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For Those Doing Safe-Starch Paleo, How High Did Your Triglycerides Climb?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created June 14, 2011 at 10:02 PM

For those who've been Paleoing with starch (yams, sweet potatoes, potatoes, yuca, taro, etc.), how high did your triglycerides climb? This assumes that before you incorporated starch to your diet, your were either LCing or VLCing. Most people who do so have trigs under 100. Some who do VLC have their trigs close to 50.

I'm curious how high your trigs would climb. Would it be over 150? I tend to think not, since that's going up pretty high. I think those who do SAD and lowish-carbs are at around 150.

The larger question is: is it important or meaningful? If your trigs go up, then the VAP test is more likely to show your LDL being composed of type B rather than type A. The absolute amount of your trigs is supposed to indicate fairly reliably what particle type we're dealing with. Or does this still hold, since you're eating something that's arguably "safe".

Also, your HDL/Trigs ratio goes down and, arguably, that is bad.

Previously, when I was VLCing, my trigs were 70. I would like it to remain there but is it really bad if they go up?

UPDATE: my Trigs climbed to 93 from 70 on a 150-200g carb diet. My HDL climbed to 65 from 57. My LDL stayed about the same: 108 from 106. My Lp(a) is 7 (before 6); my CRP is 0.4, and my SR=1.

Conclusion: Except for the 33% Trig increase, no measurable increase in inflammation or other risk factors. Moderate carb Paleo did increase my HDL but that could be due to increased exercise.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on November 03, 2011
at 06:59 PM

You might also see a change like this if your overall diet has a particular TG output that remains constant but your activity level or the way in which you are active changes. This is where the carbs come in. It's not that you are eating more carbs per se, it's that your mitochondria are oxidizing fewer lipids if you are not sufficiently active in the fasting/pre-carb state.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on November 03, 2011
at 06:57 PM

That's kind of strange. Aside from people who are significantly overweight, TGs should increase as a result of some kind of liver-oriented thing that upregulates VLDL-TG synthesis. This could be in the form of ethanol, fructose, MCTs etc. Generally consuming those by themselves won't do it unless in huge amounts but the combination of those coupled with a high fat diet seems to spike them.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5152)

on November 03, 2011
at 06:41 PM

My fructose intake may have increased somewhat but not materially: just the amounts in yams and sweet potatoes, which are very little; also some from parsnips. I consume no added sugar so there should have been minimal additional sugar nor fructose in moderate carb Paleo. I believe the 33% increase is due to the safe starch; yes, I've seen among my family members when they consume even safe starches and no processed carbs, trigs will go up by some.

1f8384be58052b6b96f476e475abdc74

(2231)

on October 22, 2011
at 03:28 PM

can you please make a post/question that entails your current thinking...i am trying to follow your logic on paleo currently but i keep getting confused. saw you advocate lean meats for leaning out while everyoone else is saying hf/lc etc. i am just curious :)

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5152)

on June 15, 2011
at 06:46 PM

Well, 100g of starch (let's say yams) isn't much. I mean, when I start eating safe starches, I easily consume 200g or more. That's still only about 47g net carbs. If you low-carb your other foods, then you would still be under 100g carbs and your trigs can easily fit under 100, I think. I'm not sure if 100g of starch qualifies as really "doing" safe starch. That would be low-carb, safe-starch Paleoing.

Cd2ff8c68dd1f1d539ad7f0ee94b0421

(1061)

on June 15, 2011
at 02:35 AM

I was eating much lower carb than I am now, probably easily less than 100g carbs / day, and I'd guess markedly less. I ate meat, eggs, fish, and very few vegetables.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5152)

on June 15, 2011
at 02:12 AM

Based purely on your results, it seems that you weren't LCing or VLCing prior to Paleing with starch. Is it possible that your overall carb consumption is lower now than before?

