5

votes

Most Important Reason for Eating Paelo

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created July 14, 2012 at 4:52 PM

As I am fairly new here I thought I'd get straight into it with a question.

I am finding it hard to try and inform/educate others about eating paleo and why it is much better for our health based on what I have read to date. The problem is that I can never remember all the good stuff that Wolf, Taubes, Sisson, Cordain, etc talk about in their works (mostly because there are a lot of big words).

Then there is the other frustrating part where I need to present all the proof and they can just rest on "if it was unhealthy the doctors/government/Uncle Bob would tell us so."

Anyway, what is the most important/compelling bit of evidence you would rely on if you could only choose one, eg modern hunter/gatherers being lean and healthy on 80% fat diets?

Or is this like arguing with drunks and not worth doing, let em eat their fluffy white bowel clogging bread?

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 01:42 PM

Scientists are not all of one mind on this issue. And scientists are, despite the actual scientific principles, just as human as the rest of us and prone to see what they want to see.

A08b210e4da7e69cd792bddc1f4aae4b

(1031)

on July 15, 2012
at 01:10 AM

People see what they believe. It is very hard to change beliefs, and presenting facts is unlikely to lead to change unless they are already open to the idea that what they believe might be deficient in some way.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 01:00 AM

Of course there are plenty of people that it isn't worth your time. And many people become quite annoyed by proselytizing. You don't want to go down that road. Save the explanations for people who ask, and keep it brief like the link. For people who want more info, you may want to give them some links to Taubes, Sisson, Wolf unless you're comfortable with the geeky stuff. Or loan them a book. Only if they want the info.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 12:56 AM

Luke, there's a good elevator speech at http://whole9life.com/2010/05/the-paleo-pitch/ Scroll down the page, you'll see it.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 12:53 AM

@Diane Why should Luke lie about why he doesn't eat grains and dairy? If it's someone he doesn't want to talk to about it, he can just say he doesn't eat those, full stop. It sounds like he does want to talk to some people about paleo though and needs an elevator speech.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 12:48 AM

The raccoon living in an urban, suburban or even rural area where it has access to human foods is NOT living in it's natural environment. That is not the environment it evolved to live in, any more than humans are living in the environment where we evolved. The raccoon AND humans evolved to store fat when given the opportunity in order to survive periods without food. That becomes a problem for both humans and raccoons when the food stuffs available are not suitable to the species and excessively abundant.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 15, 2012
at 12:13 AM

@Luke....solid observation. @chinaeskimo....by your own arguments then this paleo way of eating is just hogwash because we now have different sources of native foods, such as transfats, preservatives, etc.

4b9077bdc5240ddeb48b2125c1bd6265

(158)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:55 PM

Great discussion. Could we draw a parallel between the racoon having an adequate, readily available supply of "native racoon food" (or at least our best scientific guess of same) which may not have been so readily available before being near humans. And that of humans having a ready, energy rich supply, of human food which may not have been so easy to access before the dawn of agriculture? And I guess a further parallel between the evils of the 7/11 and for the racoon the neighbors trashcan (with what is left from the 7/11)?

4b9077bdc5240ddeb48b2125c1bd6265

(158)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:40 PM

What I can't work out is why the so called scientists don't use the "science over flawed theories" point of view. Actually I misquoted you by writing science of flawed theories. Maybe I should have left it like that.

4b9077bdc5240ddeb48b2125c1bd6265

(158)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:36 PM

+! to let your health speak for itself. I'm still a long way from my goal too so you get the "yeah sure cutting out the processed foods, etc is doing wonders for your waistline." Paint them a picture with the body.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:04 PM

@Diane: tell that to the raccoon :-) sometimes I thing that raccoons are evolving along the lines of wolves when they were becoming domesticated (the garbage dump theory). I would say humans eating crap are supposed to become obese. That is why it is happening. Raccoons are being fed by humans because their natural environment has been destroyed. When you destroy something's environment and food source, then that is what happens. I don't find it unnatural. This is the way of the world unfortunately

F9638b939a6f85d67f60065677193cad

(4266)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:44 PM

But in a way, doctors/government/Uncle Bob ARE recommending this diet. They recommend lean meats and lots of fruits and veggies and healthy oils such as olive oil. We're just leaving out the whole grains and perhaps the dairy and choosing olive oil over canola. You can just say you're trying to eat a healthy diet but because you are allergic to grains and dairy, you leave those out.

