are causing this? Common sense says, as has been demonstrated in clinical trials, the high fat diet might just have something to do with it.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 10:49 AM

@Rose: Based on his past reports of having fatty stools when he loses weight rapidly, it's a fair bet that Jimmy has a fatty liver. Whether or not he does, the elevated FBG has little to do with carb consumption it is a symptom of hepatic insulin resistance. I don't know what's up with the potato only results other than to say perhaps his body has no clue what to do with a normal amount of food ;) What his experiments show is that Jimmy's glucose tolerance is just fine. Bottom line: if you're testing starches, eat starches, not with a fatty meal adding over a third stick of butter!!

D12142c8cafb16d9af10b3362cb8fb62

(1590)

on April 17, 2012
at 07:11 AM

Define the biological meaning of 'metabolically deranged'.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 17, 2012
at 06:46 AM

I know skinny people don't buy food reward but there is also the point that this man is eating yams and has to have extra sugar! I find yams and berries incredibly sweet and prefer 90% dark chocolate. He eats quest bars and has to add sweetner to something incredibly sweet. His taste bust are screwed and if you think it's anything but the Stevia you are cracked.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on April 17, 2012
at 03:57 AM

You will not believe how fast some people will get on the new bandwagon. Now the hottest thang is to parrot Richard Nikolei's new observation: "calories in/calories out" is NOW IN! Look, I've tracked my calorie consumption very carefully during my ketognic days and I calculated a "metabolic advantage" of around 300-500 cals when doing low carb. That range increases the lower your carb consumption is - just look at T1 diabetics who don't secrete much insulin. Food reward and carb/insulin theory of obesity aren't mutually exclusive, like many of you think. The two actually overlap.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on April 17, 2012
at 03:45 AM

What makes you think 2500 is too much for Jimmy? He's 6-5/300 lbs. He can get away with consuming 3000. Some of the people here have become such experts on Jimmy. Also, Jimmy is not diabetic and from his BG readings, I see no evidence that he's even prediabetic. His A1c is probably below 5.5 and his fasting levels at 85-95 is very normal for someone who's eating low carb until recently. Some elevated readings he attributes may be entirely due to lack of sleep or stress, which he's getting plenty.

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 17, 2012
at 03:11 AM

Sweet potatoes require stevia to 'bring out the flavor'? Huh? And I thought low carbers were supposed to be beyond all this fixation on sweet.

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 17, 2012
at 03:09 AM

But that's exactly the problem, Sue - he doesn't think calories matter for weight loss. It all comes back to Taubes and the CIH. What I wonder is how close he'll have to get to his original weight before finally ditching this ill-advised hypothesis. The whole endeavor is anti-science in the extreme - i.e., forging ahead stubbornly in the face of all empirical evidence to the contrary. Jimmy Moore's 'low carb paleo' is clearly (in Kurt Harris' words) the Deepak Chopra wing of the movement. And this guy still matters? Go figure.

Fb677d93955eb0fac597e3d94db92980

(1115)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:41 AM

But but but butter is low carb! Heh.

Fb677d93955eb0fac597e3d94db92980

(1115)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:40 AM

Lol... I wonder what flavor stevia brings out. It must be that just-dug-out-of-the-ground-doused-with-sugar-and-drowned-in-butter flavor that I'm missing out on. Ditto on the delusions.

C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:20 AM

With the amount of butter he has literally added another meal of 405 calories (presuming tablespoons are 15mL).

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:06 AM

Thanks, yeah, I see that, and if I were his adviser I'd say drop the honey and stevia. But I'd also say drop the sweet potato; all three of those things together would be the fruity pebbles, if it were my analogy, lol. Is the meat supposed to == the sweet potato here? On what known basis? Feh. Strange neo-Paleo world.

85178e006119b00322a2401c494dd3a4

(644)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:57 AM

I'm pretty sure bensix is mocking the adding of honey and stevia to the sweet potato, not the concern about the blood glucose.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:38 AM

This is special: mocking a 300-pound, formerly 400-pound man with a long history of metabolic syndrome for worrying about his blood glucose. I'm beginning to understand the contempt some people express for this place.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:13 AM

Just so I'm understanding the contention here, are you saying that it's the butter that raised his BG? Forget about the two pound "gain" -- I can "gain" and "lose" that much on a rainy day -- I mean the BG spikes, and elevated morning BG. Y'all are saying that's due to the butter?

Aebee51dc2b93b209980a89fa4a70c1e

(1982)

on April 16, 2012
at 10:59 PM

http://www.marksdailyapple.com/artificial-sweeteners-insulin/#axzz1sFNjAHK1

742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on April 16, 2012
at 10:31 PM

Do you want some sweet potato with your butter??

742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on April 16, 2012
at 10:27 PM

Amen. It irks me too see people adding tablespoons of honey and sugar to sweet potatos. Shit, I find a regular sweet potato too sweet.

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41757)

on April 16, 2012
at 09:47 PM

What's the big deal with Jimmy Moore anyway? *doesn't get it*

2fd566cefde2de38e75e1bc13a966e16

(662)

on April 16, 2012
at 08:17 PM

I should also add I completely agree that his food quality choices are extremely suspect.

