14

votes

A black market for raw milk? Are you kidding me?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created August 15, 2011 at 9:32 PM

I live in NC.

I have just discovered raw milk is illegal here for dairy farmers to sell for human consumption. After reading about the power politics behind this absurd state ban (and the only ban) on human food, I'm fixing to ditch entirely my blanket opposition to all things dairy.

I now believe that I had been influenced negatively by studies whose results are based on the harmful effects of pasteurized milk, not raw milk. I have stated on Paleohacks.com that the body does not digest casein (the primary protein in cow's milk) efficiently, leaving metabolic waste products in the form of harmful (protein fragments) called casomorphins.

I now suspect that pasteurization of dairy (surely) destroys good bacteria that might help us digest casein. I also wonder if the extreme heating denatures the casein, making it harder to digest fully and rendering it a foreign invader in the eyes of our genes.

Well, after reading this fascinating article Why is unprocessed milk the only illegal food in North Carolina? which explains why raw milk proponents are fighting against dairy industry lobbyists, I have had a total change of heart when it comes to assimilation of dairy into my version of the Paleo Diet.

Here is one excerpt:

The deadly strain of E.coli that is often cited as a reason to pasteurize milk is itself a product of feedlot cattle. The 0157:H7 strain had never been seen before 1980. Ruminants eating a diet of grass have a neutral stomach pH, and any microbes that reside there are highly susceptible to the more acidic environments of human digestive tracts and quickly die. But cows that eat corn have much more acidic stomachs, and thus the bacteria have evolved to thrive in acidic environments, eliminating our natural defense.

It's not just E.coli, either. Dutch researchers have found much lower rates of Salmonella in dairy herds with access to pasture.

For many raw milk drinkers, milk is not merely a commodity, but the ultimate manifestation of nature's delicate balance.

"I don't think you can get good milk from unhappy, sick animals. It's a process that really comes full circle," says Evin Evans, who runs Split Creek Farm in Anderson, S.C. Split Creek is home to 400 dairy goats, and the milk is sold under the state's Grade A Raw license.

And this one:

Some studies have shown that milk may have its own defenses from contamination, defenses destroyed by heat. A 1982 study in Applied and Environmental Microbiology showed that Campylobacter cultures inserted in milk died much more quickly and completely in raw milk than in milk that had been pasteurized. Subsequent studies showed similar antimicrobial properties in raw milk.

Referring to pasteurized milk, the Virginia farmer says, "A good place to grow bacteria is basically what it is."

I am for it....or in the words of John Kerry, "I voted for it before I voted against it."

So I guess I'm a complete waffler having swung against pork (since feed-free pork is nearly impossible to obtain) and for raw milk (despite the casein) in just about 24 hours. Wow. It looks like I will be making a trip to South Carolina in the near future.

Is raw milk illegal in your state?

We must ask why as we must consider the health benefits of raw milk.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on September 07, 2013
at 01:28 AM

Just emailed WAPF in Asheville and asked for milk for my "cat". Hahhahahah. ahem. I mean, my cat.

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 17, 2011
at 03:17 AM

+1 for pulling the old raw milk switcheroo on your hubby

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 17, 2011
at 12:50 AM

I miss the raw Jersey milk. )-;

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 17, 2011
at 12:49 AM

WyldKard, Interesting. I'll have to look for that. All I've found were cowshares, most sold out for the season, sometimes for several seasons to come.

Medium avatar

(2169)

on August 17, 2011
at 12:18 AM

@Matthew- lol. No, I try not to poop on my shirt. Do you know if people can become more immune to the bacteria in various animal's poop by say, being around it more? One would think that the farmers that are in and around the poop all day would have a higher immunity to those bacteria?

E2b9c679315c7c9c7265783dde89f350

(1303)

on August 16, 2011
at 07:38 PM

I know- when I first started looking for raw milk, I thought I needed a secret password. I only found it initially because I saw milk in glass bottles at a farmer's market, and when I asked for a bottle, the girl responded with "The raw? Or do you mean the Trickling Springs?" (TS is low-temp pasteurized) I have to assume that it's allowed here because the Amish and plain Mennonites are essential to our local economy. Without them, only the big cities would get tourists. If you notice, they only attack raw milk crossing state lines here- not milk within state lines.

