2

votes

Is paleo a big scam?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created March 20, 2013 at 10:36 PM

I just watched this video on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EILS-vuxXD0 . (start at 25:00 for a description of their use of agriculture and meals).

It is about the Ecuadoran Indians, a tribe that dates back to the prehistoric stone age and maintains essentially the same way of life and traditions. Among these are the planting of many gardens filled with starchy plants like manioc (their favorite and part of almost every meal), corn, sweet potatoes, and wild beans...and peanuts (3 of which are on the paleo bad food list).

So, what the hell? Why do people pretend these foods aren't paleo and that agriculture isn't paleo either? Paleo looks more and more like bro science to me. Or willfull ignorance. Or just misinformation.

9605b157f7ae5b131f2e0b244c9b7500

(0)

on September 21, 2013
at 11:19 PM

You sorta answered the question when you said: "a tribe that dates back to the prehistoric stone age and maintains essentially the same way of life and traditions". There is a tribe of Indians (for lack of a better word) that exists almost entirely on Yak milk and butter, they are healthy. Thus we can condition our body and systems to survive on almost anything over thousands of years. Not sure how we would fair on such a radical move.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on September 20, 2013
at 02:20 PM

I can't watch this video - it says, the video is private. Could you please tell me the name so I can search for it? Thanks.

Medium avatar

(238)

on September 20, 2013
at 02:12 PM

Peanuts get the bad rap when in fact many foods have the issue

"Aflatoxins are detected occasionally in milk, cheese, corn, peanuts, cottonseed, nuts, almonds, figs, spices, and a variety of other foods and feeds . Milk, eggs, and meat products are sometimes contaminated because of the animal consumption of aflatoxin-contaminated feed . However, the commodities with the highest risk of aflatoxin contamination are corn, peanuts, and cottonseed."

http://www.ansci.cornell.edu/plants/toxicagents/aflatoxin/aflatoxin.html

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41757)

on September 20, 2013
at 01:59 PM

Peanuts and their products are tested for aflatoxin contamination. There are limits to what can be used for human consumption.

Ae8946707ddebf0f0bfbcfc63276d823

(9402)

on May 22, 2013
at 10:27 AM

+1 http://paleohacks.com/questions/111837/does-being-paleo-come-down-to-faith/111904#111904

2006ccb2b60f9cc5ba5e8eff8a7abc46

(1533)

on April 08, 2013
at 03:27 PM

but it feels sooo good ;) man there is so much beautiful land that has been destroyed by industrial ag. I live in the wheat/bean belly of the inland northwest, hundreds of miles of uninhabited but destroyed prairie that could easily have been better managed and encouraged to proliferate with wildlife.....we fucked that up a LONG time ago unfortunately. the biodiversity has been totally nullified, so the land goes uninhabited by humans and diverse species of plants, animals, insects, fungi and other microorganisms, its disheartening.

33266cca338ab54cee9a2aa160f5bdb6

(502)

on April 08, 2013
at 01:27 PM

We must first take a break from breeding.

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41757)

on March 22, 2013
at 12:34 AM

Exactly, August, it's not likely one single food that's problematic, the current health "crisis" is an incredibly complex multifaceted problem.

3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on March 21, 2013
at 08:31 PM

Doesn't take a rocket scientist. take your best milk producing cows, and breed them for milk. Take your fattest cows and breed them for meat. Few generations later and voila. I do the same thing with the hosta in my garden. The plants that grow big and plentiful flowers get split and added to the bunches with fewer blooms...

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 07:35 PM

I did horribly overeating either rice or wheat. I digested them both easily. All the problems showed up in my bloodstream.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 07:29 PM

I've heard that about wheat and cows @CD, that within a couple hundred years of domestication neither could survive without human intervention. The fact that the techniques traveled so far from their origins amazes me. How did they remember and how did they do it?

3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on March 21, 2013
at 06:40 PM

@StephenR, the prettier the picture... @thhq selective breeding is an ancient practice

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:22 PM

Once the alpha paleos occupied all the optimal sites, the others were forced to survive on whatever was around in the interior. The roots of veganism.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:17 PM

There are way too many of us to go back to grasslands and prairie, and cities occupy a lot of the prime hunt-and-gather sites.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:14 PM

Some people don't even need the books to take on some ridiculous dietary ideas. The authors of the well-known texts get away with a lot. It's all right to challenge conventional wisdom if it's made you sick. However replacing CW with outright fibs is no improvement.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:04 PM

These pictures are good. I'd heard about this but never seen it before. I wonder how much the Amerinds moved the corn precursor towards its present state. And how they did it.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10480)

on March 21, 2013
at 03:41 PM

Someone's been reading some NdGT... :)

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5

(10989)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:53 PM

Answers with pictures always seem to get up voted the most, lol.