2fd566cefde2de38e75e1bc13a966e16

(662)

on April 16, 2012
at 08:16 PM

I'm a bit confused--is he only eating one meal per day? I'd guess those two bratwursts are max 8 oz of meat so an extremely liberal estimate for that meal is ~1500 calories. Or am I just not reading carefully and he's eating a similar amount for multiple meals per day?

5fb654380d04ac372b750ca3faad2e99

(277)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:39 PM

I commented using my Disqus login pointing a link to this thread and it was approved just fine.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:27 PM

I had a similar experience with his Calories 101 show: http://tinyurl.com/7xjjnz4 I asked if protein restriction for longevity was legit and about the paradoxes of the CIH such as fruitarians/Kitavans and healthy people experiencing side-effects on LC. His response: "Can you stick to the topic of calories with your questions? These are great questions, but not on the subject we're discussing with Mat this week." Last time I checked protein and carbs were both calories! Fortunately Mat answered both of these questions (quite eloquently) yet Jimmy seems to ignore the implications.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:01 PM

http://psycnet.apa.org/?fa=main.doiLanding&doi=10.1037/0735-7044.122.1.161 -- This is 100% in line with my N=1 one experience.

16e617676c5ac710e5235e0b773edc0b

(2640)

on April 16, 2012
at 05:38 PM

I upvoted and agree with most of your points but the jury is still out on the stevia and insulin connection according to Mark's Daily Apple: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/stevia/#axzz1sE4VvpSc

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 16, 2012
at 03:41 PM

Cory - You are also like 8% bf and what 27? This is an obese, 40-something... Consider that their is a difference. Also, Stevia has been shown to increase insulin just via taste. It's touted as "lowering blood sugar" which isn't a great thing for a guy who has hypoglycemia and problems with cravings.

9b0a4701e373d4dd13831cfb9b13f42d

(1677)

on April 16, 2012
at 03:08 PM

Stevia has almost no effect on my blood glucose levels according to my glucometer.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:44 PM

violet, very good point. His wording throughout, and the set-up of the project do all point to "set up to fail."

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:43 PM

the man should simply eat *more* balanced and measure his portions for a month or so. Not the balanced eating most refer to but rather simply a bit less fat, a bit more starch, less processed food, etc. Simple, whole foods. Measure it all if you are really aiming to "test" something. Give a month or two and stick to it 100% - only way to get results that matter.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:40 PM

lardinmayo, great points across the board. I totally agree. Everything he ate in those pics are what I would call Processed Food. How about a plain piece of cooked meat with salt and pepper/spices, a whole baked sweet potato and a drizzle of coconut oil or something? Less fat, measure the starch, whole unprocessed food.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:38 PM

i agree - honey on sweet potatoes!? What do you think your BS is going to do?

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:38 PM

wowza, I agree that he prolly takes in more calories than either he needs or thinks. I think he's under the belief that calories don't matter.

Ccacf7567273244733bc991af4ac42ed

(5198)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:28 PM

Though arguably ad libitum *anything* probably won't work for him right now. Anyway isn't the point that some people give the impression (and they do) that fat loss will start flowing just by adding a few forkfuls of potato to your low-carb diet? Whichever way you go it's always more complicated in practise.

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc

(14952)

on April 16, 2012
at 11:54 AM

Totally agree. It's almost as if he was trying to make it a horrible experiment.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 09:46 AM

Ya think Violet? ;-) At least this time he didn't just add buttered bread and sweet potato fries at random.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 09:45 AM

I think Jimmy mentioned he has high iron so his world renowned doctor has him cutting back on the red meat.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 09:43 AM

Rose, the point wasn't weight loss with high fat, it was that if he's testing safe starches, 1/2 a potato drowned in 3T butter doesn't cut it. Also, in case you missed it, he's now over 300 lbs so he's added about 15-20 lbs since going paleo baayyybeeee. Clearly ad libitum VLC is not working for Jimmy and hasn't been for years now.

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 16, 2012
at 07:10 AM

Not to get all Occam's Razor here, but those pictures say it all: TWO grease-laden bratwurst, 3T of butter, in excess (probably) of 2,000 calories a day, and the most stunningly obvious conclusion continually evades Mr. Moore. To wit: too much eating and not enough moving!

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:32 AM

But then he'd have to stop eating Quest Bars!

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:29 AM

VLC has seemed to stop working for Jimmy (which is the whole point of the n=1) and his attempt at safe starches was half-assed at best when 50g is recommended as the minimum. Mileage does indeed vary.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:12 AM

By the way he set it up it seems like he wanted it to fail and he was surprised when it didn't. He's had experts on his show tell him that people on long term VLC diets have adaptive insulin resistance so he starts out his "safe-starches" experiment by adding 17g of sugar from honey to the 18.5g from the sweet potato?! Maybe it's been too long since he's seen apples and oranges. Notice by the end his morning blood sugar is back to where it was when he started; I'd call that a success.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:11 AM

That was my first thought too, a whole tablespoon of honey on ~3oz of *sweet* potato?! Really? That would be too sweet for me and I'm not even diabetic. It makes me wonder what he's still eating that gives him such a sweet tooth.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 16, 2012
at 04:52 AM

There are those of us who lost substantial amounts of weight eating high fat. For me, the joke is the sweet potato. Mileage varies.