Da8e709acde269e8b8bfbc09d1737841

(1906)

on August 16, 2011
at 06:08 PM

It's actually legal in VA _for pets_. The local doggy daycare facility sells it, but it's "not for human consumption".

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on August 16, 2011
at 05:16 PM

And if you consider a consolidation of government experts, big processors, and large dairy cooperatives, all working together to protect their interests, to be a conspiracy, I guess you can call it that. I don't want to stop them from pasteurizing, or force anyone to drink raw milk. I just want them to stop using force to prevent me from drinking it or selling it to people who wish to make their own decisions about the risk.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on August 16, 2011
at 05:14 PM

Matthew, I don't dismiss the known risks at all. Of course harmful bacteria can grow in milk, just as they can in any other food. It's the government "experts" who make raw milk out to be drastically different from other raw foods, despite the fact that all the major outbreaks of food poisoning in recent years have come from processed and government inspected foods like spinach and peanut butter.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on August 16, 2011
at 10:14 AM

@Wayfinder - Bacteria that causes food poisoning has usually come from the bowels of another animal, most bacteria in the sea is busy doing its own thing. Bacteria in milk often comes from cow poo which gets everywhere. I assume you did not use your t-shirt to wipe your ass before wiping your bowl with.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on August 16, 2011
at 09:55 AM

@Rock_Paper_Shirley - The romantic beliefs about raw milk are a big problem in that they dismiss known risks. The denial of risk does not benefit anyone as it can result in producers and consumers becoming relaxed about hygiene and safety.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on August 16, 2011
at 09:48 AM

@Aaron - Raw milk believers will blame an outbreak on anything other than raw milk. Try learning about how publin health protection works in relation to infectious disease outbreaks before blaming some big conspiracy.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on August 16, 2011
at 03:30 AM

One thing people should keep in mind: if you get sick and you drank raw milk, the health officials *will* blame it on the raw milk, regardless of what can be proven. Joel Salatin talks in one of his books about how a restaurant that bought his uninspected eggs had a salmonella outbreak, and the CDC immediately blamed his eggs before testing anything -- and continued to blame his eggs even after they tested clean and salmonella was found in conventionally-raised chicken meat served in the place. Raw milk is an even bigger boogie-man for these folks.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32556)

on August 16, 2011
at 03:03 AM

Think dead ruminant, pregnant or nursing...

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:37 AM

sweet, Danielle! Hawaii and free raw goat's milk? Sounds like the life ;)

Aead76beb5fc7b762a6b4ddc234f6051

(15239)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:36 AM

you ever try to suckle at the teat of a wild, knocked-up ruminant? aint pretty.

485bcefe7f1f7a6df1a293a826bf6137

(2191)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:30 AM

It's a miracle that it's legal here in PA, given it's hardly the "land of the free." Don't know where you live, but I've tried the stuff they sell in Martindale's here in Delaware Co., and I think it's pretty good. Of course, it's expensive, and I'm lactose intolerant anyway, so it's not my drink of choice.

Medium avatar

(2169)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:29 AM

Its funny, I mentioned my interest in buying raw milk to my mother today and she casually mentioned something back about the risk of bacteria in the milk. Then I remembered, all summer, I was my bowl and spoon in the ocean after I eat, throw it in the hatch of my kayak, where it will not only get covered by sand, but will reach 100 to 105 degrees during the day, take it out at 6pm, wipe the sand off with my shirt (that I've been wearing DAYS) and eat straight out of it. And I haven't gotten sick.I think the bacteria content of raw milk is one of those, more germs, stronger metabolism thing

E7be2ce38158357f5dacae07b43d1b29

on August 16, 2011
at 02:00 AM

Bacteria: listeria, campylobacter, e. coli, salmonella, Staph, Strep, Brucella and a few more they are still discovering.

E7be2ce38158357f5dacae07b43d1b29

on August 16, 2011
at 01:55 AM

There have been small scale, organic dairies that were legal and passed whatever tests and methods they have to do under which ever their state's regulations who have had people become ill from campylobacter, listeria or other of the many illnesses that can be transferred through raw milk in the last couple of years. Cases in Indiana and Alaska come to mind.

