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Design me some seafood meal plans/look over my supplement plan

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created April 18, 2013 at 3:36 PM

I'm looking mostly to achieve weight loss, get my digestion and insulin sensitivity back in line and to minimize inflammation. I have persistent adult acne and achy joints so trying to avoid eggs, nightshades etc. I'm looking to do a plan that only includes seafood, veggies and a bit of fruit (maybe). With the experimenting I've been doing it seems to me that a higher fat, moderate carb and moderate protein ratio works for me.

I've no idea what the actual exact ratios etc break down into but I'm eating roughly 1200-1500 calories a day, 50-100g of carbs (some yams, some fruit, mostly non-starchy veggies) and only about 2 100g servings of various meats a day, so usually maybe 40-60g of protein. The rest is various fats. Eating meat dominated meals just makes me a ravenous beast and I can't be eating 3 steaks a day on my budget.

So if you were going to do a seafood and organic veggies/fruit diet (while being reasonable, say no higher than $50 a week in groceries) how many types of seafood/veggies would you aim for in a week to get a good nutrient profile while not being extravagant?

Anything goes, clams, mussels, squid, prawns, fish...heck I even like jellyfish. Don't mind repetition either---just want good nutrition for the best price.

Supplement-wise

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on April 19, 2013
at 09:28 AM

Just updated with a screenshot. You prompted me to have a look again.

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:50 AM

Oooh, I also cook a lot of brussel sprouts, I shave them really thin with a potato peeler and stir-fry for one minute or so. 15 brussel sprouts per serving, maybe? About 242.3 mg vitamin C! (Sorry, I'm on a roll now, I love calculating nutrients ;P)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:46 AM

Oh, I would probably add 2 kiwis to that fruit salad :D (85mg vit C each)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:42 AM

In the summer a typical day of vegetables goes: breakfast: fruit salad (2 oranges, half cup sliced strawberries). A side dish for lunch could be gently stir fried 2 cups zucchini, 2 cups summer squash, 2 cups cherry tomatoes (volume reduces a lot after cooking). Then for dinner I could have 1/4 cup sauerkraut fermented with whey (I massage a very large cabbage for 30 minutes so the volume reduces to fit a quart jar with a lot of room to spare, original 1/4 cup volume of sauerkraut is about 1 cup). That day would be about 408.6 mg vitamin C. Not bad, I'd say :)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:31 AM

One red and one yellow bell pepper puts me at 550mg vit C, and that's just breakfast. Wouldn't grass fed whey have k2? And fermented vegetables? (or even better, vegetables fermented with whey). Pastured eggs have k2 too. Doesn't bone broth have k2? Thankfully my heritage means I eat a lot of grass fed hard cheese, like 100g or 200g per day... when I can get my hands on some! :)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:43 PM

Might want to get blood tests instead of supplementing blindly. You say you want to eat more fish/seafood than meat, so if you pick oily fish you'll get a lot of vitamin D, not to mention all the other nutrients in the fish that the vitamin D supplement doesn't have ;-)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:42 PM

Oh in addition to that 6oz of fish I also eat one can of cod liver egg salad once per week or every two weeks. That's even more vitamin D :)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:40 PM

http://www.skincancer.org/healthy-lifestyle/vitamin-d/oily-fish-your-route-to-vitamin-d (we eat about 6oz every day or every other day)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:39 PM

http://www.westonaprice.org/fat-soluble-activators/x-factor-is-vitamin-k2#foods

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:38 PM

You can have bone broth for calcium. I have a little every day. Supplement calcium is dangerous. And you don't need as much calcium as RDA says you do. Where I am we have very little sunlight like Canada. Oily fishes have vitamin D. Since your budget is a bit more generous than mine you might be able to eat some organic food. However, I would prefer to get all my nutrients and minerals even if I need to sacrifice the organic label. @Mash would you say supplementing is still useful if you have a very tight budget? Those $30/bottle supplements would let you buy enough food to reach your target

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on April 18, 2013
at 07:32 PM

Though I agree with your post completely, I think supplementing is still useful. I looked at my eating every day on cronometer in comparison to vitamin and mineral recommendations and they weren't quite there. More so they might actually be even lower, soil etc. E.g. Even with all the butter I eat, K2 could be better which was surprising. Supplements are that, supplementary support. Eat first, supplement after. Liver is a must though, surperfood indeed.