Bb1ba0d71083ceaecd3a3b405a977454

(891)

on April 16, 2012
at 03:45 AM

I had half a sweet potato tonight and maybe had 3/4 to 1 tbsp coconut oil on it and my green beans and bok choi. 3 tbsp does seem like a bit much, for me anyway.

6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on April 16, 2012
at 02:45 AM

Too right wowza.

6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on April 16, 2012
at 02:44 AM

I hate his blog layout so much. It looks terrible.

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on April 16, 2012
at 02:41 AM

I can perfectly believe that some guys can eat sweet potatoes with honey butter, no problem. Jimmy absolutely cannot, and he should know that already. I luv da guy, and he needs to act on his knowledge - he says he knows he's broken, but doesn't take any action to remedy. He's gotta do what he knows he should and end his denial.

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on April 16, 2012
at 02:35 AM

Jimmy needs to accept that he is on the verge of T2D, with severe metabolic syndrome. He's in a different world and can't eat like "unbroken" people. Ever.Again. Jimmy also needs to count calories. He seems to eat about 2500 a day, which is clearly too much for him. He should try dropping to 2200, then to 2000. He needs to skip the sausages & cheeses and eat unprocessed meats. He needs to watch his morning fasting glucose. It should be <86 but he's lucky if it's <99. This should be a huge warning to him. He needs to get this issue under control first, like yesterday. Then worry about the rest!

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16 Answers

20
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 16, 2012
at 05:40 AM

Firstly I want a 30 day trial. It takes time to adapt to any diet.

Secondly, I want to see him drastically reduce his fat if he's gonna eat starchy.

Thirdly, I want some green veggies on the plate too though not a lot.

Fourthly, I want real meat, preferably slow cooked so it's low in AGEs

Fifthly, I want 0 proccessed food for that 30 days. None. No cheats, no stevia. No crap.

Sixthly, I want him sleeping 8hrs a night

Artificial sweeteners mess up your mess up insulin levels. AGEs mess up insulin sensitivity. Poor sleep messes up inslin sensitivity.

If you are gonna blow a huge wad on grass-finished beef why not offset the cost by not buying crap?

Aebee51dc2b93b209980a89fa4a70c1e

(1982)

on April 16, 2012
at 10:59 PM

http://www.marksdailyapple.com/artificial-sweeteners-insulin/#axzz1sFNjAHK1

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 17, 2012
at 06:31 PM

Firestorm - I don't get why people are so defensive. If you are getting healthy and losing weight steadily then you are golden, you are a non-responder. Kudos. Jimmy is fat, is getting fatter instead of slimmer and has massive blood sugar issues. There is a difference. Also my question to anyone skinny or fat is "Why?" Why artificial sweetner? Are you addicted to the taste? Do you really love coffee if you have to sweeten it? What is wrong with your food that it has to be bigger/better/faster. My thought/challenge is for people to dump sweetners ESPECIALLY if it has nobloodsugar cont

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 09:45 AM

I think Jimmy mentioned he has high iron so his world renowned doctor has him cutting back on the red meat.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:32 AM

But then he'd have to stop eating Quest Bars!

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc

(14952)

on April 16, 2012
at 11:54 AM

Totally agree. It's almost as if he was trying to make it a horrible experiment.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:01 PM

http://psycnet.apa.org/?fa=main.doiLanding&doi=10.1037/0735-7044.122.1.161 -- This is 100% in line with my N=1 one experience.

16e617676c5ac710e5235e0b773edc0b

(2640)

on April 16, 2012
at 05:38 PM

I upvoted and agree with most of your points but the jury is still out on the stevia and insulin connection according to Mark's Daily Apple: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/stevia/#axzz1sE4VvpSc

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 11:57 AM

The most excellent point made here is the length of the experiment. Of course it must be done properly too, but our enzymes and hormone production are entrained to our usual diet. Most well-designed clinical trials will have at least 1 week, usually two weeks lead-in weight stable "standardized diet" or acclimating to the new regime before testing. This is a large meal calorie-wise. If there's one thing the metabolically deranged ought to avoid it's a large meal and dietary fat bolus!