7bf306ada57db47547e9da39a415edf6

(11214)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:20 PM

No- most of the world does fine with rice. Many of our ancestors did fine with wheat- before industrialized soy and massive hybridization of wheat. The final straw for the gut may have been the post war rise in Omega-6 oils. Throw enough crap at the gut and the gut will falter- then a whole lot of things become problematic, even if they weren't problematic before.

2e777bbcd49262eb31a24f821abec6bc

(1974)

on March 21, 2013
at 12:29 PM

I agree with this and it seems to me that most people on here don't follow paleo exactly. For example, I do not completely avoid corn and beans but I eat fresh corn instead of corn tortillas etc. This is a great forum because most people share the view that real/whole foods are healthiest but the majority of us seem less focussed on eating paleo on more focussed on eating real foods with lots of micronurients.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 21, 2013
at 06:46 AM

Like I said, my "real" profiLeS that I've designated for proper use gets upvoted ona regular basis. One of them is considered a high ranking member of this site. You've helped me twice today without knowing it...hmm, see if you can guess which questions they were.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:56 AM

Bill? Wow, I did not know you would actually answer. But maybe you are a different Bill Bailey.

A08b210e4da7e69cd792bddc1f4aae4b

(1031)

on March 21, 2013
at 04:59 AM

Yhep, a diet of fresh, whole, organic foods consisting of veggies, fruit, meat, fish, eggs and dairy is a terrible scam. I feel so taken in by the whole dang conspiracy. I want my money back!

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5

(10989)

on March 21, 2013
at 04:06 AM

People throw around the word brosci as a discreditor but I'd listen to a lot of bro scientists before I'd listen to a lot of mds.

Medium avatar

(39831)

on March 21, 2013
at 03:27 AM

Also, don't ignore the contributions of sis-scientists.

Medium avatar

(39831)

on March 21, 2013
at 03:27 AM

Can't a guy be a bro as well as a scientist, brah?

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 02:18 AM

Speak for yourself about strongbeauty....I'm more the strongbad type...

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 02:15 AM

It sounds like the Ecuadoreans are farmers, so they wouldn't be strictly hunter gatherers. Where I live in WA the tribes were closer to true hunter gatherers, though by setting forest fires and create savannas and clearings they functioned sort of like farmers. This cleared habitat for game and openings for wild berries and edible root plants. Around here baskets are the real tip-off. Very elegant Neolithic work. Wet site fragments around here date back 3000-4000 years and are unchanged in technique compared to 100 year old pieces.

0f6f5440163056aeeffcc7ec0425a837

(80)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:47 AM

Side note: I don't know the exact numbers for this particular group, but normally those extremely low life expectancies reflect infant and young child mortality, which is often very high in small-scale societies. Usually you want to look at life expectancy for a person who makes it to 15--it gives a better sense of the healthfulness of the group's practices (confounded with extrinsic dangers, like violence or famine, of course). For most small scale societies, that's usually somewhere in the 60's.

3a9d5dde5212ccd34b860bb6ed07bbef

(1782)

on March 20, 2013
at 10:48 PM

Oh. Thank you. So they must have started farming 10,000 years ago? Which is technically after the paleolithic period. So they're not paleo...just hunter gatherer's, right?

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23 Answers

10
3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on March 20, 2013
at 11:43 PM

"stone age" crops are not equal to modern day crops.

For example, corn: 6,000 years ago an ear is only 2 to 3 inches long with five to 12 kernels--compare that to corn's 12-inch ear that boasts 500 or more kernels

Legumes are probably not the worse thing you can eat, especially properly prepared. And Peanuts -- My only problem with peanuts is I cannot stop eating them. Personally, I put them in the category of peas and green beans -- harmless legumes.