65430e39d7e9e9322718d016fe668051

(2944)

on August 16, 2011
at 01:42 AM

Raw milk is illegal here in Hawaii. My friend just got a goat and sheep and she's gunna give me raw milk soon! I read something about getting around the raw milk ban by labeling it as skin care products... how f'd up is that?

16e617676c5ac710e5235e0b773edc0b

(2640)

on August 16, 2011
at 01:24 AM

You're brilliant. Thank you!! I found a place a bit far from me but still totally doable, now to make sure they're totally grass-fed.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on August 16, 2011
at 01:11 AM

mmmmmm... bacteria. Is that suppose to be bad?

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on August 16, 2011
at 12:31 AM

I don't do much milk, but if I bought some goat milk here, it would be for my pets.

91fe5b7e10068df9f147ee84320e38f7

(614)

on August 15, 2011
at 11:57 PM

Did you mean to say "grain fed"? Because that is going to make a WORLD of difference. Organic or not. Kudos either way.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32556)

on August 15, 2011
at 11:09 PM

Most if not all of the negative information and studies in the video are based on conventionally-raised dairy. All of the raw milk dairies that I have come across are small-scale, 100% grass-fed operations that don't give antibiotics or hormones to their cows. Totally different animals, really. My take is that if we were eating ruminant meat during our evolution, then we would have been consuming raw milk from the udders of the pregnant animals that we came across.

2ab6415f5f20b8fe1d34a94c7be85e6a

on August 15, 2011
at 10:36 PM

Does this apply to the highest quality dairy though? The Maasai seem to drink it without issues.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:20 PM

Karen, I emailed WAPF and asked them to point me to a nearby raw milk source for my "cat".. LOL

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:04 PM

+1 from me. This is excellent information. I suppose the A2 cows are harder to come by? Also, how does a casein molecule in goats differ from A1 and A2 cows?

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:02 PM

+1 from me. Thank you for the link. I will watch it. Could you give me a quick synopsis? TIA

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32556)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:59 PM

My n=1 experience is that I have NO trouble at all digesting raw milk, but lactose intolerance symptoms when drinking pasteurized.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:56 PM

You can still purchase raw milk "for animal consumption only." That's one thirsty cat you have, isn't it?

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:52 PM

+1 from me. NC has also outlawed cow sharing. Now Senator Kay Hagan (D)-NC fought to reinstate cow sharing but was swarmed and overwhelmed by an army of dairy industry lobbyists. This is some serious shit at stake here with big money industries like dairy mandating their shitfood products and restricting healthfood competition all under the guise of the US Goverment.

91fe5b7e10068df9f147ee84320e38f7

(614)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:50 PM

P.S. You might check with your local WAPF chapter on sources.

91fe5b7e10068df9f147ee84320e38f7

(614)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:49 PM

You might find this article interesting, too: http://www.theatlantic.com/life/archive/2011/08/the-latest-raw-milk-raid-an-attack-on-food-freedom/243635/ Even where it is legal, there are still problems.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:48 PM

http://www.splitcreek.com/ A bit pricey unfortunately, but delicious for a treat. I once scroffed down far too much cheese at a sustainable ag conference they were at. nomnomnom Don't tell anyone but the goat's milk fudge (very not paleo) is incredible.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:44 PM

What else does Split Creeks sell?

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15 Answers

7
F46d472ee4e097afd7e0081ed6f6ab21

on August 15, 2011
at 10:01 PM

In NY, a dairy can be certified for on-the-farm sales only. However, the only licensed dairy near me sells raw milk from Holsteins feed grain. I don't buy this milk, because I think it misses the point of raw milk. So instead, when we get milk, its not legal.

