8

votes

Paleo Summit Hack-a-thon: Paul Jaminet, 2/28

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created February 28, 2012 at 2:38 AM

What: The Paleo Summit (see also this post)

Who: Paul Jaminet, Ph.D. ??? Author, Perfect Health Diet

Topic: The Evolutionary Evidence for the Optimal Human Diet. So, where???s the proof? Paul Jaminet serves up five lines of evidence supporting the perfect macronutrient ratios ??? carbohydrates, protein, and fats. He also shares the logic and rationale behind his controversial concept of safe starches.

What did you think of Paul's presentation?

34cf7065a6c94062c711eb16c0f6adc3

on March 05, 2012
at 09:37 AM

He is coming from the point that the body needs this. You could provide the required glucose from proteins or from carbs, or maybe even fat. But the body must have it. Now why not supply the body what it needs rather than forcing it to produce it. This is his argument. He says that that is the path of least resistance and will be the most healthy. I think once in a while going a zero carb diet or being low carb for some time and fasting is all well and good it provides the stress to keep the body on its toes. But on the long run you don't want your body stressed all the time.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on March 01, 2012
at 02:05 AM

Yeah....that is one point I don't agree with.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on March 01, 2012
at 12:35 AM

yes, the interview made me want to read more, too

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on March 01, 2012
at 12:34 AM

Wow, Paul, that was quite a story. I guess the moral of the story is go to an Indian doc cause they have seen everything.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on March 01, 2012
at 12:30 AM

It's just that I am low carb and have no trouble at all getting in the C.

9e20abb05f3f6e3cc4bb107f8980aecd

(5939)

on February 29, 2012
at 08:20 PM

The problem is not knowing how to treat scurvy, it is diagnosing it. It is an easy problem to overlook.

287f839a2cda0b29ba9c2d6b993840ba

(289)

on February 29, 2012
at 05:41 PM

He expands on that here: http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=1139

B4e1fa6a8cf43d2b69d97a99dfca262c

(10255)

on February 29, 2012
at 03:20 AM

i'm with Dragonfly "umm, ya know". his message was well reasoned and his information was clear, but "ya know", i'm still not adding starches based on my personal experiences.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:35 AM

True,the meditation does become beautiful and liberating. You really have it down. I can tell.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:33 AM

Its like taking a test with a cheat sheet.There is little chance of mistakes, if you can just listen/observe well enough. It truly is a meditative tool.

2507b557331c8a674bc81197531e609a

(4994)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:09 AM

He does explain that in detail in the book :)

2507b557331c8a674bc81197531e609a

(4994)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:04 AM

PS. I would STRONGLY recommend you buy his book if you haven't already. It's so, so good.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on February 28, 2012
at 08:51 PM

"And as you know, the future of this country depends on middle school students." @Kamal OH NOOOO!

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on February 28, 2012
at 08:17 PM

Personally, I kind of like his delivery. It relays a level of thoughtfulness that I don't get from some of the more "hey, look at me!" types of presenters (not in paleoland, just in general). Anthony Robbins he is not, but that may be a good thing in this case. The main thing is that I can usually follow his line of logic, and if necessary, could explain it to a middle school student. And as you know, the future of this country depends on middle school students.

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on February 28, 2012
at 07:35 PM

Measured, balanced, thoughtful.

6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on February 28, 2012
at 07:35 PM

I agree with you.

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on February 28, 2012
at 07:35 PM

I agree totally. I think I've listened to all of his interviews (at least the ones I've been able to track down) and he always does a great job, but this one was really nice.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on February 28, 2012
at 06:34 PM

Yay Jaminet! He is clarity personified.

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13 Answers

12
96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on February 28, 2012
at 06:00 PM

WOW! Just Wow. Until now, I've read Paul's stuff with friendly interest but he really blew me away today--major score.

Now, I know one of my weaknesses is that I'm a non-critical person and I don't have an eagle eye/ear when enjoying presentations. But still, I found this very clear and well organized and the chain of logic was SO clear for each slide.

He's the first person to seriously make me pause and reconsider my passionate advocacy of fruit. Will I give it up completely? No. Will I keep his overall recommendations in mind when shopping and fixing meals? YES.

If I'd paid a typical fee to attend the Summit as a conference, I would feel I got my money today. And that's the best compliment I can think of (besides the fruit thing, of course.)

There's always the chance I was just hearing the parts that said what I wanted to hear (yes, I do that) but so far I don't think so. I will read other reactions carefully to learn what I misconstrued or overlooked.

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on February 28, 2012
at 07:35 PM

I agree totally. I think I've listened to all of his interviews (at least the ones I've been able to track down) and he always does a great job, but this one was really nice.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on February 28, 2012
at 06:34 PM

Yay Jaminet! He is clarity personified.

11
66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

on February 28, 2012
at 07:03 PM

I loved his talk. He's one of the more well-reasoned voices out there in the ancestral nutrition blogosphere...

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on February 28, 2012
at 07:35 PM

Measured, balanced, thoughtful.