3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on March 21, 2013
at 06:40 PM

@StephenR, the prettier the picture... @thhq selective breeding is an ancient practice

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:04 PM

These pictures are good. I'd heard about this but never seen it before. I wonder how much the Amerinds moved the corn precursor towards its present state. And how they did it.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5

(10989)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:53 PM

Answers with pictures always seem to get up voted the most, lol.

3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on March 21, 2013
at 08:31 PM

Doesn't take a rocket scientist. take your best milk producing cows, and breed them for milk. Take your fattest cows and breed them for meat. Few generations later and voila. I do the same thing with the hosta in my garden. The plants that grow big and plentiful flowers get split and added to the bunches with fewer blooms...

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 07:29 PM

I've heard that about wheat and cows @CD, that within a couple hundred years of domestication neither could survive without human intervention. The fact that the techniques traveled so far from their origins amazes me. How did they remember and how did they do it?

7
59fa7cd87fb9d669adf21e5cf3e7ada5

on March 20, 2013
at 10:47 PM

It is only a scam if you spend money to buy the (e)books.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:14 PM

Some people don't even need the books to take on some ridiculous dietary ideas. The authors of the well-known texts get away with a lot. It's all right to challenge conventional wisdom if it's made you sick. However replacing CW with outright fibs is no improvement.

7
Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 20, 2013
at 10:44 PM

The prehistoric stone age in Ecuador is post-Paleo. While I do not disagree that ancient paleos would have subsisted on anything they could eat, the agricultural traditions of the Amerinds were imported via migration 10,000 years age. Basketmaking and cooking methods of neolithic central Anatolia ca 9000 BC are very similar to American tribes.

3a9d5dde5212ccd34b860bb6ed07bbef

(1782)

on March 20, 2013
at 10:48 PM

Oh. Thank you. So they must have started farming 10,000 years ago? Which is technically after the paleolithic period. So they're not paleo...just hunter gatherer's, right?

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 02:15 AM

It sounds like the Ecuadoreans are farmers, so they wouldn't be strictly hunter gatherers. Where I live in WA the tribes were closer to true hunter gatherers, though by setting forest fires and create savannas and clearings they functioned sort of like farmers. This cleared habitat for game and openings for wild berries and edible root plants. Around here baskets are the real tip-off. Very elegant Neolithic work. Wet site fragments around here date back 3000-4000 years and are unchanged in technique compared to 100 year old pieces.

6
07d8ff43993e6739451e58ae7459cfe2

on March 21, 2013
at 12:25 AM

The historical narrative and paleo identity is not as important as the nutritional science. This group of folks tends to feel better eating and exercising a certain way so whether or not our myth of origins is somewhat inaccurate, we still enjoy the effects.

Most people's health/diet beliefs include certain mythologies and historical assumptions that could easily be questioned. Ours is no different.

Also, if paleo was a scam, we wouldn't have such strong, beautiful bodies.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 02:18 AM

Speak for yourself about strongbeauty....I'm more the strongbad type...

Ae8946707ddebf0f0bfbcfc63276d823

(9402)

on May 22, 2013
at 10:27 AM

+1 http://paleohacks.com/questions/111837/does-being-paleo-come-down-to-faith/111904#111904

6
048dd52752c45129c1212bfffb37ca72

on March 20, 2013
at 11:43 PM

I think that not everyone may understand paleo as the very same thing, and depending on this it may be considered or not a scam. If you see Paleo as an eating style that encourages the consumption of real food like the one your grandmother would have recognised as food, and throwing away most of the junk that plagues the society today, I think that is difficult to say that it could be a scam, that seems pretty good advice to me and difficult to go wrong with it... But if you enter the great dilemma of whether every single food is strictly or not paleo and throw everything away just because some study "may suggest" that everything is bad or that our ancestors weren't eating it for sure... then maybe we could be getting it wrong. I guess the best option may be to know Paleo and see what works best for you and adopt the best practices that make sense to you and are leading you to success, be it Paleo or some other flavour of dieting/eating style.

2e777bbcd49262eb31a24f821abec6bc

(1974)

on March 21, 2013
at 12:29 PM

I agree with this and it seems to me that most people on here don't follow paleo exactly. For example, I do not completely avoid corn and beans but I eat fresh corn instead of corn tortillas etc. This is a great forum because most people share the view that real/whole foods are healthiest but the majority of us seem less focussed on eating paleo on more focussed on eating real foods with lots of micronurients.

