2

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Breast Cancer and Red Meat - and guidance on my daily diet, if you please

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created March 03, 2013 at 1:26 PM

Hi all, my info requests below are many, and I can but hope that isn???t too annoying!

I had breast cancer back in 2011 (had a lumpectomy and radiotherapy but no chemo) and since then have woken up to diet equalling health. I was led to believe that veganism was the way to go but it left me drained, skinny and even more moody/sensitive/crazy than usual (nothing new, I know). Then, I found Paleo and things got better.

I am female, 33 years old, 126 lbs, do not work out per se but walk at least 4 miles per day, do yoga a couple of times a week and intend to do some light weight lifting a couple of times per week too (just to tone up and strengthen my back). I also suspect I have yeast overgrowth, plus I have suffered with extreme mood/emotion/mental health problems and eating (or, rather, starving) disorders ??? which seem to be improving since going Paleo.

My first question is direct ??? can anyone please provide me with some information regarding red meat consumption and breast cancer risk? I feel utterly overwhelmed by the amount of info on this online. All I know is I???ve never felt healthier than when eating Paleo, and my body seems to want red meat (I find it more satisfying than poultry ??? which is totally new for me, as I was vegetarian throughout my teens and early twenties). But how much would be suitable, or do you guys not believe I should limit it? I have a grass-fed/hormone-free source, so would conventional red meat only be a problem in this regard?

Secondly, if any of you would be so kind as to hack my diet that would be a huge help. Average day???s food is - -

Breakfast: 3 eggs, onions, garlic, courgette, tomatoes, spinach ??? sometimes with 100g beef mince/steak/mackerel/salmon (no carbs)

Lunch: 100-200g Mackerel/Salmon/Chicken plus loads of salad or 1 cup broccoli, 1 whole courgette & onion (no carbs)

Dinner: 150-250g Chicken/Lamb/Steak/Liver plus avocado, a sweet potato and 2-6 cups cooked veg or salad

My diet is quite varied but I think the above is a good estimate ??? what do you think? Should I eat carbs at break/lunch, or more at dinner ??? or is this impossible for the ???everyone???s different??? reason? I also have raw coconut oil when needed, and nuts rarely. I would like to have white potatoes, but the last time I did they were like taking a sleeping pill!

I try to eat fish on the same day as eating chicken in an attempt to balance O6 (though am still learning in that regard ??? should I switch chicken for even more fish per week? I eat fish at around 6 meals per week, and have 3 meals per day), I never eat dairy and I am currently not eating fruit (or any snacks) but would hope to be able to add in one piece every couple of days.

FINALLY! Does the Perfect Health Diet cover cancer at all? I was thinking of switching to a PHD style of eating (minus the rice) but the amount of meat rec???d each day (now) sounds pretty low to me! Although, if it???s a good idea to cut back on meat for my particular situation I am more than willing to do so (all I know is, when I first started eating Paleo, I had around 300g meat/fish per day and still hungered for more ??? since upping it to around 500g per day I feel satisfied plus have started to develop muscle definition without working out, as my body was seriously lacking in this area from being vegan ??? so maybe my meat cravings are temp until I have ???recovered??? from veganism?).

A million thanks in advance to anyone who was kind enough to have read all of this! xx

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 06, 2013
at 06:14 PM

A Paleo thread? Sure, sounds good. I don't think I've ever been on that forum before (UK based) but I'll check it out and create an account ASAP. Will get back to you xx

94480caec9fbbaacc386d86a45efa720

(1007)

on March 06, 2013
at 02:57 PM

How would you feel about us starting a thread at the breastcancer.org forums? There's an "Alternative Med" area which is where the keto treaters are...

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 05:57 PM

somewhat rushed and pressurised by my then-doctors). I try not to have regrets but the side effects of the rads are something that keep me awake at night... I do, however, feel that great things can be achieved by using food as medicine. I am basically just trying to feel as well as pssoble overall, and I've never felt better than when eating Paleo. It does feel like I find new info or ideas every single month (or week!) and sometimes have no clue if I'm coming or going... But I'm open to all opinions, and like you, would like to befriend some paleo BC survivors :) Much love xxx

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 05:56 PM

somewhat rushed and pressurised by my then-docters). I try not to have regrets but the side effects of the rads are something that keep me awake at night... I do, however, feel that great things can be achieved by using food as medicine. I am basically just trying to feel as well as pssoble overall, and I've never felt better than when eating Paleo. It does feel like I find new info or ideas every single month (or week!) and sometimes have no clue if I'm coming or going... But I'm open to all opinions, and like you, would like to befriend some paleo BC survivors :) Much love xxx