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4 Answers

1
Medium avatar

on October 22, 2011
at 04:40 AM

I upped my carbs from around 50 to 150 and the TGs continued to drop from 45 to 37. There was pretty much a total absence of fructose though. I'm going to re-test in about a month and will report back. Did you eat a lot more fructose with the carbs?

1f8384be58052b6b96f476e475abdc74

(2231)

on October 22, 2011
at 03:28 PM

can you please make a post/question that entails your current thinking...i am trying to follow your logic on paleo currently but i keep getting confused. saw you advocate lean meats for leaning out while everyoone else is saying hf/lc etc. i am just curious :)

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5152)

on November 03, 2011
at 06:41 PM

My fructose intake may have increased somewhat but not materially: just the amounts in yams and sweet potatoes, which are very little; also some from parsnips. I consume no added sugar so there should have been minimal additional sugar nor fructose in moderate carb Paleo. I believe the 33% increase is due to the safe starch; yes, I've seen among my family members when they consume even safe starches and no processed carbs, trigs will go up by some.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on November 03, 2011
at 06:57 PM

That's kind of strange. Aside from people who are significantly overweight, TGs should increase as a result of some kind of liver-oriented thing that upregulates VLDL-TG synthesis. This could be in the form of ethanol, fructose, MCTs etc. Generally consuming those by themselves won't do it unless in huge amounts but the combination of those coupled with a high fat diet seems to spike them.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on November 03, 2011
at 06:59 PM

You might also see a change like this if your overall diet has a particular TG output that remains constant but your activity level or the way in which you are active changes. This is where the carbs come in. It's not that you are eating more carbs per se, it's that your mitochondria are oxidizing fewer lipids if you are not sufficiently active in the fasting/pre-carb state.

1
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 15, 2011
at 05:46 AM

Even though I am eating all those starches, at least 100grams a day, my Triglycerides are 66. Are the higher numbers you all have a reaction to adding safe starch carbs back after being LC/VLC?

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5152)

on June 15, 2011
at 06:46 PM

Well, 100g of starch (let's say yams) isn't much. I mean, when I start eating safe starches, I easily consume 200g or more. That's still only about 47g net carbs. If you low-carb your other foods, then you would still be under 100g carbs and your trigs can easily fit under 100, I think. I'm not sure if 100g of starch qualifies as really "doing" safe starch. That would be low-carb, safe-starch Paleoing.

1
Cd2ff8c68dd1f1d539ad7f0ee94b0421

on June 15, 2011
at 01:58 AM

My TG seem to run a little lower if I eat some carbs. Pre-Paleo, I was 114. Post-Paleo, it had run as high as 167, and was 139 when last tested in May of '10.

I added "safe starches" and started the full PHD supplementation program in late January of '11. At my last blood draw (May of '11), my TG was finally under 100 (85).

So I guess I'd say don't assume your TG are going to go up if you add a small amount of safe starch as advocated by PHD.

Cd2ff8c68dd1f1d539ad7f0ee94b0421

(1061)

on June 15, 2011
at 02:35 AM

I was eating much lower carb than I am now, probably easily less than 100g carbs / day, and I'd guess markedly less. I ate meat, eggs, fish, and very few vegetables.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5152)

on June 15, 2011
at 02:12 AM

Based purely on your results, it seems that you weren't LCing or VLCing prior to Paleing with starch. Is it possible that your overall carb consumption is lower now than before?

0
095ef76482234d3db444b77d7ed01c29

(2755)

on June 14, 2011
at 11:01 PM

I do not know but am also interested. Right now, I'm doing one "carb up" day and "carb up" breakfast the following day each week where I have a total of 4 servings of starchy vegetables... my lab work isn't due again until mid to late September. Looking forward to seeing how this goes for others who are eating them every day.

Myself, I know what happens when I eat them every day. My labs go to shit and I crave "bad" foods..then get fat. So I limit it to safe starches for one "cheat day" per week. Curious though as to what I can expect with my next lab workup.

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