4
Medium avatar

on March 21, 2013
at 06:06 PM

The part where you eat nutritious, unrefined whole foods and stop getting fat and feeling awful? Obviously not a scam LOL.

The part where you give your money to some huckster for a book, e-book, consultation, seminar, special paleo supplement, t-shirt etc. etc.? You fucking kidding me? Massive scam. The rapidly expanding paleo industry is a disgrace. All the info you need is free and readily available. Spend your diet-allocated dollars on good food and if you feel like you want to support someone, hand the $29.99 or whatever to your favorite homeless person.

4
C28ae8c7a12a730363835acf21e962a2

(715)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:19 AM

i honestly couldn't care less about what foods are pre-neolithic, if people 500,000 years ago ate tubers, etc. i don't follow this diet to mimic what my ancestors ate. i follow it because i feel it is the most optimal for my health and well being, and eating this way is how i feel best. in fact, it's little more then coincidence that the way i eat happens to fall in line with the paleolithic mindset.

3
Cc3ce03985eac5ebcbb95fc2329f13b0

on March 21, 2013
at 02:51 AM

Um, then don't follow it. The foods they grew likely don't resemble the ones we have today. But the proof is in your results. I get results from Paleo, therefore I continue. If you don't, well there's a lot of other things for you to do.

And scam? I haven't paid for anything other than food and a gym pass, so pretty crappy scam. The books are in the library, and there's tons of info online.

3
2006ccb2b60f9cc5ba5e8eff8a7abc46

on March 20, 2013
at 11:51 PM

i lived and farmed with a Quechan Indian whos family live on and farms land in Equador. Their lifestyle is totally different and he was blown away at how we work out here. He had no real concept of time, slept a lot, ate a SHIT ton of potatoes, snacked often, farted a lot and lost a lot of weight due to how hard we worked. They farm things like guinue pigs and chickens for food in equador and eat the whole animal, so they definitely get the benefit of offal, which even a lot of folks who eat "paleo" miss out on. but even still he knew his diet wasnt ideal. I would eat like a pound of meat a day and he would look at my bowl and say "Jessica some day I want to eat like you!"

fuck man they barely have access to organic seeds down there unless they save their own, which is hard, they have bad seasons, seeds are food too. they struggle with a lot of less then ideal situations, but are happy people, I wish there was some way to change the paradigm of how we do things as a species.

even as a farmer I have to admit agriculture is not paleo, nor is organic sustainable agriculture and grassfed graising ideal. protecting and rehabbing wildlands and prairies so that wildlife can grow healthy and abundant is, but for a multitude of reasons that will never catch on not saying I don't dream that I will, just being realisitic.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:17 PM

There are way too many of us to go back to grasslands and prairie, and cities occupy a lot of the prime hunt-and-gather sites.

2006ccb2b60f9cc5ba5e8eff8a7abc46

(1533)

on April 08, 2013
at 03:27 PM

but it feels sooo good ;) man there is so much beautiful land that has been destroyed by industrial ag. I live in the wheat/bean belly of the inland northwest, hundreds of miles of uninhabited but destroyed prairie that could easily have been better managed and encouraged to proliferate with wildlife.....we fucked that up a LONG time ago unfortunately. the biodiversity has been totally nullified, so the land goes uninhabited by humans and diverse species of plants, animals, insects, fungi and other microorganisms, its disheartening.

33266cca338ab54cee9a2aa160f5bdb6

(502)

on April 08, 2013
at 01:27 PM

We must first take a break from breeding.

2
Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5

(10989)

on March 21, 2013
at 03:48 AM

Yep, it's a scam, but notice the fucked up teeth of these folks. Missing crooked and just fucked up. These guys wouldn't of passed WAP's standards and tbh I get it's because they don't have a great source of calcium (seafood or dairy). The way I see it is this, paleo is the best directional diet, other than wapf. To me it makes since to eat dairy, tubers, seafood and meat along with adequate water. Grains mess me up, maybe some tolerate them maybe not. Legumes n seeds n shiz, f that.

I see that there is an optimal diet and that optimal diet differs from person to person, that optimal diet shares a lot of ground with paleo, but that optimal diet probably isn't paleo. Is paleo a scam or a fad? Who cares, people here want to improve their health and I'd suggest paleo or vegan, so since vegetarian has been here f so long, I don't expect aloe to go anywhere anytime soon.