There's also some interesting new research floating around regarding A1 vs. A2 cows. These cows have fundamental differences in their casein molecule. That research is suggesting that the casein molecule from A1 cows is what creates the BCM, or betacaseinomorphate, where as the casein from A2 cows does not because of an amino acid substitution at a critical point. A1 cows are Holsteins and their ilk- basically most of the dairy herd here in the U.S, whereas Jerseys (if they haven't been back crossed with Holsteins) and Asia & African breeds tend to be A2 cows. Robert Woodward has a nice right about this with all the details in his book The Devil in the Milk.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:04 PM

+1 from me. This is excellent information. I suppose the A2 cows are harder to come by? Also, how does a casein molecule in goats differ from A1 and A2 cows?

5
Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18452)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:46 PM

BB - yah man raw milk is only legal in 10 states as far as selling directly to the consumer at a retail level. California almost lost it a couple years back. Arnold was trying to sign a bill to outlaw raw milk (which makes zero sense because Arnold knows that raw milk is healthy from his bodybuilding days. there must have been something politically behind it because he defintiely knows better). Anyway they fought tooth and nail to stop it and they won. You can learn about a lot of this from Realmilk.com. Also, the WAPF has lots of info on this.

Look into a cow share from a local farm where you are. You can own part of a cow. This is a loophole in the law because you can drink raw milk from your own cow.

See my post about it here from back in February. I just bought some more raw milk last night from the farmers market. It's very good stuff and there is a HUGE difference in types of milks and dairy.

Factory farmed non organic ultra pasteurized homogenezied 2% low fat milk = FAIL

Fully pastured organic grass fed non homogenzied whole raw milk = WIN

EDIT: Also, if you want to read a very interesting article about all this, Cheeseslave put this out a couple months ago. It's long, but VERY telling. Organic Pastures is the dairy that supplies my local farmer's market with raw milk. I am lucky to have this here in SoCal.

Will the Real California Happy Cows Please Stand Up?

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:56 PM

You can still purchase raw milk "for animal consumption only." That's one thirsty cat you have, isn't it?

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:52 PM

+1 from me. NC has also outlawed cow sharing. Now Senator Kay Hagan (D)-NC fought to reinstate cow sharing but was swarmed and overwhelmed by an army of dairy industry lobbyists. This is some serious shit at stake here with big money industries like dairy mandating their shitfood products and restricting healthfood competition all under the guise of the US Goverment.

5
5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:38 PM

Not legal in VA, although people get around it by purchasing "cow shares."

Here is how to get it in NC. http://www.realmilk.com/where4.html#nc That site also links to sources of raw milk in other states.

If you're near the SC line, raw milk is legal there still. (oops, I missed that you were planning a trip)

Edited: I've had Split Creeks milk, AND their cheese, - OMG wonderful. Split Creek is really closer to Clemson and Pendleton than to Anderson. When you head down that way look for milk from these people http://www.scmilkywayfarm.com/ at some of the big produce stands. Raw Jersey milk - yum.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:20 PM

Karen, I emailed WAPF and asked them to point me to a nearby raw milk source for my "cat".. LOL

Da8e709acde269e8b8bfbc09d1737841

(1906)

on August 16, 2011
at 06:08 PM

It's actually legal in VA _for pets_. The local doggy daycare facility sells it, but it's "not for human consumption".

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:48 PM

http://www.splitcreek.com/ A bit pricey unfortunately, but delicious for a treat. I once scroffed down far too much cheese at a sustainable ag conference they were at. nomnomnom Don't tell anyone but the goat's milk fudge (very not paleo) is incredible.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 09:44 PM

What else does Split Creeks sell?

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 17, 2011
at 12:50 AM

I miss the raw Jersey milk. )-;

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 17, 2011
at 12:49 AM

WyldKard, Interesting. I'll have to look for that. All I've found were cowshares, most sold out for the season, sometimes for several seasons to come.

4
E7be2ce38158357f5dacae07b43d1b29

on August 16, 2011
at 02:17 AM

I'm wondering how many of the people who truly believe that farm animals on organic, free range, grass-fed, non-CAFO, non-factory farms have every spent any time hanging around the dairy barns at the county fairs. I have. The odor is overpowering.

They are animals. They sleep in their own excrement, like many animals do, because they go where ever they are when they feel like it. They stick their noses into things. Their udders get dragged on things around the farm, many carrying all kinds of bacteria.