3d026326a7512616b108c9a1b2086bef

(78)

on April 18, 2013
at 07:13 PM

I live in Canada, so sunlight (in quantities enough to make adequate D3) is hard to come by and might only be able to be done for a few months of the year so I supplement instead. I don't tolerate dairy in any form, so I need some calcium supplementation. Organic for me is important to me and I have noticed an improvement when I eat mostly organic in terms of my hormonal symptoms, and considering those symptoms plague me two weeks out of the month (plus the horrendous bleeding) its important to get those out of control. But I will look into some good organic grassfed etc liver :)

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3 Answers

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19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 05:27 PM

Forget organic. Forget supplements. It seems like most of your budget will go towards supplements, leaving barely anything for food. If you're using a separate budget for supplements... think about it, why not just add that money to your food budget so you can get your nutrients without supplementation?

Buy chicken or beef liver. This takes care of your B vitamins if you eat them at least 3 times per week. It's very cheap and filling. In two weeks I eat: 6 ounces cod liver, half pound chicken liver, one or two pounds beef liver. I find these to be more filling than other meats and they're also pretty cheap, yet a lot more nutritious.

More on liver nutrition:
http://freetheanimal.com/2011/04/nutrition-density-challenge-fruit-vs-beef-liver.html
http://chriskresser.com/natures-most-potent-superfood

Liver recipes:
Beef and liver meatballs
http://www.thepaleomom.com/2012/05/recipe-turkish-hidden-liver-meatballs.html
(I just bake these in the oven, but I have to try cooking in a pan too. After baking them I freeze and remove only as many as I need for each meal)

Several suggestions here, for big babies:
http://realfoodfreaks.com/2013/02/21/eating-liver-a-primer-for-big-babies/

Once you get used to liver, try this dumpling recipe:
http://nuttykitchen.com/2012/03/06/liver-dumplings-for-soup-leberknoedel/

More recipes:
http://thecoconutmama.com/2012/11/think-offal-is-awful-sneak-it-into-your-food/


It's so nice to get so much liver in my diet, without gagging... would make any mother proud ;-)

Get vitamin d from the sun now that the weather is getting warmer. If you really must buy vitamin d ... do it when autumn or winter comes. Eating a lot of oily fish and cod liver, I don't supplement anymore, unless I go a few weeks without eating those foods. In autumn and winter I supplement every other day.

Buy a big tub of coconut oil as big as you can afford.
Go to your favorite store and ask for beef suet, learn to render it into tallow (slice it with a knife and put it in the crockpot at lowest heat until the suet melts, about 4 hours?).
Buy a large bag of individually frozen salmon fillets, that will also help with vitamin d. Cook the salmon in coconut oil (two 3oz fillets with 3 tbsp of oil, then more oil for the vegetables), it's really tasty.

Your main vegetables (based on what I see is cheap around here), could be sweet potatoes, frozen spinach, frozen peas, onions, carrots, green cabbage, and maybe red cabbage. Then each time you visit the store look around for good prices on other fruit or vegetables.

When we're way overdue to go shopping (grr!, that paycheck!), we end up eating vegetables like this (per person):
* 2 sliced carrots and 1 sliced onion stir fried in 3 tbsp tallow
* one cubed sweet potato cooked in 3 tbsp tallow, at the end add peas and mix together
* about half cup sliced red cabbage and 1 cup sliced red onion stir fried in 3 tbsp tallow with balsamic vinegar
* half cup sliced green cabbage and half cup sliced carrots stir fried in 3 tbsp lard or bacon grease
* 1/4 cup frozen spinach creamed in 3 tbsp butter, 1 cup cubed sweet potato cooked in chicken stock


Try to buy beef and chicken meat that still has the bones. After you cook, save the bones in the freezer and when you have a full gallon ziplock, make broth. The broth will last you two weeks and is very nutritious, providing calcium and k2.