2
9a5e2da94ad63ea3186dfa494e16a8d1

on March 21, 2013
at 01:09 AM

The basic idea is that humans evolved for at least 200,000 years, maybe 250,000 years, without any agriculture, subsisting on non-agriculture foods, basically readily available meats and plants and those that needed minimal prep and processing. So our genes are geared towards this diet. This doesn't mean that we can't eat an agriculture-based diet nor that there aren't cultures that do, just that this isn't optimal and everyone will have varying levels of problems with it.

Agriculture allowed for the establishment of many cultures, and the ones that we can observe today either in person or through artifacts probably had some element of agriculture, otherwise we probably wouldn't hear about them. In other words, real hunter-gatherer cultures which represent 97%+ of our evolutionary history are long gone (with few exceptions).

The Ecuadorian Indians had a somewhat Paleo, somewhat non-Paleo diet, but it also was devoid of most modern foods that many consider staples (bread, pasta, french fries, cliff bars, cookies, crackers, etc). So I think this was in some ways superior to modern diets but in some ways inferior. However, their life expectancy was about 21 years. Think about that, 21 years. So the culture is ancient, but not very healthy.

The point of the Paleo diet it not for us to act exactly like these people, who probably lived and live short, miserable lives. The point is to eat a diet that we were programmed to eat through many millenia. If these Ecuadorian Indians had access to high omega 3 meats and seafood and a wide array of fruits and vegetables, they would probably have lived for more than 21 years and would probably have developed technologies beyond the Stone Age.

0f6f5440163056aeeffcc7ec0425a837

(80)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:47 AM

Side note: I don't know the exact numbers for this particular group, but normally those extremely low life expectancies reflect infant and young child mortality, which is often very high in small-scale societies. Usually you want to look at life expectancy for a person who makes it to 15--it gives a better sense of the healthfulness of the group's practices (confounded with extrinsic dangers, like violence or famine, of course). For most small scale societies, that's usually somewhere in the 60's.

2
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 20, 2013
at 10:40 PM

Does it say anything about their health? How do you know they wouldn be even hnealthier if they adopted a more 'pure' paleo diet?

Also, those foods aren't the most anti-paleo foods out there. Sweet potato is borderline paleo, beans and peanuts are legumes which arent as bad as grains.

Corn isnt the worst kind of grain either.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 21, 2013
at 06:46 AM

Like I said, my "real" profiLeS that I've designated for proper use gets upvoted ona regular basis. One of them is considered a high ranking member of this site. You've helped me twice today without knowing it...hmm, see if you can guess which questions they were.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:56 AM

Bill? Wow, I did not know you would actually answer. But maybe you are a different Bill Bailey.

1
96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19413)

on March 21, 2013
at 10:54 AM

[sarcasm] Yes, paleo is a scam, there's a big shadowy CIA run government group trying to get everyone off grains, beans, chemicals, and crap in a box. After all, we're from your government and are really here to help you. Wake up vegans! [/sarcasm]

Unless you can trace your lineage back to those specific Ecuadoran Indians, eating like them might or might not be beneficial to you.

But you can be certain that eating wheat, modern GMO corn, soy (GMO or otherwise), industrial seed oils, artificial colorants, flavors, and occluded forms of MSG, and other highly processed crap is not going to be in your best interest.

We do know that for most humans beans aren't anywhere near as harmful as modern wheat. We know for most humans that nightshades such as potatoes, tomatoes, and eggplants aren't as harmful as modern wheat. That doesn't mean that it's optimally healthy to eat beans or night shades, there's always some cost.

If it's true that these folks ate beans for the last hundred thousand years, they may have some adaptation, but you can say the same of dairy - only some populations are lactose tolerant, but many who are lactose tolerant have issues with specific forms of casein. I'm one of those. I've no issues with lactose, but if I eat any amount of cow dairy above a couple of ounces, I get acid reflux that night. If however I switch to sheep, goat, or buffalo, no issues - and there are even some forms of cow dairy that I can consume without issue (certain Haagen Dazs ice creams).

Now, just because I can consume dairy and don't get doesn't mean it has no ill effects. I almost always notice small body acne a day after - so there's still a price to pay. The same is true of beans. Just because you can cook them and eat them without getting immediately sick, doesn't mean it won't have negative effects in the long term.

