1

votes

Does anyone else find the PHD meat allowance per day kinda low?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created March 05, 2013 at 6:22 PM

Hi all,

I touched on this question in a previous thread, but I think my opening post was far too long-winded for people to bother with - which is fair enough :)

In case you want some background info/my daily diet, see - http://paleohacks.com/questions/182927/breast-cancer-and-red-meat-and-guidance-on-my-daily-diet-if-you-please#axzz2Mc4asB9x

Basically, 1 lb per day sounds pretty reasonable, as I easily eat 6oz/170g meat or fish per meal, x3 a day, but I could easily go slightly over that - and to eat 0.5 lbs sounds so low! And would leave me hungry for more.

I have only recently (Nov 2012) started to consume meat/fish daily, after being veggie then vegan (with periods of hardly eating anything at all) on and off for a good few years, and I've found that since doing so my muscles have built up in a very notcieable way (I know that's to be expected!), so I wonder if my body is in some kinda repair mode (as I was skinny as hell) and my appetite might lessen soon, or if 6oz/170g meat per meal is considered relatively normal for a 33 y/o, 5 ft 5", 126 lbs female? It works out to about 25% of protein daily (with 50-70% fat and 5-25% carbs).

I usually only eat starches in my evening meal, with a sweet potato or a big portion of butternut squash for example - would my hunger for protein perhaps decrease if I added more starchy carbs, and would this be advisable?

This post is running long again, so suffice it to say I get a lot of fats/veggies each day so don't think they're a problem - and I'm not hungry on this amount of food, just wondering if my protein intake is too high (not least because I have had breast cancer in the past).

Thanks!

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 06, 2013
at 08:26 AM

Thanks, I already use PaleoTrack but only really started doing it the last month or so. I like it for the O3:O6 calc. Have tried Cron too, it's very good also. So much to learn/balance! :)

028e70a250f38bd61fa81b0e0789bb6e

(812)

on March 06, 2013
at 02:14 AM

While I am all for "what tastes good for you is the best for you (of course, only for real food)" saying in an evolution PoV, I am not 100% convinced. I also believe taste and preference can be acquired.

89fa2da4805b0b4e54b77a5a20a2e206

(2097)

on March 05, 2013
at 11:22 PM

your very welcome..:) you might want to try to log your foods into a site that calculates all your macros and nutrients...theres tonnes of them out there.. i like cronometer and have been using it for a year. I find it keeps me honest as far as my calories are concerned and its a good tool to get an idea where your vitamins/nutrients stand too.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 10:39 PM

Interesting, thanks RK - I was wondering if something like this (gradual decrease) might be the case.

32652cb696b75182cb121009ee4edea3

(5802)

on March 05, 2013
at 10:31 PM

You may find your appetite decreases after a while. I started paleo eating about 3000 cal. (5'5" female). Now I am totally happy on 1300 or so. It happened gradually over about 2 years.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 10:27 PM

Very helpful, Mary, thanks! x

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 10:25 PM

Yup, ditto! It's some good eatin' :) x

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:49 PM

Was this the test you meant - http://nutritionaltyping.mercola.com/Login.aspx ? If not, do you have a link to it please?

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2

(11697)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:39 PM

PHD suggests p15-c20-f65. This is too little protein for me too, especially since I can't absorb B vitamins well, so my body asks for more all the time. I crave for it all the time. I usually end up eating about p30-c15-f55.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:33 PM

Thanks for your reply x

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:31 PM

Thanks for your input, good to know I'm not alone (AKA a crazy meat addict) - I couldn't eat that much fruit either, it would not be a good idea, but would poss eat more veg some days.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:28 PM

Thanks VB, I'll check it out x

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:22 PM

Protein fear is as stupid as carb fear is as stupid as fat fear is as stupid as fiber fear.

Ebb10603524dd22621c1155dd7ddf106

(19150)

on March 05, 2013
at 07:50 PM

@Travis Culp - not praising or castigating the Jaminets's PHD at all, but the limits they postulate are neither arbitrary nor pulled out of the air. The approach they take to determine what is appropriate in the PHD is based on their understanding of evolutionary nutrition -- which may or may not be misguided ... it's just certainly not "pulled out of the air".

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:44 PM

I'd say just makes sure the meat isn't any leaner than this: http://www.csumeats.com/images/denver.jpg and you should be good.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:43 PM

Cool, thanks - I figured they had to be basically arbitrary, as we alls be's unique ;) I don't do shakes and am trying to get over my love of chicken breast.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:41 PM

Cool, thanks - I figured they had to basically arbitrary, as we alls be's unique ;) I don't do shakes and am trying to get over my love of chicken breast.

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6 Answers

4
Medium avatar

on March 05, 2013
at 06:37 PM

There's nothing at all wrong with eating the amount of meat that produces adequate satiety, just don't get to the point where it's crowding other things out of your diet. It's clear that protein shakes and ultra-lean meats are disadvantageous, but these arbitrary limits are pulled out of the air.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:44 PM

I'd say just makes sure the meat isn't any leaner than this: http://www.csumeats.com/images/denver.jpg and you should be good.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:22 PM

Protein fear is as stupid as carb fear is as stupid as fat fear is as stupid as fiber fear.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:41 PM

Cool, thanks - I figured they had to basically arbitrary, as we alls be's unique ;) I don't do shakes and am trying to get over my love of chicken breast.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:43 PM

Cool, thanks - I figured they had to be basically arbitrary, as we alls be's unique ;) I don't do shakes and am trying to get over my love of chicken breast.

