1

votes

Nutrient deficiencies when Paleo

Commented on November 05, 2014
Created January 31, 2012 at 4:36 PM

Can someone please explain me why there are (so many) people eating SAD with little to no variation in their diet AND don't have any nutrient deficiencies showing up from their blood test

WHILE

there are (so many) people eating paleo + taking supplements to deal with (a truckload) of deficiencies. I really don't get it.

I can eat loads of bread, pasta, fries, junk-food, a few vegetables and highly processed meats and have a perfect blood test.

BUT when I eat whole foods, add in a wide variety of vegetables and meat and healthy fats etc., I suddenly have to incorporate offal to make sure I get enough Vitamin [X], I have to add [insert food] to get enough Vitamin [X], I should take a heap of Vitamin D pills cause suddenly I'm in lack of that too, etc. while I never ate these foods on the SAD and had none of these Vitamin deficiencies.

Isn't this supposed to be the other way around? What kind of sorcery is this?

842c27b9d4a825a043a8b1383ce294b6

on November 05, 2014
at 05:23 PM

@Sam_6 University of Texas did a study in 2011 on the nutritional value in 43 different fruits and vegetables (called Dirt Poor:Have fruits and vegetables become less nutritious?). one finding is that an orange grown in 1950 would be equal in nutrition to 8 oranges today.

Everyone today is mineral deficient. Our soils are so depleted that it is IMPOSSIBLE to get all the minerals our body need by eating just food, SAD or Paleo or whatever. Everyone needs to supplement and not just vitamins (Any multi-vitamin "pill" is 1960's technology with minimal absorption), but minerals and antioxidants too. Should be in liquid form for maximum (95%+) absorption. 

I recently found online a Dr formulated and clinically studied (randomized, double-blind, placebo, top-of-the-line) product that gives you all this in a 2 oz daily dose.  Check it out for yourself at these "coms" ishouldgethealthy or ichoosetogethealthy. They ship it right to your door.

C6648ab69e5a1560c7585fe3ba7108fb

(880)

on June 13, 2013
at 06:57 PM

Yup, I think most people (and sadly, probably their doctors) don't bother to check for or correct nutrient deficiencies. Just a case where what's normal isn't necessarily good :\

C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on February 01, 2012
at 01:16 AM

I don't know if it's the younger you are, the more resilient you are. I think that it just takes a while for deficiencies to show.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on January 31, 2012
at 09:03 PM

I've been reading "Celiac Disease" by Peter H. R. Green. The surface area of our small intestine, if stretched out, is about the same size as a tennis court! We have a lot of redundancy there but it can only take so much assault.

0d0316bfd35ffab6fa000120b978f303

(245)

on January 31, 2012
at 09:01 PM

RichfrmTx-I agree with with you. I would have said I was healthy and didn't have any dificiencies. However, what I do have (psoriasis, heart disease, no enamel on my teeth, bad eye-sight) is all heredity...or so I thought!

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25482)

on January 31, 2012
at 08:06 PM

IF you go to my leaky gut Rx there is a comment there asking the same question. And yes you can do both.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:33 PM

The last part would be me. Crappy food messing me up although being fortified not making me nutrient deficient.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:25 PM

Permanently damaged doesn't sound comforting :)

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:23 PM

Let's assume that they are Leptin Resistant too. Will your reset work with their leaky guts?

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:21 PM

"The British teen has eaten almost nothing but Chicken McNuggets." Anyhow, I hope the damage done when being young (and more able to handle it) don't catch up when being older. Wishful thinking I suppose.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:19 PM

Thanks. I was afraid it'd be something like this.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:16 PM

@RichfrmTx: But is it possible for these women to have enough Ca according to their blood test?

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:14 PM

Thanks. I was afraid it'd be something like this.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:10 PM

+ http://paleohacks.com/questions/79772/why-is-it-so-easy-to-suffer-from-deficiencies-in-this-diet-i-cant-imagine-the-sa#axzz1l1WVGo4Q Didn't find this at first

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:05 PM

@citrusfire: None. It's just that I never had any deficiencies and am a bit anxious that I'll end up with some if I don't eat organ meats, take supplements, etc. (things I never did when eating a standard western diet). @Caleb: For me it's a bit frightening too.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:02 PM

@Matthew: not really. It's just that I never had any deficiencies and am a bit anxious that I'll end up with some if I don't eat organ meats etc. (things I never did when eating a standard western diet). @Korion: I never had any. I did/do have a messed up gut (flora), thyroid, skin, brain fog,... @Dragonfly: You are absolutely right. It's okay for them to be funny as long as they are useful too.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32564)

on January 31, 2012
at 06:22 PM

Your tags are entertaining, but not very useful.

5e36f73c3f95eb4ea13a009f4936449f

(8280)

on January 31, 2012
at 06:03 PM

Assuming they weren't lieing about that whole story. I have a hard time believing she only at chicken mcnuggets for 15 years.