Also saying that they "essentially" maintain the same way of life isn't the same way as saying they maintain exactly the same way of life. This is one of those weasel words that lets you get away with presenting a misleading idea, especially when small differences in way of life can have huge impacts on health. For example, if you change nothing in your life other than you start eating very tiny amounts of arsenic, you are essentially doing the same exact things - but your health will immediately begin to suffer.

Is that a scam? That's the beautiful thing about science, it works whether you believe it's a scam, or not.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10480)

on March 21, 2013
at 03:41 PM

Someone's been reading some NdGT... :)

1
F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:55 AM

Thanks for the link. I watched it with great interest.

Some questions come to mind.

  1. Were they always planting manioc and sweet potatoes? I highly doubt it. I bet it took them thousands of years to discover all those starchy tubers, to develop planting techniques and to master them beyond perfection. Have you noticed the big metal cauldrons they were using for cooking their starches? There is no way they would have had them even 500 years ago.

  2. Another question. Why did they start planting all those starches if, obviously, they weren't doing it from the start? My guess is starches and tubers are a reliable source of nutrition. Noticed that I did not say "nutritionally dense", only "reliable". So they traded in nutritional density for predictability and satiety.

  3. I also noticed their narrowed jaws and missing teeth. It did not look to me as if those teeth were lost in a battle, although who knows, maybe they use hand-to-hand combat or some traditional boxing techniques. If they lived closer to the sea and had access to seafood, I wonder if their teeth would look better.

Anyway, thank you for your question. No, Paleo is not a fad diet. But it does not mean that humans are not made to survive on starches. Humans are omnivores and we evolved to eat anything that moves or stays still, but movable. And that's the beauty of it. To me, Paleo is a way to optimal nutrition and consuming foods that are nutritionally dense. But I am sure Paleo is different for everyone.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 05:22 PM

Once the alpha paleos occupied all the optimal sites, the others were forced to survive on whatever was around in the interior. The roots of veganism.

0
13f174d097c9293ed7d079dba783217c

on September 20, 2013
at 12:05 PM

peanuts are NOT good for you at all, they're full of aflatoxins, which is a mycotoxin, which is a microscopic mold/fungus that grows on them when they're in the soil... plus of course the lectins and phytates from being a legume, peanuts just aren't healthy at all. And again, even if a group "lives" off a food, doesn't mean it's the most ideal and healthy way of eating. The inuits live off basically 0 carb for 80-90% of the year, they survive, but it's not the most ideal diet.

Medium avatar

(238)

on September 20, 2013
at 02:12 PM

Peanuts get the bad rap when in fact many foods have the issue

"Aflatoxins are detected occasionally in milk, cheese, corn, peanuts, cottonseed, nuts, almonds, figs, spices, and a variety of other foods and feeds . Milk, eggs, and meat products are sometimes contaminated because of the animal consumption of aflatoxin-contaminated feed . However, the commodities with the highest risk of aflatoxin contamination are corn, peanuts, and cottonseed."

http://www.ansci.cornell.edu/plants/toxicagents/aflatoxin/aflatoxin.html

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41757)

on September 20, 2013
at 01:59 PM

Peanuts and their products are tested for aflatoxin contamination. There are limits to what can be used for human consumption.

0
Medium avatar

(20)

on September 20, 2013
at 03:10 AM

Yes...paleo is a scam - for that matter everything is a scam - life is a scam. Well that about sums it up for all who want the definitive yes or no answer, now can I go back to eating my hamburger sans bun.

0
7e13e284a1bafd7b4de14a50ee96140c

on March 21, 2013
at 06:17 PM

not a scam but not the end/truth/final solution to diets

0
2a00b9a42e4cb6e489a0e69d20714576

on March 21, 2013
at 05:27 PM

Maybe its time we all got off this blog and just lived. In the pursuit of perfect health were missing out on the real world. Props to Matt Stone. Although I would never consume junk. Nutritious, whole foods in large quantities are hugely restoritve. Including dairy and chocolate (Giddy Yo Yo) and ice cream. And whatever else makes you happy and relaxed.

0
254ea62982c287995e11bc3cfd629407

(822)

on March 21, 2013
at 04:06 PM

Alligator,

Not sure if you're just trolling or really want to know, but if you do take a deeper look at the community, there are a large (and growing) population of people with credible degrees in medicine, biology, nutrition, biochemistry and the like who really work to find evidence-based reasons to the theory of the Paleo diet.