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 05:50 PM

Thanks for that ^^^ too :) I'd be more than happy to discuss all of this with you (if you want, email me at billislord@yahoo.co.uk and I'll reply with my regular email addy) but I have to say I'm still learning and really have no clue what I believe in in terms of maintenance or treatment. I'm pretty unconventional, health-wsie, but there is nothing black and white about cancer treatment. I'm not on any hormone blockers - was offered Tamoxifen but decided it was not for me. I also chose to refuse chemo, and really only opted for surgery and rads out of fear (and because my decision was

94480caec9fbbaacc386d86a45efa720

(1007)

on March 05, 2013
at 01:41 AM

I forgot to add that I added soaked buckwheat into my diet during chemo. I bake it following this recipe (minus the peaches lately): http://disasterkitchen.wordpress.com/2012/12/13/baked-cream-of-buckwheat-with-peaches-and-blueberries/ It's supposed to be pretty good in hormone regulation-terms. I doubt it's PHD friendly though. I'd love to compare more notes with you since I don't run into too many survivors doing paleo so far. Are you on a hormone blocker?

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 04, 2013
at 08:17 PM

You are an absolute star, thank you so much. I appreciate your time and insight immensely. I will read the articles ASAP. I wish I'd known half this stuff when I was first diagnosed but I had no clue, but hey, no looking back. I am so sorry to hear that things are tough for you right now. But you sound like one strong lady :) Lots of love, and thanks again xxx

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 04, 2013
at 02:50 PM

Sorry, but I feel the need to point out to anyone reading this who has breast cancer - drinking milk, even raw, is bad advice due to the growth hormones.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 04, 2013
at 08:41 AM

Thank you, Angelina :) I'll check the vid and buy the book!

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 03, 2013
at 10:36 PM

Thank you very much, Miriam - my cancer was estrogen-positive so I will definitely investigate this. x

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 03, 2013
at 09:20 PM

Haha, I don't eat nothing but meat all of the time! My thinking isn't that absurd. I eat loads of veg, and fat too, I just didn't go into too much detail about it as my post was very long and I don't feel I need advice in that area. I don't consume milk or any milk products, but thanks for your reply anyway.

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4 Answers

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1
94480caec9fbbaacc386d86a45efa720

(1007)

on March 04, 2013
at 06:06 PM

Hacate, as a sister bc survivor, it looks like you're doing really well to me. Here are a couple links that may interest you that I have collected: Denise Minger deconstructing the "high fat diet linked to breast cancer" studies, a medscape article on the role of carb restriction in cancer prevention and treatment, another on calorie restriction. If those medscape links don't work for you (I often get prompted to login but it's not consistent), just google "medscape calorie restriction cancer" and they should turn up at or near the top. There's also a collection of links to abstracts about red meat and bc here. I have not been through all of them; the site owner is anti-red-meat in a breast cancer diet but cops to the hormones in conventionally raised beef likely being a part of the issue when postive correlation is found. This study, comparing US & Japan beef and chicken shows "...high estrogen levels in Japanese and USA chicken, especially that of E2, exceeded those of human fat (16.3, 157.1), while the levels in meat of low estrogen content were a hundred times lower than in human fat." So chicken comes off worse apparently... This is another interesting one, European and concludes "We have not consistently identified intakes of meat, eggs, or dairy products as risk factors for breast cancer. Future studies should investigate the possible role of high-temperature cooking in the relation of red meat intake with breast cancer risk. " & here's one more for you that says "Numerous epidemiological studies on diet and breast cancer have been published during our review period. Still, only alcohol intake, being overweight and weight gain have shown consistent and strong positive associations with breast cancer risk." When I did calorie restriction (included red meat) and fasts before my lumpectomy, I shrank my tumor by a couple millimeters in all directions. I am not doing as well as you on diet right now because post-chemo and radiation and being on tamoxifen is all f****ing with my stomach, tastebuds, etc. but mostly if I feel like something sweet will settle my stomach, I have an apple or a banana or berries so it's still good stuff. I also allow myself some dark chocolate these days, just not a lot.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 06, 2013
at 06:14 PM

A Paleo thread? Sure, sounds good. I don't think I've ever been on that forum before (UK based) but I'll check it out and create an account ASAP. Will get back to you xx

94480caec9fbbaacc386d86a45efa720

(1007)

on March 05, 2013
at 01:41 AM

I forgot to add that I added soaked buckwheat into my diet during chemo. I bake it following this recipe (minus the peaches lately): http://disasterkitchen.wordpress.com/2012/12/13/baked-cream-of-buckwheat-with-peaches-and-blueberries/ It's supposed to be pretty good in hormone regulation-terms. I doubt it's PHD friendly though. I'd love to compare more notes with you since I don't run into too many survivors doing paleo so far. Are you on a hormone blocker?