9b0a4701e373d4dd13831cfb9b13f42d

(1677)

on April 16, 2012
at 03:08 PM

Stevia has almost no effect on my blood glucose levels according to my glucometer.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:40 PM

lardinmayo, great points across the board. I totally agree. Everything he ate in those pics are what I would call Processed Food. How about a plain piece of cooked meat with salt and pepper/spices, a whole baked sweet potato and a drizzle of coconut oil or something? Less fat, measure the starch, whole unprocessed food.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 16, 2012
at 03:41 PM

Cory - You are also like 8% bf and what 27? This is an obese, 40-something... Consider that their is a difference. Also, Stevia has been shown to increase insulin just via taste. It's touted as "lowering blood sugar" which isn't a great thing for a guy who has hypoglycemia and problems with cravings.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 17, 2012
at 06:46 AM

I know skinny people don't buy food reward but there is also the point that this man is eating yams and has to have extra sugar! I find yams and berries incredibly sweet and prefer 90% dark chocolate. He eats quest bars and has to add sweetner to something incredibly sweet. His taste bust are screwed and if you think it's anything but the Stevia you are cracked.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on April 17, 2012
at 06:33 PM

cont... blood sugar effect. A lot of people drop weight, break plateaus etc... simply by dropping them. This includes semi-pro bodybuilders trying to get down to 4% BF.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on April 17, 2012
at 03:48 PM

Likeslardinmayo -- I am an obese 49 year old woman. I just finished an N=1 with stevia, with no impact on blood glucose levels over 14 days. This was particularly interesting to me because while Stevia has NO impact on my blood glucose levels, other artificial sweeteners have, including sugar alcohols (which are rife in 'low carb' snack foods that I no longer eat!).

14
C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on April 16, 2012
at 07:35 PM

Coincidentally I've just carried out an N=1 experiment to test the effects of prime rib on my blood sugar levels. After consuming 2 ribs w/ 1 tbsp of butter and 50g of fruity pebbles I was shocked to see my blood sugars rise. It seems meat is terrible for my metabolism...

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:38 AM

This is special: mocking a 300-pound, formerly 400-pound man with a long history of metabolic syndrome for worrying about his blood glucose. I'm beginning to understand the contempt some people express for this place.

C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:16 AM

No, I wasn't making of Moore's predicament. (I've got a lot of sympathy for him on the front.) But I am making light of, thus to shed light on, his methods. If you want to test the effects of a particular food you eat that particular food. And, besides, sweet potatoes don't need sweetening. I'm not even low carb and they taste like dessert in tuber form.

85178e006119b00322a2401c494dd3a4

(644)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:57 AM

I'm pretty sure bensix is mocking the adding of honey and stevia to the sweet potato, not the concern about the blood glucose.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:06 AM

Thanks, yeah, I see that, and if I were his adviser I'd say drop the honey and stevia. But I'd also say drop the sweet potato; all three of those things together would be the fruity pebbles, if it were my analogy, lol. Is the meat supposed to == the sweet potato here? On what known basis? Feh. Strange neo-Paleo world.

C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:17 AM

* making fun of

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 18, 2012
at 01:37 PM

Bensix, I think I owe you an apology. I was extremely grumpy the other day; the constant bagging on JM (and other "big losers" who didn't arrive at golden god physiques after years of effort) gets under my skin, and I over-interpreted, and over-reacted to, your comment. My apologies to you.

C98a4de749025bb18463c1fda764e81c

(148)

on May 15, 2012
at 11:34 AM

Hey - no worries!

12
Fb677d93955eb0fac597e3d94db92980

(1115)

on April 16, 2012
at 02:37 AM

Well, he says it himself, "What does it mean for YOU? Really, it doesn???t mean anything about how YOUR body will respond to sweet potatoes." Good for him for finally being open-minded to trying to incorporate starches since what he has been doing hasn't been working. I do agree with his point about eating protein/fat with the starch to prohibit a blood sugar spike... But isn't that common knowledge?

Honestly, what really irked me is that he added honey to a sweet potato the first couple times and then decided to replace honey with stevia. This isn't a question about whether or not I agree with honey/stevia (I don't, but that's me) but why add it to a sweet potato??! As a lover of the little orange tubers, I just don't get it.

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on April 16, 2012
at 02:41 AM

I can perfectly believe that some guys can eat sweet potatoes with honey butter, no problem. Jimmy absolutely cannot, and he should know that already. I luv da guy, and he needs to act on his knowledge - he says he knows he's broken, but doesn't take any action to remedy. He's gotta do what he knows he should and end his denial.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:12 AM

By the way he set it up it seems like he wanted it to fail and he was surprised when it didn't. He's had experts on his show tell him that people on long term VLC diets have adaptive insulin resistance so he starts out his "safe-starches" experiment by adding 17g of sugar from honey to the 18.5g from the sweet potato?! Maybe it's been too long since he's seen apples and oranges. Notice by the end his morning blood sugar is back to where it was when he started; I'd call that a success.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:11 AM

That was my first thought too, a whole tablespoon of honey on ~3oz of *sweet* potato?! Really? That would be too sweet for me and I'm not even diabetic. It makes me wonder what he's still eating that gives him such a sweet tooth.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 09:46 AM

Ya think Violet? ;-) At least this time he didn't just add buttered bread and sweet potato fries at random.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:44 PM

violet, very good point. His wording throughout, and the set-up of the project do all point to "set up to fail."