Meat makes you ravenous... what are we talking about here? Baked chicken breast and steamed vegetables? Or chuck steak cooked in 3-4 tablespoons of tallow, then vegetables cooked in another 3 tablespoons of coconut oil? There's a big difference. I would be starving with the chicken breast too!

Our budget is nearly zero (:P), and we manage to eat beef and salmon every day or every other day. We eat two meals per day, no snacks. About 2 pieces of meat, about two pieces of fish. We have active/physical jobs and are never ravenous. To avoid hunger, we cook our food in about 4-5 or 6 spoons of saturated fat. We don't eat snacks.
If isn't paleo meals that are expensive, it's snacks.

Since you already buy organic you probably know better than me about what sorts of fish/seafood is available. I can't imagine fitting any organic fish and seafood into such a tight budget. It's already expensive enough to buy it farmed and non-organic.

How do you know eggs and nightshades give you acne and achy joints? I have those symptoms too, but not from eggs or nightshades.
If you're going to eliminate nightshades and eggs because of acne and joint pain, then you probably shouldn't eat nuts, seeds, raw greens, and natural sugars either.

The only supplement on your list I would take is the k2, unless you eat grass fed dairy.

But I don't think you need those supplements on paleo, even with your budget. You'll get all those from diet, and your hormones will get better. Your budget seems very generous to someone like me, I wish I had $200/month just for my own food :-) For us it's about $125 per person per month.

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:42 PM

Oh in addition to that 6oz of fish I also eat one can of cod liver egg salad once per week or every two weeks. That's even more vitamin D :)

3d026326a7512616b108c9a1b2086bef

(78)

on April 18, 2013
at 07:13 PM

I live in Canada, so sunlight (in quantities enough to make adequate D3) is hard to come by and might only be able to be done for a few months of the year so I supplement instead. I don't tolerate dairy in any form, so I need some calcium supplementation. Organic for me is important to me and I have noticed an improvement when I eat mostly organic in terms of my hormonal symptoms, and considering those symptoms plague me two weeks out of the month (plus the horrendous bleeding) its important to get those out of control. But I will look into some good organic grassfed etc liver :)

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on April 18, 2013
at 07:32 PM

Though I agree with your post completely, I think supplementing is still useful. I looked at my eating every day on cronometer in comparison to vitamin and mineral recommendations and they weren't quite there. More so they might actually be even lower, soil etc. E.g. Even with all the butter I eat, K2 could be better which was surprising. Supplements are that, supplementary support. Eat first, supplement after. Liver is a must though, surperfood indeed.

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:40 PM

http://www.skincancer.org/healthy-lifestyle/vitamin-d/oily-fish-your-route-to-vitamin-d (we eat about 6oz every day or every other day)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:38 PM

You can have bone broth for calcium. I have a little every day. Supplement calcium is dangerous. And you don't need as much calcium as RDA says you do. Where I am we have very little sunlight like Canada. Oily fishes have vitamin D. Since your budget is a bit more generous than mine you might be able to eat some organic food. However, I would prefer to get all my nutrients and minerals even if I need to sacrifice the organic label. @Mash would you say supplementing is still useful if you have a very tight budget? Those $30/bottle supplements would let you buy enough food to reach your target

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:43 PM

Might want to get blood tests instead of supplementing blindly. You say you want to eat more fish/seafood than meat, so if you pick oily fish you'll get a lot of vitamin D, not to mention all the other nutrients in the fish that the vitamin D supplement doesn't have ;-)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 18, 2013
at 08:39 PM

http://www.westonaprice.org/fat-soluble-activators/x-factor-is-vitamin-k2#foods

1
Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on April 18, 2013
at 04:36 PM

From what I understand supplementing a B-Complex daily is a waste of money since you cannot store water-soluble vitamins and will urinate out the excess. Supplementation weekly is sufficient. Also I understand B12 (Methylcobalamin) that is far better than B12 (Cyanccobalamin) which is in the SwissNatural product. Try: http://www.jarrow.com/product/57/B-Right

Calcium supplementation is problematic, and is zinc/copper balance is important.

