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Paleo + Ketogenic

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created March 01, 2010 at 8:27 PM

For those following Paleo with a Ketogenic bent.

1.)Why did you choose this route? (mine is weight loss and to help with migraines) 2.)What benefits have you seen? 3.)Any detriments? 4.)How do you vary your fat sources? (Coconut Milk, Avacado etc) Okay added an edit after seeing response should have thought of this in the original.... 5.) Performance in training? Good or bad?

06d21b99c58283ce575e36c4ecd4a458

(9948)

on March 07, 2010
at 08:35 AM

Steven, You might want to check out the CrossFit facility in Charleston, WV http://crossfitwv.typepad.com/ People that do CrossFit are totally tuned into the paleo lifestyle.

95ab15c8ef50ff0daf87ccbdd52cd3b8

(2384)

on March 01, 2010
at 10:08 PM

I've read Mark's guide. I consume more butter in a day than I do peanut oil in a month. I'm not concerned about it.

8e606dbf570848c4bc95f98e974a42ca

(312)

on March 01, 2010
at 10:01 PM

David, yes I am curious to see the switch over as it pertains to training. I was realtively LC before (mostly berries, but have ditched those)so know it is just the leafy greens and veggies this will be my first full week back on the mat so it should be interesting to say the least. lol

8e606dbf570848c4bc95f98e974a42ca

(312)

on March 01, 2010
at 09:55 PM

Dexter, totally agree I have been following paleo for awhile now and have seen signficant weight loss. I still have a ways to go. But have shifted over to a Paleo + Ketogenic bent in the past two weeks to help things along and to hopefuly at some point in the future retire the migraine medication and feel that I am adapting pretty well. I was curious as there is no real paleo commnuity that I am aware of in my area, what other peoples experience on taking this further step. I am huge fan of Dr. Harris. Thanks!

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 01, 2010
at 09:51 PM

...especially if one is supplementing with Vit D3 or is getting 30 min a day full noonday sun (shorts and **no t-shirt or sports bra**). Won't that liven the neighbourhood up! Suppose I could go up on the roof for a bit of privacy! LOL

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5 Answers

5
95ab15c8ef50ff0daf87ccbdd52cd3b8

(2384)

on March 01, 2010
at 08:44 PM

I "needed" (said the doc) to lose a little weight, like 15-20 lb, and he was probably right. I decided to drop carbs to a keto-inducing level (total carbs below 50g most days), keep eating enough food to be sated and sustain my activity level without worrying about portions, and just keep going until my weight stabilized, because now I'm curious as to where that level is going to be. I've lost the 20 lb, am still dropping about 2 lb a week, and like I said I'm just going to keep going until the weight loss levels off and then re-evaluate. Probably I'll start eating more salads and berries but otherwise not change much, and see where that takes me.

Benefits... besides the weight loss, I have a bit more energy. It took about 10 days for my body to get the hang of this burning-ketones thing, during which I felt kind of foggy and blah with an intermittent headache, but it's all working fine now. No detriments after that 10 days.

My fat sources are bacon and eggs, coconut oil, butter (usually pastured -- both clarified and non), beef tallow, bacon fat, olive oil, and occasional peanut oil. I consume very little dairy aside from butter. I use coconut milk in curries (about once a week) but don't tend to drink it straight. Last time I calculated a day's intake my calorie breakdown was 65/25/10 fat/protein/carbs, which is not far off what people like Kurt Harris recommend. It works.

4
E35e3d76547b18096a59c90029e7e107

(15613)

on March 01, 2010
at 09:12 PM

1) Mostly the co-incidence of my coming across Taubes and paleo at much the same time. I'm hoping that being in (or close to) ketosis brings additional benefits of keeping insulin optimally low, mimicking starvation, keeping blood sugar optimally controlled (i.e. letting the liver dole out what it wants, rather than forcing it to deal with random influxes of glucose), has various other magical benefits and basically figure that adding saturated fat to my body direct is less harmful (metabolically) than doing it via a combination of glucose and insulin.

That said I'm not so much going for the 'ketosis' route, as the 'mostly on the edge of ketosis' route favoured by the 'Optimal Diet,' figuring that this keeps the benefits of VLC and intermittent ketosis without any potential downsides of long-term ketosis (raised cortisol, slowed metabolism). The irony of this qualification is that actually I tend to stay deep in ketosis all the time, since I rarely actually buy any carb, and so apart from yoghurt once of twice a week, tend to stay VLC.

2) Complete loss of hunger, weight loss even when I wasn't exercising at all (being chained to my desk all day and all night) and despite being on the light side to begin with, greater levelness of mood.

3) Muscle cramping/aching, which mostly disappears with the addition of some carbs. Occasionally an sort of odd lethargy/lack of energy, half the time, turns out just to be having neglected to eat anything due to lack of appetite, though sometimes it does feel as though my body is locked in a kind of 'low energy mode' (perhaps this is what [stimulated] starvation feels like in the absence of carb/insulin producing hunger)... actually it does remind me very much of the sort of symptoms described for calories restriction, which would make sense. A shame if that's the case though, since one of the appeals of VLC was to gain some of the metabolic benefits of CR without starving (insofar as I'm not hungry this is true, I suppose). This is never a major issue, though it does make caffeine very appealing, which always immediately gives me a rush of liberated energy.

One other (entirely temporary) downside, is to need to ketoadapt for exercise. For a few weeks I was unable to do anything in the gym on LC, but performance ultimately improved beyond its previous state.