6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on February 28, 2012
at 07:35 PM

I agree with you.

4
E0250b1e6dc5ec1539ffb745042b4d80

(3651)

on February 29, 2012
at 01:00 AM

I'm glad you fine folks talked me into listening!

I took notes and random thoughts, so I will just paste them. This part was specifically his defense of starches (20%) based on good data from real Paleo sites and the % carbs in mothers milk, adjusted for an adults requirements. I know this has low carb folks up in arms about "Safe starches" so this is what I'm listening for...

Jaminet makes lots of very well thought out points of interest to people interested in how to eat better. It's well worth listening too because the stuff you agree with far outweighs the stuff you don't.

I don't buy the breast milk hypothesis. (We should live on 20% carbs because babies have a certain percent from breast milk, adjusted to adult requirements)

I don't think Jaminet mentioned the possibility that maybe an infants digestive system is not developed enough (since they haven't had a steak yet), and they need the carbs from mothers milk initially. Natural development of the digestive system eventually takes place and 20% from food is not such a fixed requirement.

He's not taking into account that adults have other ways to make glucose besides following a food percent rule. Nature provides.

He makes a good case for evolutionary and physical evidence for Paleo folks eating 20% starches, in terms of total calories. Also, good point that humans did not evolve by getting their protein from plants. Take that, vegans.

Low carbers are not buying his safe starches thing. They are trying to change their weight. Jaminet goes through his whole defense of the optimal human diet without mentioning the modern problem of weight loss for people that ate crap for years and want to fix it.

Jaminet is talking about the optimal human diet for the optimal human. Dieters have a different set of things to focus on.

34cf7065a6c94062c711eb16c0f6adc3

on March 05, 2012
at 09:37 AM

He is coming from the point that the body needs this. You could provide the required glucose from proteins or from carbs, or maybe even fat. But the body must have it. Now why not supply the body what it needs rather than forcing it to produce it. This is his argument. He says that that is the path of least resistance and will be the most healthy. I think once in a while going a zero carb diet or being low carb for some time and fasting is all well and good it provides the stress to keep the body on its toes. But on the long run you don't want your body stressed all the time.

4
7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on February 28, 2012
at 06:55 PM

What I really liked in this presentation was Paul's discussion of his and Shou-Ching's rationale related to the macronutrient composition of breast milk as one of the lines of evidence for the PHD. It may have just been poor reading comprehension on my part, but I don't think they explained it as well in the book.

So, for everyone, like me who said "babies aren't like adults" as far as extrapolating an appropriate diet, check this out. What Paul presents is still conjecture, but it's reasoned conjecture related to the size of the brain relative to the body and the brain's need for glucose.

2507b557331c8a674bc81197531e609a

(4994)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:09 AM

He does explain that in detail in the book :)

4
1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on February 28, 2012
at 09:26 AM

I really liked this talk. It touches on Food Reward which is cool. Well presented. Highly recommended. It also covers some of the book The Perfect Health Diet.

3
2507b557331c8a674bc81197531e609a

(4994)

on September 07, 2013
at 12:44 AM

I thought it was a brilliant interview. As it always is with Jaminet. I love how calm and rational he comes across, and his logic and reason is some of the best in the paleo sphere imho. Great questions asked from Sean with clear and concise answers given. I listen to most of the interviews Paul takes part in and am always blown away by his clear thinking and humbleness. Give me thoughtful speakers over manic megalomaniacs any day.

2507b557331c8a674bc81197531e609a

(4994)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:04 AM

PS. I would STRONGLY recommend you buy his book if you haven't already. It's so, so good.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on March 01, 2012
at 12:35 AM

yes, the interview made me want to read more, too

3
8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on February 29, 2012
at 02:00 PM

This was such a great intro to his work, and I really enjoyed listening to it, even though I disagree with others here on the breast milk conclusion. One thing that really perplexed me is, gee, how many PhD's does it take in the house to figure out if you have scurvy you should get more C? I would never defend or try such a diet just because someone wrote about it on the internet. I don't see how that would ever lead to adding a gob of C-less rice to your diet. Perhaps the journey to that recommendation was longer than what was covered in this presentation.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on March 01, 2012
at 12:30 AM

It's just that I am low carb and have no trouble at all getting in the C.

287f839a2cda0b29ba9c2d6b993840ba

(289)

on February 29, 2012
at 05:41 PM

He expands on that here: http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=1139

9e20abb05f3f6e3cc4bb107f8980aecd

(5939)

on February 29, 2012
at 08:20 PM

The problem is not knowing how to treat scurvy, it is diagnosing it. It is an easy problem to overlook.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on March 01, 2012
at 12:34 AM

Wow, Paul, that was quite a story. I guess the moral of the story is go to an Indian doc cause they have seen everything.

3
3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on February 28, 2012
at 06:28 PM

I liked it. As one of the few who has not actually read his book...(though have been through their site extensively), I thought he presented a very logical argument for their recommendations.