F9638b939a6f85d67f60065677193cad

(4266)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:42 PM

A bear becoming obese in the fall is what a bear is supposed to do. A human becoming obese is not what a human is supposed to do. A raccoon eating food given to it by a human isn't really what a raccoon is supposed to do.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:12 PM

@raisefitness: Agreed. Grains and pseudo foods have become the native human diet. Not sure what that has to do with obese wild animals...An obese Bear is not an unhealthy Bear. Obese animals are not unhealthy the way obese humans are unhealthy.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:10 PM

Raisefitness: Do you have any experience raising/taking care of wildlife? Or are you just arguing for the heck of it. And if urban areas have become their native environment, they by definition those areas are now the native environment. It does not make sense to to say they are not after saying they are.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 10:06 PM

yes, urban areas have BECOME their native environment. It is not their native environment. Grains and processed pseudo-foods have become the native human diet.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:05 PM

@raisefitness: besides, it is not just coons, I have seen fat gophers, bears, possums, etc.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:04 PM

@raisefitness: I don't know how you are defining native environment, but urban areas have become a coons native environment.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:03 PM

@Raisefitness: define "native environment"

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:02 PM

@Karen: Raccoons get fat so easily. I have seen coons eat practically nothing and get fat anyway.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 10:01 PM

I understand what you are saying, but that raccoon is NOT in its native environment, and does have access to non native foods. As far as obesity in Humans, for 30 yrs I thought people were fat because they were lazy, or just ate too much. I understand that was incorrect. Humans are not meant to be obese, their our hormones get messed up by the diet they eat. They eat too much and exercise too little also because of the foods that cause them to do such. If we return to our more natural diet, we can fix the hormone problem and the obesity problem.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:00 PM

@Karen: I don't think he is eating human food. I have nasty neighbors, and they would let me know, and he would not come every night for food if he had another source as I am sure human food tastes much better. As far as I can tell, his home range is pretty small, probably because of the amount of coons in the area. I just can't see him competing with a starving wild coon for food scraps. The food is much easier at my house :-)

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:56 PM

@Raisefitness: Well, I would be hard pressed to define a raccoon's "native" environment, but I take pains to feed him and all my animals an evolutionarily correct diet. This includes lots of gross things like worms, grasshoppers, and my freezer is full of dead whole animals. I also have been known to bring home (fresh) road kill, to everyone's disgust, lol.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:55 PM

Does the raccoon in question have access to human food waste? I have also seen obese (out of their natural season to be so) animals, but they usually were eating a lot of foods they would not have had access to outside of human inhabited areas.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:54 PM

@Raisefitness: You made the same comment in the question about The Rise Of Obesity In The US...Portion Size. My property backs up to park land. I see plenty of obese black bears all year round. If there is a food source, they will not even hibernate, and they will get fatter and fatter. Raisefitness, I do like your posts and answers. I go out of my way to read them, but I have to disagree with you about this one point.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:40 PM

Damn those terrorists, sneaking HFCS into everything!

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 09:29 PM

Also, bears fatten up, and then lean out, they do not get unhealthily obese like humans.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 09:29 PM

Can I ask where I have said it twice?

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 09:28 PM

So you have a raccoon in the wild fed only his native diet? or is it not in its native environment?