The Jaminet's have an extensive chapter on supplementation, and pretty much convinced me to try and purchase vitamins separately rather than multis.

http://perfecthealthdiet.com/recommended-supplements/

I generally eat salmon three times a week (around 700g total), and about three to four cans of sardines. I also aim to get at least three cups of colourful vegetables in per day, not including sweet potatoes, garlic, onions, etc. I am yet to include liver in my weekly eating, but hope to start the habit soon.

After looking at http://www.cronometer.com and the micronutrients I was getting, I choose the following supplementation. Just this weekend I looked and realised there was little point in spending money on fish-oil and would rather spend the money on more fish.

If it's of any interest I take the following:
[NOW] Vitamin D3 5000 IU............: 1 x daily
[NOW] Vitamin C 500mg...............: 1 x daily
[NOW] Vitamin K2 MK-7 100mcg........: 1 x daily
[NOW] Kelp 150mcg Iodine............: 1 x daily
[NOW] Magnesium Citrate 200mg.......: 1 x daily (before bed)
[Jarrow] B-Right B Complex..........: 1 x weekly (Sunday)

I have recently upped my total groceries purchase (more veg and fish) and need to see how it breaks down per day. I follow the PHD general recommendations for meat, starch, fat and just scale up fat and starch on my workout days.

I can imagine though that it is close to $12 per day most days, but I do live in London, England.

19.04 Update: Luisa prompted me to have another look at micronutrients this morning to see whether I had miscalculated. Generally only eat two meals a day (13:00, 21:00) and looking again I do actually get enough, even with K2, though I could do better with Vitamin C and need to include some fruit (screenshot didn't have blueberries). Though it does show that you have to eat well to be nourished, which is why I need to add liver and make time for bone-broth (and fermented). I live in shared accommodation and don't have freezer space which makes things a little more tricky. The vitamins I listed cover two months of supplementation (B-Complex much more), and England is a gloomy place (D3). I could probably knock off K2 since I didn't realise broccoli provided that much. Magnesium before bed is useful, and the B-complex I think is helpful weekly. Vitamin C could be done with fruit, iodine... still not sure I would get any without trying to find seaweed or shellfish.

A typical good week day (cronometer): http://db.tt/kqsdJsaz

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:50 AM

Oooh, I also cook a lot of brussel sprouts, I shave them really thin with a potato peeler and stir-fry for one minute or so. 15 brussel sprouts per serving, maybe? About 242.3 mg vitamin C! (Sorry, I'm on a roll now, I love calculating nutrients ;P)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:46 AM

Oh, I would probably add 2 kiwis to that fruit salad :D (85mg vit C each)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:31 AM

One red and one yellow bell pepper puts me at 550mg vit C, and that's just breakfast. Wouldn't grass fed whey have k2? And fermented vegetables? (or even better, vegetables fermented with whey). Pastured eggs have k2 too. Doesn't bone broth have k2? Thankfully my heritage means I eat a lot of grass fed hard cheese, like 100g or 200g per day... when I can get my hands on some! :)

19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on April 19, 2013
at 06:42 AM

In the summer a typical day of vegetables goes: breakfast: fruit salad (2 oranges, half cup sliced strawberries). A side dish for lunch could be gently stir fried 2 cups zucchini, 2 cups summer squash, 2 cups cherry tomatoes (volume reduces a lot after cooking). Then for dinner I could have 1/4 cup sauerkraut fermented with whey (I massage a very large cabbage for 30 minutes so the volume reduces to fit a quart jar with a lot of room to spare, original 1/4 cup volume of sauerkraut is about 1 cup). That day would be about 408.6 mg vitamin C. Not bad, I'd say :)

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on April 19, 2013
at 09:28 AM

Just updated with a screenshot. You prompted me to have a look again.

0
606f2967e2ada25eb0bc2ed677ec2845

(364)

on April 18, 2013
at 04:00 PM

Salmon is quite expensive near me, but any other fish seems to be pretty cheap from the fishmonger, sea bream, tilapia, snapper, mackerel, trout, theres many there all quite filling to

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