One thing that stuck out to me was the mention of extended fasts or reduced food intake...although this was really to show how our body mobilizes energy and in what forms/ratios during these times, makes you consider the ramifications of including extended fasts in your regimen for optimal health.

2
96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19463)

on February 29, 2012
at 04:59 PM

It was an excellent and enlightening interview as always. I've always enjoyed interviews with him on other blogs, there were always bits of deep info that I picked up.

I absolutely need to get my hands on his book. :)

The only minor "bug" with his talk was when he mentioned that all we have on our ancestors is a bunch of bones, teeth, and the nitrogen/carbon ratios there, as well as bones of animals that were clearly hunted by them. He forgot that we did find coprolites, so we do know more about their diets from there.

I, myself, can't make use of the higher carb levels that he recommends, as anytime that I do, even though they're from safe starches, I wind up stalling fat loss and indeed gain more fat. Maybe I'm broken in some way still, but certainly, I'm too sensitive to insulin, and it does have an effect on fat levels. I did see something recently about how BPA tends to make insulin far more effective, thus causing obesity, perhaps I've had too much exposure to it. Or perhaps it's genetic. (Is there any way to remove BPA that's already floating around in there?)

1
47d6c23b03dc8a772c2276fa549bd3ae

(25)

on March 20, 2013
at 03:50 PM

"creating glucose in the liver is hard on it" - not sure what that even means, that's one of the things it's there for.

Let's face it, blood glucose has to be maintained 24/7 or we collapse in a hypoglycaemic coma. We avoid that by having a liver (and kidney) that makes glucose in the post-absorptive state.

http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/24/2/382.full covers renal gluconeogenesis and touches on the liver too.

1
3b02df41cc7b9daa386e81e3c82f5fc2

on February 29, 2012
at 06:04 PM

One of the things that stood out to me was his comment that creating glucose in the liver is hard on it, so eat some so it doesn't have to. Does his book or website have any references to this? Does anyone know of other research that supports that statement? That's the first time I'd heard that argument in favor of starches.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on March 01, 2012
at 02:05 AM

Yeah....that is one point I don't agree with.

1
F5f742cc9228eb5804114d0f3be4e587

(7660)

on February 28, 2012
at 10:25 PM

I'm a complete newbie to Paul's work, though I've gotten the gist of it from the Paleosphere. There's just so much to read, you know? I hadn't gotten around to PHD yet.

This was a great, succinct intro to everything, and I'm actually glad now that I waited for the presentation rather than reading the book. Big time saver.

I found it easy to follow, though I agree with Dragonfly that at times, I found myself reading the slides more than listening. There were a few audio glitches, so maybe that contributed too.

I'm not sure about a few things. I think the breastmilk hypothesis is an interesting way to go about this, but I'm not sure how that holds up. I was also confused when he talked about the body's composition being X% fat, carbs, and protein when he had just mentioned that what we eat gets manipulated by our bodies during digestion. So I'm not sure that using our body's make-up is a great way to determine what we should be eating in which ratios. (But maybe I'm getting something mixed up there? Feel free to set me straight. Unleash the hounds!)

I loved his advice to eat according to what your body wants. We all know that this advice doesn't work when your metabolism is hijacked by processed foods, but when eating real foods, you really can be in sync with it. It's been my guiding principle for over a year and it's a beautiful, liberating experience for sure.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:33 AM

Its like taking a test with a cheat sheet.There is little chance of mistakes, if you can just listen/observe well enough. It truly is a meditative tool.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on February 29, 2012
at 12:35 AM

True,the meditation does become beautiful and liberating. You really have it down. I can tell.

1
Ce41c230e8c2a4295db31aec3ef4b2ab

(32564)

on February 28, 2012
at 07:17 PM

Well, I basically eat the PHD recommended macros (never read the book--got there via Mark Sisson, plus some trial & error), but he didn't convince me about "safe starches."

Plenty of honey & fruit eaten by modern H/G tribes and this could easily have been the case during our evolution. I think it's more likely to be tubers and fruit. We are essentially "opportunivores", IMO.

Small complaint: His delivery leaves a bit to be desired for me. Just not very flowing, too many pauses...ums...etc. I found it tiresome to listen and preferred reading his slides.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on February 28, 2012
at 08:51 PM

"And as you know, the future of this country depends on middle school students." @Kamal OH NOOOO!

B4e1fa6a8cf43d2b69d97a99dfca262c

(10255)

on February 29, 2012
at 03:20 AM

i'm with Dragonfly "umm, ya know". his message was well reasoned and his information was clear, but "ya know", i'm still not adding starches based on my personal experiences.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on February 28, 2012
at 08:17 PM

Personally, I kind of like his delivery. It relays a level of thoughtfulness that I don't get from some of the more "hey, look at me!" types of presenters (not in paleoland, just in general). Anthony Robbins he is not, but that may be a good thing in this case. The main thing is that I can usually follow his line of logic, and if necessary, could explain it to a middle school student. And as you know, the future of this country depends on middle school students.

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