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:13 PM

You have said this twice, and I really take issue with it. The other reason you will not see obese animals has nothing to do with diet. Any obese animal not at the top of the food chain will be more easily killed. Obesity does not bode well for survival out in the wild. Add to that the fact that most wild animals don't live very long anyway (Possums: 2 years, raccoons: 2-3 years) and this is likely the reason you generally don't see very many obese animals.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:07 PM

"No other species...will get fat..." Once again, this is NOT TRUE. As someone who has worked with wildlife for over 15 years, I can tell you that I see plenty of obese bears, raccoons, gophers etc. In fact it is part of their genetic make-up to have slow metabolisms and become hyperphasic every fall. I currently have a raccoon that is fed ONLY his native diet and he is obese. And he is free roaming, in and out, not caged. He had come every night for the last 7 years and now weighs 34 lbs. It is not uncommon.

1c67bc28f4e44bbb8770b86df0463df3

(6719)

on July 14, 2012
at 08:16 PM

Eat Paleo and Squat, or the terrorists win.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 08:13 PM

I upvoted you for the second part, letting your health speak for itself.

Medium avatar

(3213)

on July 14, 2012
at 08:07 PM

Great question Luke

Medium avatar

(3213)

on July 14, 2012
at 07:45 PM

Wow Heather, well said

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7 Answers

6
45ace03a0eff1219943d746cfb1c4197

(3661)

on July 14, 2012
at 06:53 PM

If they really, truly want to know, take their email addresses and send them a few links when you're at home and relaxed. It's fun to share our enthusiasm with willing friends and family, but if they're not asking, let your health speak for itself.

4b9077bdc5240ddeb48b2125c1bd6265

(158)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:36 PM

+! to let your health speak for itself. I'm still a long way from my goal too so you get the "yeah sure cutting out the processed foods, etc is doing wonders for your waistline." Paint them a picture with the body.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 08:13 PM

I upvoted you for the second part, letting your health speak for itself.

2
5e63e3fa78e998736106a4a5b9aef58c

on July 15, 2012
at 03:28 AM

But do the people you're talking to really want to be informed/educated about paleo? Or are you playing missionary, trying to convert people you believe need to be informed/educated about paleo?

I only talk about paleo to people who show a genuine interest in it. I don't talk it to death, either--I'll gladly email a handful of useful links and a couple of book recommendations, if they'd like to know more and have time to think about it. And I do that because nobody likes a goddamned missionary. Vegan? Mormon? Paleo? Jehovah's Witness? They all provoke the same reactions.

And still--it's really hard for me to not be a missionary, sometimes, so I understand where you're coming from. I know people who are obese and/or chronically ill, and I know they would feel so much better if they'd even just drop wheat and sugar from their diets and do nothing else. I have a neighbor with a big wheat belly, insulin-dependent Type 2, and poor control of his sugars, and I know what would help him--but he doesn't want to hear about it. He can't imagine life without bread or breakfast cereal.

The problem with being a missionary in this particular case is that you're trying to argue/explain using rational evidence, but for most people food is a very emotionally-loaded, irrational aspect of their life. They love bread and sugar, they're hooked on it, they derive comfort from it, and the idea of "giving it up"? "I could never give up bread!" is not a rational statement. Thus, it cannot be argued with rationally. No amount of scientific data is going to get past that emotional barrier.

So I do what I need to do to take care of myself. If others ask about what I'm doing, or what my "secret" is, I'll tell them. If they're sick with an ailment I used to have, I might say, "I had that too, but it went away when I cut out sugar and wheat." And depending on their reaction to that, I'll share as much as they'll willingly let me.

But I can't make anyone want that information. And if they don't want it, all of my attempts to give it to them will be met with resistance. So not only will it be wasted effort, it will be counterproductive, because now there's resistance that didn't exist before.

So yes, I do leave them to keep eating whatever is making them sick and fat because nobody--and certainly not me--likes a goddamned missionary.