10
96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on April 17, 2012
at 03:25 PM

I'm glad Jimmmy posted his n=1, particularly with photos, because I realized 3 things:

  • I am exactly like Jimmy with regard to appetite control/binge impulse issues
  • My SAD binges were exactly like Jimmy's, with 2-liters of Coke daily and chips, cakes, etc.
  • At present, I couldn't eat more differently than Jimmy if I tried

My current food mix is about 70% raw greens, vegetables and fruit, supplemented with modest portions of cooked meat, vegetables and yogurt/water kefir. My blood glucose is fine, my digestion is terrific and my weight is completely in my control.

Jimmy's meal photos didn't look like food to me and that was a revelation.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on April 17, 2012
at 10:39 PM

Yeah, Nance, but were you ever morbidly obese like Jimmy? We're not talking about a run of the mill obese person here but an outlier even among obese people. Jimmy used to drink 16 cans of cola daily. I don't think you did that.

C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on April 18, 2012
at 07:06 AM

Well done Nance. Namby, Jimmy is such a victim!! he lost weight previously on low fat and can do it again if he gets real.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on April 18, 2012
at 02:51 PM

Well, that's my point. If you suffer from food addiction to the extent Jimmy does, you'll have a real problem integrating safe starches to your diet. A combination of palatability and insulin-driven hunger will make you eating all day -- trust me, yams and sweet potatoes can become palatable enough to be addictive, when combined with the insulin load. I reached my upper limit with safe starches and Jimmy already has.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on April 18, 2012
at 03:39 PM

@NambyPamby, perhaps, but MY point is that he's still eating SAD-replicating meals. If I did that I would've regained all my lost weight already. I'm not eating that way--I'm actually following the radical "eat plain, whole foods" concept--and my results are diametrically opposed to his. So, either he should admit he's okay with the status quo or he should stop expecting to get different results while basically doing the same things. (stepping off soapbox)

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on April 18, 2012
at 01:32 AM

@NambyPamby, sadly that's a "sort of." I routinely drank a 2-liter or more of Coke per day and on many occasions I ate until I couldn't physically swallow because my esophagus was full of food. Not good times. My first down in the cycle of yo-yos was only 50 lbs but each peak was higher and if I reach my desired weight later this year I will have dropped an estimated 80-90 pounds. I've already lost more than 6" from my waist, yet I am still obese and it will take about another 4-5" to approach a good permanent size. Maybe more. I'm currently resting but will begin my final campaign in 2 weeks.

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 20, 2012
at 03:49 AM

Exactly. Jimmy's problems are more emotional/psychological than anything else. Food addiction indeed, Namby... Anyone expecting him to seriously alter his paradigm has a long wait. Until that cold day in Hell - http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/my-latest-light-bulb-moment-that-has-changed-my-diet-and-life-forever/8036 Rinse, repeat, etc....

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on November 03, 2012
at 04:27 AM

Food addiction, and addiction in general, is a hormonal/compulsive issue. In other words, he needs to avoid or extinguish triggers, and that will help. However, therapy is unlikely to do much.

8
F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 17, 2012
at 05:31 AM

What does 'metabolic derangement' mean anyway? Until that term can be precisely defined and quantified, it will remain Jimmy-speak (and others) for, 'Dang it! I don't know why I can't eat as much as I want as long as it's low carb and still lose weight'. As was pretty obvious when he first posted his 'low carb paleo' meal pics last summer, the issue appears to be one of portion size (hence calories). The 'paleo lemon bars' that shortly followed were hardly surprising. He's obsessed with sweet (remember those Da Vinci Syrup-and-whipped-cream concoctions from back when he actually posted menus?) and refuses to relinquish the idea that weight loss might actually entail a degree of deprivation. Dr. Kurt Harris was dead-on right in his advice about what should be done to counter all this Livin La Vida Nonsense. And if anyone wonders where the derision comes from, I suggest asking the (no doubt) hundreds of well-intentioned commenters who've been summarily banned from his forum and sites. All in the interest of free and open expression of ideas, I'm sure.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:08 PM

I've actually seen that term used in peer review studies. Derangement is real -- out of whack lipids, glucose, etc., inappropriate response to dietary intake. In the case of most obese, it's the obesity/caloric surplus that causes the derangement not the other way around. Jimmy is trying to excuse his weight with a "damaged metabolism" -- that somehow he did too much damage shoving boxes of Little Debbies down his throat in his 20's. But if his metabolism was damaged, how did he lose 170+ pounds not once, but twice after all the damage?? That's a "gotcha" right there.

8
7c40dcc7559b3ceeb04225cafdc5a154

on April 16, 2012
at 05:25 PM

Jimmy really is the king of denial. I too wonder what he is really eating when a sweet potato without honey or stevia is just not sweet enough.

It irritates me how people are so addicted to the taste of sweet that they are unable to enjoy things that are naturally sweet without adding a bunch of extra sugar to it.

I went to lunch one day and ordered the sweet potato fries not realizing they would come with sugar on them. Seriously, who does that. Now if I do order sweet potato fries when I eat out I check and make sure they do not add sugar.

When I cook sweet potato fries at home I use olive oil and salt. They taste plenty sweet to me.

Anyway Jimmy Moore is now up to 300 pounds and his weight shows no signs of stopping. He no longer posts his menus so who can say what he is eating.