Bdf98e5a57befa6f0877f978ba09871c

on January 31, 2012
at 05:49 PM

that's a really great point. A lot of SAD people don't realize, in my experience, that you don't hve to wake up sore, or be lethargic mid-afternoon, etc. It's just how it has always been for them.

6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on January 31, 2012
at 05:22 PM

I agree with you Matt, Vit D and K play a big role in bone health. http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2009/03/reversing-tooth-decay.html

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41747)

on January 31, 2012
at 04:59 PM

My money is not on phtyic acid, it's on vitamin D/K deficiency.

B0fe7b5a9a197cd293978150cbd9055f

(8938)

on January 31, 2012
at 04:49 PM

Most people start paleo because they have deficiencies. I never heard of a deficiency that got worse on a paleo diet compared to a SAD diet. Except maybe calcium.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19245)

on January 31, 2012
at 04:44 PM

Are there any nutrients you are thinking about in particular?

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19245)

on January 31, 2012
at 04:42 PM

Are there any nutrients you are thinking off in particular?

  • 956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

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9 Answers

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3
5e36f73c3f95eb4ea13a009f4936449f

(8280)

on January 31, 2012
at 06:13 PM

A few things.

1) A lot of the things you mention have vitamins added (fortified cereals for example). This is BECAUSE they're so deficient after processing. So you're still taking the vitamins, just in the foods vs in pills.

2) You assume your blood tests are "perfect". Pefect in respect to what? The regular SAD population? In a nation of the blind, being blind is consistent with the population, and you could be considered "perfect" if you were blind. But I think you'll agree, life is better if you can see... :)

3) Specific to Vitamin D. My understanding is people are deficient on SAD as well as on Paleo diets. You need more, period. You just may never have thought about it before.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:19 PM

Thanks. I was afraid it'd be something like this.

C6648ab69e5a1560c7585fe3ba7108fb

(880)

on June 13, 2013
at 06:57 PM

Yup, I think most people (and sadly, probably their doctors) don't bother to check for or correct nutrient deficiencies. Just a case where what's normal isn't necessarily good :\

13
Af005ec9a8e028f2b04bf5367b64e0d6

on January 31, 2012
at 05:00 PM

1) People turn to paleo because they realize they are nutrient deficient

2) People eating paleo are more conscious of possible deficiencies, as they're constantly reading about K2, Magnesium, Selenium, etc.

3) People on the SAD do have nutrient deficiencies but don't connect what they're eating to their health in the same way, or are not as health-conscious and never realize that their symptoms (e.g. constant stuffiness, getting sick in the winter all the time) are related to nutrient deficiencies

And what do you think you're deficient in that you weren't on the SAD?

Bdf98e5a57befa6f0877f978ba09871c

on January 31, 2012
at 05:49 PM

that's a really great point. A lot of SAD people don't realize, in my experience, that you don't hve to wake up sore, or be lethargic mid-afternoon, etc. It's just how it has always been for them.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:05 PM

@citrusfire: None. It's just that I never had any deficiencies and am a bit anxious that I'll end up with some if I don't eat organ meats, take supplements, etc. (things I never did when eating a standard western diet). @Caleb: For me it's a bit frightening too.

7
Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25482)

on January 31, 2012
at 06:19 PM

Iodine and K2 are the biggies I see in my own patients. I also see a lot of B vitamin issues because many changing into paleo have pre existing leaky guts. They cant assimilate the good nutrients from foods for a variety of issues that need to be cleared up first.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25482)

on January 31, 2012
at 08:06 PM

IF you go to my leaky gut Rx there is a comment there asking the same question. And yes you can do both.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:23 PM

Let's assume that they are Leptin Resistant too. Will your reset work with their leaky guts?

7
6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on January 31, 2012
at 04:43 PM

I believe people eating SAD definitely have nutrient deficiencies.

For example, with so many women developing osteoporosis it seems apparent that they are not absorbing enough calcium and minerals from their diet. They might be eating enough calcium and minerals but there is a good chance that the phytic acid in their SAD diet is blocking the absorption of these nutrients.

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41747)

on January 31, 2012
at 04:59 PM

My money is not on phtyic acid, it's on vitamin D/K deficiency.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:16 PM

@RichfrmTx: But is it possible for these women to have enough Ca according to their blood test?

0d0316bfd35ffab6fa000120b978f303

(245)

on January 31, 2012
at 09:01 PM

RichfrmTx-I agree with with you. I would have said I was healthy and didn't have any dificiencies. However, what I do have (psoriasis, heart disease, no enamel on my teeth, bad eye-sight) is all heredity...or so I thought!

6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on January 31, 2012
at 05:22 PM

I agree with you Matt, Vit D and K play a big role in bone health. http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2009/03/reversing-tooth-decay.html

7
9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on January 31, 2012
at 04:42 PM

A lot of processed foods are fortified. In my past diet, I was drinking soy milk (almost always fortified), bread (if you buy from the regular store, always fortified)...even soda has some added vitamins.