2
03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

on July 14, 2012
at 09:10 PM

I eat paleo to feel good :-)

2
04279e3fadb7caef2a9bff98eb09ea36

on July 14, 2012
at 06:02 PM

I think it's best to put diet into the same category as religion and politics - don't discuss it unless you're looking to get into an argument. However, if you want to put things in a nutshell you could mention that the obesity epidemic did not begin until the low fat/high carb movement in the early 80's. Also, vegetarian/vegan diets are based on a lot of observational research which leaves room for many errors. The Paleo diet is based on science that shows exactly how specific macronutrients react when they enter our systems. I prefer science over flawed theories.

Medium avatar

(3213)

on July 14, 2012
at 07:45 PM

Wow Heather, well said

4b9077bdc5240ddeb48b2125c1bd6265

(158)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:40 PM

What I can't work out is why the so called scientists don't use the "science over flawed theories" point of view. Actually I misquoted you by writing science of flawed theories. Maybe I should have left it like that.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 01:42 PM

Scientists are not all of one mind on this issue. And scientists are, despite the actual scientific principles, just as human as the rest of us and prone to see what they want to see.

1
C0fcb48d7da4f76fac17318efd2cd6b8

on July 15, 2012
at 07:29 AM

Because you will reduce the likelihood of shopping in Wallmart whilst pushing a bottle of oxygen around with you.

1
Medium avatar

(3213)

on July 14, 2012
at 07:54 PM

I hate posting links instead of actual answers, but this is great and it condenses all the main reasons for why we eat Primal/Paleo, print the flyer and give it to the people you care about

http://www.marksdailyapple.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/primalblueprintflyer.pdf

0
C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 05:49 PM

Well, I don't like to argue with people about how we eat, but it is vitally important for one's own self to know the reasons they do what they do. I was introduced to paleo long before I gave it a real look because no one could give me a good reason to trust it. What convinced me was my own research into reasons people are fat. No other species on the planet will get fat eating their native foods and living their native lifestyles. It made sense that humans were doing something non-native. I then began to find Dr's doing research into why that is. It takes a lot more for a Dr. to go against conventional wisdom. I then began to look at many of the pseudo foods that humans eat, and the role of grains/carbohydrates in our diet and the negative affects they have. I don't want this to sound long winded, but the evidence is there for eating a whole foods diet. There are details that aren't worth arguing about, but the science backs up that if you eat real meat and real vegetables, you will be healthier.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 09:29 PM

Can I ask where I have said it twice?

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:54 PM

@Raisefitness: You made the same comment in the question about The Rise Of Obesity In The US...Portion Size. My property backs up to park land. I see plenty of obese black bears all year round. If there is a food source, they will not even hibernate, and they will get fatter and fatter. Raisefitness, I do like your posts and answers. I go out of my way to read them, but I have to disagree with you about this one point.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 09:29 PM

Also, bears fatten up, and then lean out, they do not get unhealthily obese like humans.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:04 PM

@raisefitness: I don't know how you are defining native environment, but urban areas have become a coons native environment.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:55 PM

Does the raccoon in question have access to human food waste? I have also seen obese (out of their natural season to be so) animals, but they usually were eating a lot of foods they would not have had access to outside of human inhabited areas.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:04 PM

@Diane: tell that to the raccoon :-) sometimes I thing that raccoons are evolving along the lines of wolves when they were becoming domesticated (the garbage dump theory). I would say humans eating crap are supposed to become obese. That is why it is happening. Raccoons are being fed by humans because their natural environment has been destroyed. When you destroy something's environment and food source, then that is what happens. I don't find it unnatural. This is the way of the world unfortunately

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:13 PM

You have said this twice, and I really take issue with it. The other reason you will not see obese animals has nothing to do with diet. Any obese animal not at the top of the food chain will be more easily killed. Obesity does not bode well for survival out in the wild. Add to that the fact that most wild animals don't live very long anyway (Possums: 2 years, raccoons: 2-3 years) and this is likely the reason you generally don't see very many obese animals.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:10 PM

Raisefitness: Do you have any experience raising/taking care of wildlife? Or are you just arguing for the heck of it. And if urban areas have become their native environment, they by definition those areas are now the native environment. It does not make sense to to say they are not after saying they are.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on July 15, 2012
at 12:48 AM