I just can't believe that all the low carb and weight loss experts he has access to and consulted and not one has been able to help him or solve his problem.

So one can conclude that either Jimmy is not telling the truth to the experts when he tries to get help or the experts really have no clue about anything and sometimes their plans work and for those who it does not work for then it's just too bad.

742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on April 16, 2012
at 10:27 PM

Amen. It irks me too see people adding tablespoons of honey and sugar to sweet potatos. Shit, I find a regular sweet potato too sweet.

8
91ae7d4ce6232682aeaa5de99eed3d49

(140)

on April 16, 2012
at 11:46 AM

Jimmy, please redo your N=1, but this time control for the carb content. It's great if you want to to test the starches, but adding sweeteners confounds your data. Leave the sweeteners off. And yes, also eat non-processed meat, which also tend to contain sweeteners. Glad you're doing these experiments. We can all learn from it.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:38 PM

i agree - honey on sweet potatoes!? What do you think your BS is going to do?

8
24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 03:29 AM

Half a sweet potato + 3T butter.

What a joke.

Bb1ba0d71083ceaecd3a3b405a977454

(891)

on April 16, 2012
at 03:45 AM

I had half a sweet potato tonight and maybe had 3/4 to 1 tbsp coconut oil on it and my green beans and bok choi. 3 tbsp does seem like a bit much, for me anyway.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 16, 2012
at 04:52 AM

There are those of us who lost substantial amounts of weight eating high fat. For me, the joke is the sweet potato. Mileage varies.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:29 AM

VLC has seemed to stop working for Jimmy (which is the whole point of the n=1) and his attempt at safe starches was half-assed at best when 50g is recommended as the minimum. Mileage does indeed vary.

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 16, 2012
at 07:10 AM

Not to get all Occam's Razor here, but those pictures say it all: TWO grease-laden bratwurst, 3T of butter, in excess (probably) of 2,000 calories a day, and the most stunningly obvious conclusion continually evades Mr. Moore. To wit: too much eating and not enough moving!

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 11:02 AM

@PrimalDanny: Whenever I read advice for adding starches to one's low carb diet, I see the caution to cut back on the fat. I'm not sure who these "paleo experts" are he consulted, but I'm quite the suggestion to eat with protein and fat was not intended to mean two greezy brats or a chicken breast smothered in cheese and then 1/3 stick of butter on top of that.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 10:57 AM

Also, Jimmy's n=1 from last summer show that his fasting glucose has been going up for a while. It's likely from chronic caloric surplus as he's been gaining weight pretty steadily since the 2011 LC cruise. Now Jimmy has been LLVLC for 8 years now and his fasting glucose is on the rise. Another long term low carber had the same thing happen requiring metformin and Victoza after 15 years of eating VLC. Does anyone seriously think carbohydrates are causing this? Common sense says, as has been demonstrated in clinical trials, the high fat diet might just have something to do with it.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 16, 2012
at 09:43 AM

Rose, the point wasn't weight loss with high fat, it was that if he's testing safe starches, 1/2 a potato drowned in 3T butter doesn't cut it. Also, in case you missed it, he's now over 300 lbs so he's added about 15-20 lbs since going paleo baayyybeeee. Clearly ad libitum VLC is not working for Jimmy and hasn't been for years now.

Ccacf7567273244733bc991af4ac42ed

(5198)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:28 PM

Though arguably ad libitum *anything* probably won't work for him right now. Anyway isn't the point that some people give the impression (and they do) that fat loss will start flowing just by adding a few forkfuls of potato to your low-carb diet? Whichever way you go it's always more complicated in practise.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on April 16, 2012
at 12:43 PM

the man should simply eat *more* balanced and measure his portions for a month or so. Not the balanced eating most refer to but rather simply a bit less fat, a bit more starch, less processed food, etc. Simple, whole foods. Measure it all if you are really aiming to "test" something. Give a month or two and stick to it 100% - only way to get results that matter.

742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on April 16, 2012
at 10:31 PM

Do you want some sweet potato with your butter??

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 10:49 AM

@Rose: Based on his past reports of having fatty stools when he loses weight rapidly, it's a fair bet that Jimmy has a fatty liver. Whether or not he does, the elevated FBG has little to do with carb consumption it is a symptom of hepatic insulin resistance. I don't know what's up with the potato only results other than to say perhaps his body has no clue what to do with a normal amount of food ;) What his experiments show is that Jimmy's glucose tolerance is just fine. Bottom line: if you're testing starches, eat starches, not with a fatty meal adding over a third stick of butter!!

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:13 AM

Just so I'm understanding the contention here, are you saying that it's the butter that raised his BG? Forget about the two pound "gain" -- I can "gain" and "lose" that much on a rainy day -- I mean the BG spikes, and elevated morning BG. Y'all are saying that's due to the butter?

7
3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

on April 17, 2012
at 04:27 AM

When will people realize that a safe starch diet doesn't work for everyone, just like a ketogenic VLC diet doesn't work for many. I don't know who talked Jimmy into trying a safe-starch experiment, and he's indulging us graciously like only he can. But this diet isn't gonna work for him: not because he's not implementing it correctly (butter, honet, etc.) but because his metabolism isn't suited for safe starches.