However, personally I've never had a vitamin deficiency on paleo. What kinds are you having?

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:14 PM

Thanks. I was afraid it'd be something like this.

2
7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on January 31, 2012
at 05:40 PM

So a teenager eats only Chicken McNuggets for 15 years before she collapses. Seems like an anecdote that suggests that the younger you are, the more resilient you are. Real nutrient deficiencies are hard to come by in a reasonably modern diet, so while SAD folks aren't dropping like flies on that diet, that doesn't mean that their diets are optimal.

OTOH, you have paleo folks who are all about achieving optimum diets. Sometimes this tilts a little too far to something akin to the so-called orthorexia.

I think most folks are in the middle. I think it's better to get nutrients from food, but that means that you do need to eat the foods that contain them! Grass-fed beef is great, but if all you eat is flank steak or burger, you're missing out on an opportunity to get valuable nutrients (known and unknown).

Supplements seem like a great shortcut to optimum health, but I think in many cases it's a crap-shoot (I suspect we will see a dark side to all of this artificial boosting of serum vitamin D levels for example).

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:21 PM

"The British teen has eaten almost nothing but Chicken McNuggets." Anyhow, I hope the damage done when being young (and more able to handle it) don't catch up when being older. Wishful thinking I suppose.

C00e493393828df34be65ddc25456c7c

(610)

on February 01, 2012
at 01:16 AM

I don't know if it's the younger you are, the more resilient you are. I think that it just takes a while for deficiencies to show.

5e36f73c3f95eb4ea13a009f4936449f

(8280)

on January 31, 2012
at 06:03 PM

Assuming they weren't lieing about that whole story. I have a hard time believing she only at chicken mcnuggets for 15 years.

1
246ebf68e35743f62e5e187891b9cba0

(21430)

on January 31, 2012
at 06:10 PM

The Paleos that truly "hack", i.e. (most of the members of this site), are going to be the ones that are trying to address specific needs, maybe it's sort of a "next level" between going "Ancestral" to going "Optimal" (The difference between say, "Neanderthin" or the "Paleo Solution", and the "Perfect Health Diet" or "Archevore").

However, there are many Paleos out there that do not augment their diet at all and are completely, utterly healthy. In fact, I would venture to say that most "hacking" (with exceptions for weightloss, athletics, and depression or other serious illnesses) is quite minimal impact on someone who already has their diet pretty much dialed in...

If you are actually getting tested and showing deficiencies in your diet, as opposed to when you ate a standard western style diet, I would assume a combination of one or more of the following...

  • Your current Paleo diet isn't varied enough.
  • Your expenditure of energy is exceeding your vitamin/mineral needs.
  • Your previous diet included a ton of synthetically-fortified foods (bread, cereal, and meal replacement shakes/bars specifically).
  • You are eating nutrients that conflict with each other (i.e. Calcium absorption interfering with Magnesium uptake, Zinc/Copper imbalance, Vit. A/D imbalance, etc)

Eating tons of synthetically fortified foods makes sure the "masses" won't drop over from undernourishment. But chances are, you are doing things right - you just aren't getting the surplus of your calories from foods that have had a chemical grab-bag added to their roster of ingredients just so the world doesn't shut down and die.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:33 PM

The last part would be me. Crappy food messing me up although being fortified not making me nutrient deficient.

1
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on January 31, 2012
at 05:32 PM

I think after the near miraculous changes that happen when eating in a Paleo/Primal non-SAD fashion, ppl realize they may be able to get to "optimum" with some supplementation of nutrients. Our food is deficient now in some minerals b/c the soil is deficient. Also, years of SAD may have permanently damaged the intestinal mucosa and antibiotics may have permanently changed the intestinal biota and therefore ppl can't absorb enough nutrients. In that case, supplementation may do the trick.

956bcad1d462d433a4e1e22f6e3355d5

(1191)

on January 31, 2012
at 07:25 PM

Permanently damaged doesn't sound comforting :)

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on January 31, 2012
at 09:03 PM

I've been reading "Celiac Disease" by Peter H. R. Green. The surface area of our small intestine, if stretched out, is about the same size as a tennis court! We have a lot of redundancy there but it can only take so much assault.

0
842c27b9d4a825a043a8b1383ce294b6

on November 05, 2014
at 05:08 PM

Everyone today is mineral deficient. Our soils are so depleted that it is IMPOSSIBLE to get all the minerals our body need by eating just food, SAD or Paleo or whatever. Everyone needs to supplement and not just vitamins (Any multi-vitamin "pill" is 1960's technology with minimal absorption), but minerals and antioxidants too. Should be in liquid form for maximum (95%+) absorption.  I recently found a Dr formulated and clinically studied (randomized, double-blind, placebo, top-of-the-line) product that gives you all this in a 2 oz daily dose.  Check it out for yourself at either of these coms ishouldgethealthy or ichoosetogethealthy. They ship it right to your door.

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