The raccoon living in an urban, suburban or even rural area where it has access to human foods is NOT living in it's natural environment. That is not the environment it evolved to live in, any more than humans are living in the environment where we evolved. The raccoon AND humans evolved to store fat when given the opportunity in order to survive periods without food. That becomes a problem for both humans and raccoons when the food stuffs available are not suitable to the species and excessively abundant.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:02 PM

@Karen: Raccoons get fat so easily. I have seen coons eat practically nothing and get fat anyway.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:00 PM

@Karen: I don't think he is eating human food. I have nasty neighbors, and they would let me know, and he would not come every night for food if he had another source as I am sure human food tastes much better. As far as I can tell, his home range is pretty small, probably because of the amount of coons in the area. I just can't see him competing with a starving wild coon for food scraps. The food is much easier at my house :-)

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:07 PM

"No other species...will get fat..." Once again, this is NOT TRUE. As someone who has worked with wildlife for over 15 years, I can tell you that I see plenty of obese bears, raccoons, gophers etc. In fact it is part of their genetic make-up to have slow metabolisms and become hyperphasic every fall. I currently have a raccoon that is fed ONLY his native diet and he is obese. And he is free roaming, in and out, not caged. He had come every night for the last 7 years and now weighs 34 lbs. It is not uncommon.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 10:06 PM

yes, urban areas have BECOME their native environment. It is not their native environment. Grains and processed pseudo-foods have become the native human diet.

F9638b939a6f85d67f60065677193cad

(4266)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:42 PM

A bear becoming obese in the fall is what a bear is supposed to do. A human becoming obese is not what a human is supposed to do. A raccoon eating food given to it by a human isn't really what a raccoon is supposed to do.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:12 PM

@raisefitness: Agreed. Grains and pseudo foods have become the native human diet. Not sure what that has to do with obese wild animals...An obese Bear is not an unhealthy Bear. Obese animals are not unhealthy the way obese humans are unhealthy.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:05 PM

@raisefitness: besides, it is not just coons, I have seen fat gophers, bears, possums, etc.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 09:28 PM

So you have a raccoon in the wild fed only his native diet? or is it not in its native environment?

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 10:03 PM

@Raisefitness: define "native environment"

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 15, 2012
at 12:13 AM

@Luke....solid observation. @chinaeskimo....by your own arguments then this paleo way of eating is just hogwash because we now have different sources of native foods, such as transfats, preservatives, etc.

03a4ec34751186201a56da298ac843ce

(4100)

on July 14, 2012
at 09:56 PM

@Raisefitness: Well, I would be hard pressed to define a raccoon's "native" environment, but I take pains to feed him and all my animals an evolutionarily correct diet. This includes lots of gross things like worms, grasshoppers, and my freezer is full of dead whole animals. I also have been known to bring home (fresh) road kill, to everyone's disgust, lol.

C45d7e96acd83d3a6f58193dbc140e86

on July 14, 2012
at 10:01 PM

I understand what you are saying, but that raccoon is NOT in its native environment, and does have access to non native foods. As far as obesity in Humans, for 30 yrs I thought people were fat because they were lazy, or just ate too much. I understand that was incorrect. Humans are not meant to be obese, their our hormones get messed up by the diet they eat. They eat too much and exercise too little also because of the foods that cause them to do such. If we return to our more natural diet, we can fix the hormone problem and the obesity problem.

4b9077bdc5240ddeb48b2125c1bd6265

(158)

on July 14, 2012
at 11:55 PM

Great discussion. Could we draw a parallel between the racoon having an adequate, readily available supply of "native racoon food" (or at least our best scientific guess of same) which may not have been so readily available before being near humans. And that of humans having a ready, energy rich supply, of human food which may not have been so easy to access before the dawn of agriculture? And I guess a further parallel between the evils of the 7/11 and for the racoon the neighbors trashcan (with what is left from the 7/11)?

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