Jimmy is metabolically deranged, though he may not be diabetic. I've met plenty of metabolically deranged yet nondiabetic obese people at my gym to know that their only chance is with a VLC diet. Yes, I'm aware of those who followed VLC/Atkins diets and later swithced to higher carb/PHD diets and felt much better and even lost more weight: I'm one of them. But I was never morbidly obese; at my worst only slightly obese.

Those who benefit from safe starch diets tend to be mostly normal metabolically, or in some cases, metabolically deranged slightly. Someone who used to weigh 400 lbs. and now is at 300 lbs. isn't suited for a safe starch experiment, especially not when his weight is creeping back up.

Polymorphism rules and we can easily understand if we just look at the genetic diversity even among our closely related people: ApoE genes will dictate how you respond to carbs or fat in serum cholesterol. Just because your diet worked doesn't mean it will work for Jimmy. And vice versa.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:10 PM

Actually, given as he didn't even adapt to the dietary change before testing, Jimmy's results -- as they always seem to -- indicate he's not intolerant to carbs. He has gained 20+ pounds now in 2012 eating his paleo high fat mod protein low carb diet.

E34fbfa1bca9ae970c9c7313bf9de9f8

(1436)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:02 PM

I think he's just deranged. Deranged in thinking that calories don't count. Deranged in thinking eating sweet potato + honey + gobs of fat is an accurate way to "test safe starches". Deranged in thinking that spinach is a confounder. Deranged in thinking that cardiovascular exercise is harmful. He doesn't need to change his diet as much as he needs to change his thinking.

D12142c8cafb16d9af10b3362cb8fb62

(1590)

on April 17, 2012
at 07:11 AM

Define the biological meaning of 'metabolically deranged'.

7
6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on April 16, 2012
at 09:36 PM

So I asked Jimmy on G+ why he needs sweetener and so much added fat, this is his response -

Jimmy Moore

So much sweetener? I used just a tiny amount of stevia to bring out the flavor of the sweet potato. Personal preference. As for the fat, I was told to consume it with lots of fat to minimize the blood sugar impact. And so I did. My experiment without the fat in the last day confirmed it was a wise choice.

I have now un-followed him as I think he is delusional.

Fb677d93955eb0fac597e3d94db92980

(1115)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:40 AM

Lol... I wonder what flavor stevia brings out. It must be that just-dug-out-of-the-ground-doused-with-sugar-and-drowned-in-butter flavor that I'm missing out on. Ditto on the delusions.

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 17, 2012
at 03:11 AM

Sweet potatoes require stevia to 'bring out the flavor'? Huh? And I thought low carbers were supposed to be beyond all this fixation on sweet.

6
C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:18 AM

It doesn't really matter what the starches are going to do its the way he eats - 3 tablespoons of butter on half a sweet potato???? Talk about unnecessarily adding to the calorie count which matters for weight loss.

C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:20 AM

With the amount of butter he has literally added another meal of 405 calories (presuming tablespoons are 15mL).

F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 17, 2012
at 03:09 AM

But that's exactly the problem, Sue - he doesn't think calories matter for weight loss. It all comes back to Taubes and the CIH. What I wonder is how close he'll have to get to his original weight before finally ditching this ill-advised hypothesis. The whole endeavor is anti-science in the extreme - i.e., forging ahead stubbornly in the face of all empirical evidence to the contrary. Jimmy Moore's 'low carb paleo' is clearly (in Kurt Harris' words) the Deepak Chopra wing of the movement. And this guy still matters? Go figure.

Fb677d93955eb0fac597e3d94db92980

(1115)

on April 17, 2012
at 02:41 AM

But but but butter is low carb! Heh.

4
Ef26f888ed248de197c37a4cb04ef4a7

on April 17, 2012
at 09:47 AM

I'd like to see him give an egg, chicken breast, sweet potato and green vegetable diet a go. Nothing else added besides maybe a little cottage cheese. Sure, it doesn't sound very gimmicky but it works.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 17, 2012
at 11:46 PM

That is completely ridiculous! Has this man no sense of cause and effect?! Did he really think spinach would confound this experiment but the honey would not? Jimmy's cognitive dissonance and mental Olympics rivals that of hard-core vegans.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:04 PM

Even when Jimmy did his eggfast, it should probably have been called a butter fast as his calories from butter were higher percentage than from the eggs. I also remember when he added some veggies back in to the beef/CO diet it was mashed cauli with butter. I asked and it was like 1/4c cauli with 2T butter. Ummm ... and it's the veggies that are stalling losses/causing gain?? Same can be seen in his pics of salads in bygone years -- swimming in Ranch is his usual preference.

Ef26f888ed248de197c37a4cb04ef4a7

(584)

on April 19, 2012
at 01:07 AM

It's like he just doesn't see butter for the high calorie condiment that it is. All these years of interviewing these low carb 'gurus' has left him believing calories are irrelevant. A few heaped spoons of butter provides about the same calories nearly a pound of potatoes. Instead of recklessly drowning his food in butter to make it palatable a glob of cottage cheese could probably do the trick. You don't need up to 70% of your meal calories coming from fat to experience the satiety effects or to somewhat blunt the blood sugar response.