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 05:50 PM

Thanks for that ^^^ too :) I'd be more than happy to discuss all of this with you (if you want, email me at billislord@yahoo.co.uk and I'll reply with my regular email addy) but I have to say I'm still learning and really have no clue what I believe in in terms of maintenance or treatment. I'm pretty unconventional, health-wsie, but there is nothing black and white about cancer treatment. I'm not on any hormone blockers - was offered Tamoxifen but decided it was not for me. I also chose to refuse chemo, and really only opted for surgery and rads out of fear (and because my decision was

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 04, 2013
at 08:17 PM

You are an absolute star, thank you so much. I appreciate your time and insight immensely. I will read the articles ASAP. I wish I'd known half this stuff when I was first diagnosed but I had no clue, but hey, no looking back. I am so sorry to hear that things are tough for you right now. But you sound like one strong lady :) Lots of love, and thanks again xxx

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 05:56 PM

somewhat rushed and pressurised by my then-docters). I try not to have regrets but the side effects of the rads are something that keep me awake at night... I do, however, feel that great things can be achieved by using food as medicine. I am basically just trying to feel as well as pssoble overall, and I've never felt better than when eating Paleo. It does feel like I find new info or ideas every single month (or week!) and sometimes have no clue if I'm coming or going... But I'm open to all opinions, and like you, would like to befriend some paleo BC survivors :) Much love xxx

94480caec9fbbaacc386d86a45efa720

(1007)

on March 06, 2013
at 02:57 PM

How would you feel about us starting a thread at the breastcancer.org forums? There's an "Alternative Med" area which is where the keto treaters are...

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 05:57 PM

somewhat rushed and pressurised by my then-doctors). I try not to have regrets but the side effects of the rads are something that keep me awake at night... I do, however, feel that great things can be achieved by using food as medicine. I am basically just trying to feel as well as pssoble overall, and I've never felt better than when eating Paleo. It does feel like I find new info or ideas every single month (or week!) and sometimes have no clue if I'm coming or going... But I'm open to all opinions, and like you, would like to befriend some paleo BC survivors :) Much love xxx

1
C657d176db6f11f98aeb2a89071e3281

on March 04, 2013
at 07:39 AM

http://undergroundwellness.com/how-to-make-beef-bone-broth/ see the little video, too

This broth makes a great soup base or drink solo. It creates a long chain that effects the quick healing cells in our bodies. Amazing stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDoPwIp71_I

The Perfect Health does address cancer issues.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 04, 2013
at 08:41 AM

Thank you, Angelina :) I'll check the vid and buy the book!

1
Ddfc46d6cad7806af92187643179e2cc

(120)

on March 03, 2013
at 10:25 PM

vegetarian in your teen? please read about copper imbalance. I have read that there is a type of genetic copper imbalance that causes mood changes and most people who have it have chosen early in their life a vegetarian diet, that doesn??t help at all. It can be easily diagnose and treaten. Copper-toxic women are often estrogen dominant; estrogen dominant is also a cause of some types of cancer. You can start reading this: http://www.healingedge.net/store/article_copper_toxicity.html but I would read more if I were you. there are women here in paleohacks that suffered copper imbalance, may be they can tell you more than me. good luck

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 03, 2013
at 10:36 PM

Thank you very much, Miriam - my cancer was estrogen-positive so I will definitely investigate this. x

0
Abf0b6d5e20906f742fd600887292c15

on March 03, 2013
at 04:48 PM

Just because you were vegan and it didn't work doesn't mean you should eat nothing but meat all of the sudden. Definitely eat a good amount of safe starches to fuel your body, like white rice and boiled potatoes.

Meat try to prepare it in healthy ways, steaming, boiling etc. Eat plenty of fats olive oil, butter, coconut oil, omega 3, but heat them as little as possible as this will damage the fats and make them inflammatory.

Also in case you can't stomach cow milk I would definitely recommend goat milk (raw or low-pasteurized) or other A2 milk since milk pretty much has a complete nutritional profile.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 03, 2013
at 09:20 PM

Haha, I don't eat nothing but meat all of the time! My thinking isn't that absurd. I eat loads of veg, and fat too, I just didn't go into too much detail about it as my post was very long and I don't feel I need advice in that area. I don't consume milk or any milk products, but thanks for your reply anyway.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 04, 2013
at 02:50 PM

Sorry, but I feel the need to point out to anyone reading this who has breast cancer - drinking milk, even raw, is bad advice due to the growth hormones.

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