I don't understand the romanticism I often see surrounding raw milk. The pasteurization process was developed to solve a problem: people were getting sick and many died from raw milk, long before factory farms, CAFOs, pesticides, etc. Taking grains out of the diet is no magic bullet. Bacteria is everywhere.

Many people do claim to have wonderful benefits from drinking raw milk. Others get sick.

A sampling of actual reports ranging from a month to a couple years old, which can be found at multiple other sources:

http://www.campylobacterblog.com/campylobacter-outbreak/raw-milk-cow-share-linked/

http://www.midlandsconnect.com/news/story.aspx?id=642018

http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/PressAnnouncements/ucm206311.htm (there are non-gov sources for this account as well)

http://www.adn.com/2011/07/29/1991935/alaska-dairy-tied-to-illnesses.html

There have been outbreaks in other states like TN, OH and others.

And you know what? I don't care if this post hits negative 10 in ratings by tomorrow morning, because if it saves ONE person from offing themselves from consuming raw milk, then I did something useful by taking the time to share.

There IS a risk. While that risk might be worth taking to some people (and to each their own), pretending there is no risk defies history and science.

If you weight the risks and decide it's worth it to take that risk, that's your choice, but I would suggest taking some time to seriously understand the risks before making that choice.

So what if it's only 50 or so people a year? Well, it's probably a big deal if one of those 50 or 10 or 100 are your father, brother, mom, sister, /etc. loved one.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on August 16, 2011
at 09:55 AM

@Rock_Paper_Shirley - The romantic beliefs about raw milk are a big problem in that they dismiss known risks. The denial of risk does not benefit anyone as it can result in producers and consumers becoming relaxed about hygiene and safety.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on August 16, 2011
at 03:30 AM

One thing people should keep in mind: if you get sick and you drank raw milk, the health officials *will* blame it on the raw milk, regardless of what can be proven. Joel Salatin talks in one of his books about how a restaurant that bought his uninspected eggs had a salmonella outbreak, and the CDC immediately blamed his eggs before testing anything -- and continued to blame his eggs even after they tested clean and salmonella was found in conventionally-raised chicken meat served in the place. Raw milk is an even bigger boogie-man for these folks.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on August 16, 2011
at 09:48 AM

@Aaron - Raw milk believers will blame an outbreak on anything other than raw milk. Try learning about how publin health protection works in relation to infectious disease outbreaks before blaming some big conspiracy.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on August 16, 2011
at 05:16 PM

And if you consider a consolidation of government experts, big processors, and large dairy cooperatives, all working together to protect their interests, to be a conspiracy, I guess you can call it that. I don't want to stop them from pasteurizing, or force anyone to drink raw milk. I just want them to stop using force to prevent me from drinking it or selling it to people who wish to make their own decisions about the risk.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on August 16, 2011
at 05:14 PM

Matthew, I don't dismiss the known risks at all. Of course harmful bacteria can grow in milk, just as they can in any other food. It's the government "experts" who make raw milk out to be drastically different from other raw foods, despite the fact that all the major outbreaks of food poisoning in recent years have come from processed and government inspected foods like spinach and peanut butter.

4
730b4d4c50506a31777e90b36c5999da

(235)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:58 PM

Just go on CL and search for locals selling raw milk for pet consumption. That's what I did, and now have access to the raw goodness in NC.

16e617676c5ac710e5235e0b773edc0b

(2640)

on August 16, 2011
at 01:24 AM

You're brilliant. Thank you!! I found a place a bit far from me but still totally doable, now to make sure they're totally grass-fed.

4
2c8c421cf0e0c462654c7dc37f8b9711

(2729)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:48 PM

It's illegal here in Tennessee unless you're part of a "milkshare" (you own a share of the cow) or you buy it for your "pets." We buy straight from a farmer, pay cash, and don't tell anyone about it. I imagine our farmer could get in a lot of trouble if she was reported for selling raw milk.

I still haven't made up my mind about the health benefits of dairy, but I make butter from some of the cream and pour the milk into my husband's mayfield milk jug when he's at work (I figure even if dairy isn't great for you, raw milk is better for him than pasteurized factory farm crap). After hearing Mat Lalonde's take on fermented daiy, I might start making and drinking kefir.