Ef26f888ed248de197c37a4cb04ef4a7

(584)

on April 19, 2012
at 01:35 AM

Also, has he considered it a failure and decided against consuming starch or is he going to keep adding potatoes until his body adjusts? I know it took me about 3 weeks to adjust from adding starch and I was only VLC for about 10 months.

3
0905a0f8cd1e48f6d39fe625a65b6ef1

(2890)

on April 17, 2012
at 10:09 AM

What I think is interesting is that Jimmy implemented his experiment in a way that many casual paleo students might do.

If I imagine my best friend taking on some version of paleo and reading someone's comment on some blog that you "should be" eating safe starches, I imagine her adding a generous dollop of butter and some honey. For many Americans, the only way they have met the sweet potato is under cover of marshmallow and brown sugar or suspended in a syrup-filled can. And butter is paleoish, right? And honey! That's natural! So yeah. Jimmy's plate is a heckuva lot healthier than Grannie's Thanksgiving Tater Surprise.

I know that for myself, starches don't work. And I suspect Jimmy may be riding shotgun on that same highway to hell.

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on April 17, 2012
at 01:47 PM

Paul Jaminet of Perfect Health Diet originally had offered to help him perform the experiment properly.

3
464e1c66609d402615ae2b3cf72d53fb

(1472)

on April 16, 2012
at 01:18 PM

I posted a question last nite as a guest and guess what. It wasn't added to the discussion. It was a good question about Mr. Moore's health practices and was ignored. I listen to Jimmy with a large grain of salt these days.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on April 17, 2012
at 12:15 PM

Jimmy's still popular enough to have a comment count over 100 while undoubtedly screening out all but the most innocuous dissent. He's been at that for a while now so many don't bother trying anymore. But unfortunately newbies are bound to land on his blog and reading comments -- especially by "experts" -- presents a very skewed version of the state of carbs in nutrition. That he'll be moderating the safe starches debate at AHS12 is a total joke. Not to mention the makeup of the panel is 2.5:1 against Paul -- the 0.5 is Quiltie

5fb654380d04ac372b750ca3faad2e99

(277)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:39 PM

I commented using my Disqus login pointing a link to this thread and it was approved just fine.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 17, 2012
at 08:38 PM

That was my thought on his safe-starch "debate" too. It sounds more like a stacked pseudo-scientific lynch-mob/witch-hunt. I would feel sorry for Paul, but a debate is not a popularity contest and it gives him the opportunity to finally put this dogma to rest. It is deeply concerning that anyone new to paleo has to wade through this simplistic Taubesian garbage that promotes eating disorders just as much as mainstream nutritionism. Jimmy continually downplays the advice of the only experts on show worth their weight in salt and quickly replaces them with denialist quacks that fit his paradigm.

0bc04a2ee661857e8458df34646e70ef

(319)

on April 16, 2012
at 06:27 PM

I had a similar experience with his Calories 101 show: http://tinyurl.com/7xjjnz4 I asked if protein restriction for longevity was legit and about the paradoxes of the CIH such as fruitarians/Kitavans and healthy people experiencing side-effects on LC. His response: "Can you stick to the topic of calories with your questions? These are great questions, but not on the subject we're discussing with Mat this week." Last time I checked protein and carbs were both calories! Fortunately Mat answered both of these questions (quite eloquently) yet Jimmy seems to ignore the implications.

3
F10f0f407c8c18f9584fa6b164f39d20

on April 16, 2012
at 07:03 AM

There's so much to say about all this one hardly knows where to begin. I'm sure Evelyn will get around to saying most of it (and God bless her for it). It is good, however, to see this n=1 stuff return - but no Quest Bars? Hmm. Might that be because sweet potatoes aren't a valued sponsor on LLVLC? Nah, that would be me being divisive and mean. Gotta love Jimmy.

0
3d8b7e908d8a36a17aaf89f0f83f4df1

on May 15, 2012
at 05:18 AM

What if he were to stop dieting for weight loss and instead try to heal his deranged organs with diet and supplements. Clearly his liver, kidneys and pancreas are compromised--and until they are functioning properly no amount of calorie restriction, low carbing, diet hacking is going to help his overall health. He sounds like such a sad guy.

Ddfdaa75ac9f47e01fc71162dd0d38dc

on May 15, 2012
at 03:27 PM

Stop dieting? Jimmy's gaining - he needs to diet more. And accept his illness - he legitimately needs metformin. It's that simple. If you're as sick as Jimmy, diet isn't enough.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on May 15, 2012
at 01:14 PM

Vivian, two years ago several of us tried to advise Jimmy to do just that: stop dieting for weight loss. He was in the 265-275 range at the time. He eventually did stop dieting for weight loss sometime around March of last year and has been piling on the pounds ever since. He's gained 55 lbs since. His n=1 show that despite all the abuse, his organs are functioning pretty darned well though I suspect his liver is quite fatty at the moment.

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