Ebb10603524dd22621c1155dd7ddf106

(19150)

on March 05, 2013
at 07:50 PM

@Travis Culp - not praising or castigating the Jaminets's PHD at all, but the limits they postulate are neither arbitrary nor pulled out of the air. The approach they take to determine what is appropriate in the PHD is based on their understanding of evolutionary nutrition -- which may or may not be misguided ... it's just certainly not "pulled out of the air".

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2

(11697)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:39 PM

PHD suggests p15-c20-f65. This is too little protein for me too, especially since I can't absorb B vitamins well, so my body asks for more all the time. I crave for it all the time. I usually end up eating about p30-c15-f55.

2
089dd41b18fbb95ebb5347cded708d98

(5635)

on March 05, 2013
at 09:23 PM

i eat a lot of meat, too, and i'm quite small (5'4" 89lbs). i easily scarf down 1 lb a day, sometimes up to 1.5 lbs. i just love the taste oddly after being vegan for so long haha i think my body just craves the protein and iron.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 10:25 PM

Yup, ditto! It's some good eatin' :) x

1
89fa2da4805b0b4e54b77a5a20a2e206

on March 05, 2013
at 09:22 PM

I found this article explains it well-

http://paleodietlifestyle.com/question-of-macronutrient-ratios/

so from what im understanding PHD suggest those macros more as being optimal " fall back-range" for healthy non-metabolically damaged people. I dont think they recommend doing 15 % protein every single day. Surely our paleo cave people went through feast/famine states and sometimes had much protein and other times not so much.

If you read the weight loss page carefully it says there that you can actually have an even split on all your macros.

http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2011/02/perfect-health-diet-weight-loss-version/

"For less active people, the Weight Loss Version of the Perfect Health Diet becomes similar to a lot of popular diets. Many diets recommend a roughly even calorie distribution, with 30-40% of carbs, protein, and fats. This is what a calorie-restricted version of the Perfect Health Diet should look like too."

Their macro suggestions are not set in stone and should be adjusted accordingly..(weight loss/athletes/metabolic syndrome) so if u want to eat 1 lb of meat or even more on some days .. i think it should be fine. Just adjust your other 2 macros so you hit your caloric requirements and dont go over or in your case under since your trying to gain weight. Also.. yes it sounds like your body must be in a state of repair and rebuilding.. so for now u should definitely stay on a higher protein version i think. (*keep in mind you need at least 200 calories from starchy carbs)

for athletic people http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2011/01/protein-satiety-and-body-composition/

89fa2da4805b0b4e54b77a5a20a2e206

(2097)

on March 05, 2013
at 11:22 PM

your very welcome..:) you might want to try to log your foods into a site that calculates all your macros and nutrients...theres tonnes of them out there.. i like cronometer and have been using it for a year. I find it keeps me honest as far as my calories are concerned and its a good tool to get an idea where your vitamins/nutrients stand too.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 06, 2013
at 08:26 AM

Thanks, I already use PaleoTrack but only really started doing it the last month or so. I like it for the O3:O6 calc. Have tried Cron too, it's very good also. So much to learn/balance! :)

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 10:27 PM

Very helpful, Mary, thanks! x

1
2e777bbcd49262eb31a24f821abec6bc

(1974)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:20 PM

I tend to eat 1/4 lb of meat for breakfast with a startch and lots of veggies. Then I just eat a huge salad or carrots with guacamole or something for lunch and then i do another 1/4 to 1/3 lb of meat (usually seafood or steak) for dinner with lots more veggies.

I don't think that I could possibly eat a pound of meat in a day and I am about your size (5'8 125ish). If lots of meat is working for you though then I don't think it would be a problem.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:33 PM

Thanks for your reply x

1
C657d176db6f11f98aeb2a89071e3281

on March 05, 2013
at 07:42 PM

I follow PHD as my eating plan. I eat more meat than recommended, about the amount of veggies recommended and less fruit and less starch. i just can't see eating a lb of fruit a day. My veggie intake is probably more than a lb. I am healthy and happy. As he says, it is a guideline. I think as long as you eat your fats (butter, coconut oil, meat fats, etc) and eat the food groups, you will do fine. I mean, a 200 lb lean muscled man will eat more than 118 lb me.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:31 PM

Thanks for your input, good to know I'm not alone (AKA a crazy meat addict) - I couldn't eat that much fruit either, it would not be a good idea, but would poss eat more veg some days.

1
F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 05, 2013
at 06:55 PM

Do you know that Dr. Mercola has developed a questionnaire to figure out your protein type?

According to him, some people are "protein" people - they need more protein. Some are not.

I know many here do not share his views, but I actually believe he was the very first Paleo pioneer (and he is beyond Paleo, if you ask me). I really respect his views.

Basically, without understanding the mechanics of it, he separates insulin-sensitive people from insulin-resistant.

I did not really like the way he made his questionnaire but it could be helpful to some.

Love,

VB

028e70a250f38bd61fa81b0e0789bb6e

(812)

on March 06, 2013
at 02:14 AM

While I am all for "what tastes good for you is the best for you (of course, only for real food)" saying in an evolution PoV, I am not 100% convinced. I also believe taste and preference can be acquired.

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:28 PM

Thanks VB, I'll check it out x

Medium avatar

(122)

on March 05, 2013
at 08:49 PM

Was this the test you meant - http://nutritionaltyping.mercola.com/Login.aspx ? If not, do you have a link to it please?

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