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 17, 2011
at 03:17 AM

+1 for pulling the old raw milk switcheroo on your hubby

4
C8253d9610402729148604bd9235fc24

on August 15, 2011
at 09:58 PM

You might want to want this Ancestral Health Symposium presentation first before you buy stock in raw milk http://vimeo.com/27671369.

I am now considering GIVING UP all dairy. I was only doing whole cream, grass fed full fat butter and hard cheeses since going Paleo for the fat it allows me. But now...I don't know! It goes beyond e coli, etc.

226b10cbb6b1d3530b00d2d84a2dc86e

(3313)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:02 PM

+1 from me. Thank you for the link. I will watch it. Could you give me a quick synopsis? TIA

2ab6415f5f20b8fe1d34a94c7be85e6a

on August 15, 2011
at 10:36 PM

Does this apply to the highest quality dairy though? The Maasai seem to drink it without issues.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32556)

on August 16, 2011
at 03:03 AM

Think dead ruminant, pregnant or nursing...

E7be2ce38158357f5dacae07b43d1b29

on August 16, 2011
at 01:55 AM

There have been small scale, organic dairies that were legal and passed whatever tests and methods they have to do under which ever their state's regulations who have had people become ill from campylobacter, listeria or other of the many illnesses that can be transferred through raw milk in the last couple of years. Cases in Indiana and Alaska come to mind.

Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32556)

on August 15, 2011
at 11:09 PM

Most if not all of the negative information and studies in the video are based on conventionally-raised dairy. All of the raw milk dairies that I have come across are small-scale, 100% grass-fed operations that don't give antibiotics or hormones to their cows. Totally different animals, really. My take is that if we were eating ruminant meat during our evolution, then we would have been consuming raw milk from the udders of the pregnant animals that we came across.

Aead76beb5fc7b762a6b4ddc234f6051

(15239)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:36 AM

you ever try to suckle at the teat of a wild, knocked-up ruminant? aint pretty.

2
95601768ec9cb75cc3a9cbcd2271ed14

(2206)

on August 15, 2011
at 11:48 PM

I am super lucky to live in a state (Maine) that allows retail sales. In fact, I have a store a mere block and a half from my apartment that sells raw milk from three different farms, a few kinds of raw yogurt, and many raw cheeses. I grew up drinking raw milk straight from a neighbor's small dairy farm, oftentimes still warm, and find my body handles it exceptionally well.

2
1bd4ea62097aa99c8cbef8aa5d02db77

on August 15, 2011
at 11:45 PM

I'm gonna be honest with you. I test cow milk for a living. Even from the grain fed, organic farms, I wouldn't drink the raw milk due to the bacteria found in it. Then again, US dairies are different, and from what I understand, even worse.

E7be2ce38158357f5dacae07b43d1b29

on August 16, 2011
at 02:00 AM

Bacteria: listeria, campylobacter, e. coli, salmonella, Staph, Strep, Brucella and a few more they are still discovering.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on August 16, 2011
at 10:14 AM

@Wayfinder - Bacteria that causes food poisoning has usually come from the bowels of another animal, most bacteria in the sea is busy doing its own thing. Bacteria in milk often comes from cow poo which gets everywhere. I assume you did not use your t-shirt to wipe your ass before wiping your bowl with.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on August 16, 2011
at 01:11 AM

mmmmmm... bacteria. Is that suppose to be bad?

Medium avatar

(2169)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:29 AM

Its funny, I mentioned my interest in buying raw milk to my mother today and she casually mentioned something back about the risk of bacteria in the milk. Then I remembered, all summer, I was my bowl and spoon in the ocean after I eat, throw it in the hatch of my kayak, where it will not only get covered by sand, but will reach 100 to 105 degrees during the day, take it out at 6pm, wipe the sand off with my shirt (that I've been wearing DAYS) and eat straight out of it. And I haven't gotten sick.I think the bacteria content of raw milk is one of those, more germs, stronger metabolism thing

91fe5b7e10068df9f147ee84320e38f7

(614)

on August 15, 2011
at 11:57 PM

Did you mean to say "grain fed"? Because that is going to make a WORLD of difference. Organic or not. Kudos either way.