Sure, on the surface, it's a pretty big stretch to easily embrace the notion to simply eat what paleolithic man did "because that's what we are evolved to eat". But, if you start with the idea that maybe -- just maybe, heavily processed foods, with lots of additives and use oils which used industrial-grade methods of extraction, aren't good for you, you've made a pretty big push into the "paleo-sphere".

Next, you start looking at at the evidence - derived mostly from published academic and medical studies of diseases, nutrition and physiology, you begin to see some of the additional aspects of the diet - gluten and phytoestrogens (eschewing wheat,soybeans), insulin sensitivity (starchy carbs, sugar), etc.

Lastly, I think the community is very careful about large, sweeping generalizations, especially with antecedal evidence or "n=1" (e.g. "I drink three gallons of buttermilk a day and I'm doing great!") kinds of pronouncements.

Additionally, I was very happy to see a LARGE number of people calling out a "guru" when that person unveiled a set of "paleo" products (meal replacement shakes and the like). To me, that told me that this isn't some kind of diet with a community of people blindly following whatever gimmick du jour was.

0
C5c1073ffc65c5b737408d1d6cc68e86

on March 21, 2013
at 01:42 PM

Can't we all just get along. In the words of Michael Pollan:

"Eat [real] food, not too much, mostly plants."

Let's also remember, every BODY is different. The root of all of this is to find what is best for MY body. We all know that we are splitting hairs here. A stomach that is not gluten-intolerant will not react in the same way as one that is. Sure, grains may cause inflammation in general (perhaps in every BODY), but some will handle it negatively, some will respond "normally."

But we all know, REAL FOOD is always better than HIGHLY-PROCESSED "FAKE" FOODS.

That's my rant. Just getting tired of us attacking each other over the minisule things. Focus on the BIG PICTURE!

0
32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41757)

on March 21, 2013
at 12:34 PM

In the absence of gut permeability, I don't see any of those foods as particularly problematic. Most of the world does fine on wheat, how does paleo explain that? There's a proposal out there that there's just lots of silent or asympotomatic intolerance out there, but in the absence of symptoms isn't it more likely that wheat is simply tolerated? Replace wheat with most any other paleo-verboten whole-food.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on March 21, 2013
at 07:35 PM

I did horribly overeating either rice or wheat. I digested them both easily. All the problems showed up in my bloodstream.

7bf306ada57db47547e9da39a415edf6

(11214)

on March 21, 2013
at 01:20 PM

No- most of the world does fine with rice. Many of our ancestors did fine with wheat- before industrialized soy and massive hybridization of wheat. The final straw for the gut may have been the post war rise in Omega-6 oils. Throw enough crap at the gut and the gut will falter- then a whole lot of things become problematic, even if they weren't problematic before.

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46

(41757)

on March 22, 2013
at 12:34 AM

Exactly, August, it's not likely one single food that's problematic, the current health "crisis" is an incredibly complex multifaceted problem.

0
32652cb696b75182cb121009ee4edea3

(5802)

on March 21, 2013
at 12:23 PM

"Traditional" foods such as those eaten by many people around the world are definitely superior to SAD. I'm even willing to say that most of them may be completely healthy for people who have eaten that way since day 1 of their lives. However, for those of us damaged by a lifetime of SAD, just cleaning up our diet to "traditional" may not be enough. (Speaking from experience here ... 4 years on Weston Price style diet with no benefit). People gravitate to paleo because it works.

Also, part of the "traditional" diets of most people is a huge amount of exercise. Not crossfit, but just walking, lifting, carrying, walking, dancing, etc. They can eat those starches with the constant activity they have. Reminds me of my college days when I didn't have a car, and walked about 10 miles a day. I ate junk, and was skinny as a rail (not my natural state - I was a fat child).

I have a neighbor across the street who is an immigrant from china. Her parents live with her most of the year (they have to go back to china periodically). They don't speak a word of english other than, "hello!" I have learned so much from watching them. Every morning they are up and out about 7, walking. (They are very elderly, btw). They walk for an hour or so. Then in the afternoon they are out walking with their grandchildren. In the evening the whole family goes out again, for an hour or two. Total, they are out walking probably 3 hours every day! And the grandmother spends the afternoons outside hanging laundry to dry in the garage, or fluffing bedlinens outside. They literally never stop moving. They make me feel guilty. :)

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