4) I switch between (roughly in this order of quantity) mostly SFA from butter and cream which I assume is the healthiest option to get most of my calories being closest to my bodies own fat stores, MCT-SFA from coconut (gives more of a rush of energy than LC-SFA, but don't have too much since it's somewhat insulinemic), and MUFA from macadamia nuts, since I figure there might be some benefits to having more MUFA, since the grain-fed meat + butter I eat contains far more SFA than the MUFA paleo-animals would have contained, but I don't have too many of these since they're both expensive and (being nuts, I'm assuming) contain anti-nutrients.

8e606dbf570848c4bc95f98e974a42ca

(312)

on March 01, 2010
at 10:01 PM

David, yes I am curious to see the switch over as it pertains to training. I was realtively LC before (mostly berries, but have ditched those)so know it is just the leafy greens and veggies this will be my first full week back on the mat so it should be interesting to say the least. lol

2
06d21b99c58283ce575e36c4ecd4a458

(9948)

on March 01, 2010
at 09:31 PM

John, Drop the peanut oil. Mark's Daily Apple has a guide to oils at http://www.marksdailyapple.com/healthy-oils/

Steven, Most Paleo eaters started because they wanted to lose weight...which happens pretty easily for most folks.

However once the weight starts coming off, a feeling of well being replaces the brain fog that no one was aware of...until the whole world brightens up.

Immunity from all the viruses and bugs is a plus. Very rarely do paleos get sick. We are not feeding our bodies the carbs and thus sugars that lower immunity.

Paleos dental health greatly improves...especially if one is supplementing with Vit D3 or is getting 30 min a day full noonday sun (shorts and no t-shirt or sports bra).

Follow Dr Harris' Getting started at http://www.paleonu.com/get-started/ and you will be truly satisfied. No more migraines. Probably will never be a diabetic. No more high blood pressure and thus probably will never have CVD. Never will be ravenously hungry ever again. You will only need to eat once a day. No more grazing during the day. Fasting for 24 hours is a breeze on paleo.

And you will know 99% more about proper nutrition than the average medical physician and 100% more than the American Heart Assoc, the American Dietetic Association, and the American Diabetes Assoc regarding good proper nutrition....all of which recommend eating "healthy whole grains."

95ab15c8ef50ff0daf87ccbdd52cd3b8

(2384)

on March 01, 2010
at 10:08 PM

I've read Mark's guide. I consume more butter in a day than I do peanut oil in a month. I'm not concerned about it.

8e606dbf570848c4bc95f98e974a42ca

(312)

on March 01, 2010
at 09:55 PM

Dexter, totally agree I have been following paleo for awhile now and have seen signficant weight loss. I still have a ways to go. But have shifted over to a Paleo + Ketogenic bent in the past two weeks to help things along and to hopefuly at some point in the future retire the migraine medication and feel that I am adapting pretty well. I was curious as there is no real paleo commnuity that I am aware of in my area, what other peoples experience on taking this further step. I am huge fan of Dr. Harris. Thanks!

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 01, 2010
at 09:51 PM

...especially if one is supplementing with Vit D3 or is getting 30 min a day full noonday sun (shorts and **no t-shirt or sports bra**). Won't that liven the neighbourhood up! Suppose I could go up on the roof for a bit of privacy! LOL

06d21b99c58283ce575e36c4ecd4a458

(9948)

on March 07, 2010
at 08:35 AM

Steven, You might want to check out the CrossFit facility in Charleston, WV http://crossfitwv.typepad.com/ People that do CrossFit are totally tuned into the paleo lifestyle.

0
De1095b2ba29c1035f00428cbfe3cc7c

on May 29, 2014
at 03:52 PM

1) After seriously binging on chocolate I developed an intolerance of carbs (constant sweet saliva) that disappears when I stop eating them for a while. Reading the low carb guys I kept coming across this paleo diet, i'd already cut out bread & beans so I was already pretty much there/here.

2) Benefits have been mental clarity, a general clean feeling, and learning how to lose/gain weight through what I eat. And my mild ACNE disappearance, how could I forget!

3) The only downside is I usually have more energy when I eat more carbs, it's noticeable during exercise or even just going for a half hour walk, with carbs I have more spring in my step, although I've never 'fully' adapted as I usually cheat on weekends. I'd expect with full keto-adaptation i'd have much more energy for exercise, although I do have times where i'll be in ketosis, eat some butter & suddenly have loads of energy.

4) I tend to cycle my fats unconsciously, every now & then i'll become obsessed with a new one, it was butter at first, then avocado oil, then olive oil, then lard, currently it is butter oil/ghee/clarified butter. I love it.

5) See 3

0
6fe055d6eddb6463b2cf4820d9307dea

on May 29, 2014
at 12:17 PM

1.)Why did you choose this route? (mine is weight loss and to help with migraines) 2.)What benefits have you seen? 3.)Any detriments? 4.)How do you vary your fat sources? (Coconut Milk, Avacado etc) Okay added an edit after seeing response should have thought of this in the original.... 5.) Performance in training? Good or bad?

Answers:

1) I chose this paleo ketogenic diet plan route because I suffered from the following diseases for nearly two decades: chronic fatigue immune dysfunction syndrome (CFS, CFIDS), systemic candida, Chron's colitis, IBS, anxiety, depression, hypothyroidism, acid reflux, and borderline type 2 diabetes (hypoglycemia).

2) All of the aforementioned diseases have healed completely. And I've lost 40 lbs. I am now in perfect health.

3) No detriments. Only increased energy and more efficient metabolism...oh, and decreased hunger!

4) Coconut oil, olive oil, organic butter, avocado, and omega 3 fatty acids supplements (mercury free). Raw organic (unpasteurized) cheese and milk.

5) Not sure what you mean by "performance in training" but if you are referring to exercise, I have enough energy now to run four miles a day.

Learn more about my journey from chronic diseases to perfect health from my paleo ketogenic diet blog and ketogenic diet coaching pages.

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