Medium avatar

(2169)

on August 17, 2011
at 12:18 AM

@Matthew- lol. No, I try not to poop on my shirt. Do you know if people can become more immune to the bacteria in various animal's poop by say, being around it more? One would think that the farmers that are in and around the poop all day would have a higher immunity to those bacteria?

2
4b61b13ed39e5c5d01fe234900cadcf8

(1138)

on August 15, 2011
at 11:10 PM

In Georgia, raw milk can only legally be sold if it has a label identifying it "for pet/animal consumption only" Needless to say, there's a bunch of Georgians buying raw milk for their "pets". But anyone can buy it for any reason, it just has to have a pet food label. Nice little loophole- apparently most lawmakers look the other way; so we pretty much get left alone around here :)

2
F1b39d4f620876330312f4925bd51900

(4090)

on August 15, 2011
at 10:28 PM

In Utah its legal to sell with limitations. The actual dairy must be a 51% owner in the retail store that sells it. I think they can't sell any other kind of milk and the patron must sign a waiver. I just started drinking milk again, so I chose to do raw. (I have an sky high IGG reaction to casein). The milk I have been getting is sourced from grassfed Brown Swiss and Jersey cows. It has been giving me a bubbly stomach a bit, but no intolerance reactions so far. (get joint pain, extra hellish tummy troubles from grain, soy..) Redmond Heritage Farm Raw Milk

1
F2b854f65de6621f5ecb6ec9ba14eb49

on August 16, 2011
at 05:36 PM

Raw milk is legal unless labeled for pet consumption and people are still getting raided and banned from buying even then. I remember having to order milk and eggs at the store and driving up the road to an unmarked warehouse with the receipt in order to purchase.

1
15e684f6f716f88c99f641098a6e06ca

(922)

on August 16, 2011
at 05:09 PM

Even in states where it is illegal, if you sniff around you can find a source. There are clubs that buy directly from farmers.

1
Medium avatar

on August 16, 2011
at 02:52 AM

BAMBAM- its funny you asked this today, I also live in NC was researching it today.
Here is a list of farms "in NC." Go here and click on NC: http://www.realmilk.com/where4.html#nd

The farms they list are farms in NC and have not only have all sorts of raw milk products, but also beef/pork/eggs/ etc. The reason I put "" around in NC is because I'm pretty sure all the milk comes from South Carolina so that's not so great, but at least it's a source. I think most of the products the farms offer come from those farms, and they source what they need to, like milk, from out of state. The farms I looked at required a free membership and they have a pick up location every couple weeks.

Hope this helps.

1
E2b9c679315c7c9c7265783dde89f350

on August 16, 2011
at 01:01 AM

I live in PA and raw milk is totally legal here. It can even be sold retail. Sadly, though, every actual store that I know of that sells raw milk only sells it from one local company (I think it's a co-op of local farms, it's definitely more than one farm) and it's awful. Tastes just like conventional milk, so I'm pretty sure that it's Holstein (now I know why I never liked milk even before I discovered that I'm lactose intolerant).

So, now I buy Jersey milk straight from the farmer.

485bcefe7f1f7a6df1a293a826bf6137

(2191)

on August 16, 2011
at 02:30 AM

It's a miracle that it's legal here in PA, given it's hardly the "land of the free." Don't know where you live, but I've tried the stuff they sell in Martindale's here in Delaware Co., and I think it's pretty good. Of course, it's expensive, and I'm lactose intolerant anyway, so it's not my drink of choice.

E2b9c679315c7c9c7265783dde89f350

(1303)

on August 16, 2011
at 07:38 PM

I know- when I first started looking for raw milk, I thought I needed a secret password. I only found it initially because I saw milk in glass bottles at a farmer's market, and when I asked for a bottle, the girl responded with "The raw? Or do you mean the Trickling Springs?" (TS is low-temp pasteurized) I have to assume that it's allowed here because the Amish and plain Mennonites are essential to our local economy. Without them, only the big cities would get tourists. If you notice, they only attack raw milk crossing state lines here- not milk within state lines.

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