1

votes

Wow! Are people with adrenal fatigue just theories?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created January 03, 2012 at 3:35 PM

This was a shock. Have you listened to Jimmy Moore's recent podcast with Dr. Andreas Eenfeldt? http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/the-llvlc-show-episode-525-encore-week-2012-interview-with-dr-andreas-eenfeldt/12675 Jimmy asked him what the story is with adrenal fatigue, and he said it was an interesting theory. Then they started talking about how the adrenal fatigue advocates might just be anti-Atkins vegan posers. Huh????? What do you think about this?

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on January 05, 2012
at 04:02 PM

My life isn't chronically stressful, and I certainly don't buy the "reduce stress-reduce cortisol" theory. If your cortisol is out of whack, it can be due to other factors besides outside stress.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on January 05, 2012
at 04:00 PM

yes, ambi, thanks for the links

72dc57ac38e39129ad9a0bfb891d59ca

(55)

on January 04, 2012
at 06:09 PM

And lets be honest... Being in ketosis for long periods of time kinda sucks. Unless your life is perfectly stress free (which it certainly isn't) have a potato once in a while.

72dc57ac38e39129ad9a0bfb891d59ca

(55)

on January 04, 2012
at 06:05 PM

And who's life isn't chronically stressful? It's also punctuated by moments of acute stress too. Don't we paleo people do some intense exercise occasionally? That's pretty stressful. Occasionally bad things happen that cause your adrenals to go into overdrive. I'm not saying ketosis is bad but it might not be a good idea to be chronically stressed while going very low carb.

100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 04, 2012
at 03:53 PM

Oh, well, in that case, see my discussions here: http://paleohacks.com/questions/25449/why-do-people-consider-ketosis-stressful-to-the-body and here: http://paleohacks.com/questions/78343/is-lowered-t3-resulting-from-a-low-carb-diet-problematic

100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 04, 2012
at 03:51 PM

Ah. Thank you, Rose. That's quite hilarious to me, since, as you know, that theory is a pet peeve of mine, and I have a lot more specifics to say about it.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on January 04, 2012
at 02:11 AM

Although your comment is, as always, insightful and excellent.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on January 04, 2012
at 01:58 AM

I think this is a misconstrual of what was said. Jimmy asked Dr. Eenfeldt if he thought extended LC eating caused subclinical hypothyroidism or adrenal burnout. Eenfeldt said he saw no evidence for that, but that he was willing to look if anybody produced some. I don't believe he was calling "adrenal fatigue" unreal. Context, people, context.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on January 04, 2012
at 01:56 AM

Ambi, I listened to the podcast, and the impression I got is not the same as the OP's. The question was, can extended LC eating cause adrenal burnout and hypothyroidism -- the emphasis was on hypothyroidism. Eenfeldt thought *that* was the theory he saw no support for, but he allowed that he was willing to look at good research, if anybody could produce some.

100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 03, 2012
at 07:52 PM

Exactly, Beth. Paul, see http://paleohacks.com/questions/25449/why-do-people-consider-ketosis-stressful-to-the-body

100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 03, 2012
at 07:49 PM

Gotta love a health care system that motivates not going to the doctor for preventive reasons, but only when it is progressed beyond shadow of doubt.

293ba4c95d190bc616b27d85b10d705a

(661)

on January 03, 2012
at 05:31 PM

i experienced this i believe. i have a ft3/rt3 issue

1c67bc28f4e44bbb8770b86df0463df3

(6719)

on January 03, 2012
at 05:21 PM

Your blood glucose will be fine even on VLC.

3c6b4eed18dc57f746755b698426e7c8

(5147)

on January 03, 2012
at 05:15 PM

Someone, call Matt Stone.

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on January 03, 2012
at 03:58 PM

I was sent to the endocrinologist after my fainting episode two years ago, but I never went. Oops. I wish I had, because I guess I could have gotten a panel. But at that point I was in so much medical debt that I was kind of afraid to.

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on January 03, 2012
at 03:53 PM

What? I guess I'll listen to it when I do my chores today. But his English isn't very good in the first place. Also, maybe it would be helpful to call it Hypothalamo-pituitary-adrenal axis dysfunction? or is that not the same thing?

7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on January 03, 2012
at 03:43 PM

To be fair, your adrenals are only involved in pumping out cortisol to raise BG in times of stress. Normally your liver is quite capable of keeping your BG stable.

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4 Answers

7
100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 03, 2012
at 08:13 PM

I haven't listened to the podcast, but I have a comment anyway.

I think there is definitely a problem with a medical approach that considers a condition recognizable only when it is past the point of fixing with gentle measures, so that you go from normal to Addison's, with nothing in between. That's obviously wrong, and there are probably people suffering in the purgatory of adrenal fatigue for a long time without help.

The big problem I see about it partly comes out of this fact that the medical community doesn't recognize it. Therefore people who are experiencing it, or developing theories about it are relegated to the fringe. This gives it a disadvantage, because they cannot then go and get studies funded that would test the appropriate measures to find out what is true and what is not. So what we are left with is a haphazard combination of people's best guesses about what is happening, combined with wisdom gleaned from anecdotes, some of which is likely to be true, and some of which is likely to be false.

Finally, a problem like adrenal fatigue is characterized by a host of common symptoms that could have any one or more of a multitude of causes. Tiredness? Disturbed sleep? PMS? Everything causes those things! So what happens is that a thousand desperate people think they have adrenal fatigue. Maybe they do, but it only adds to the confusion and general sense that it is just a theory.

For example, if you suspect you have AF, you are encouraged to take a 24 hour salivary cortisol test. But what if your test results aren't normal? There could be multiple reasons for it. To say that this is a definitive confirmation of someone's proposed mechanism of AF, well, that's hubris.

I fully expect that over time we will recognize something like adrenal fatigue, and have real clinical experience to guide the treatment, but what I see right now is full of hypothesis and black magic (some of which is probably correct, but we can't evaluate it), and so I'm not surprised it isn't taken seriously.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on January 04, 2012
at 02:11 AM

Although your comment is, as always, insightful and excellent.

100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 04, 2012
at 03:51 PM

Ah. Thank you, Rose. That's quite hilarious to me, since, as you know, that theory is a pet peeve of mine, and I have a lot more specifics to say about it.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on January 04, 2012
at 01:56 AM

Ambi, I listened to the podcast, and the impression I got is not the same as the OP's. The question was, can extended LC eating cause adrenal burnout and hypothyroidism -- the emphasis was on hypothyroidism. Eenfeldt thought *that* was the theory he saw no support for, but he allowed that he was willing to look at good research, if anybody could produce some.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on January 05, 2012
at 04:00 PM

yes, ambi, thanks for the links

1
5e36f73c3f95eb4ea13a009f4936449f

(8280)

on January 03, 2012
at 07:02 PM

Jimmy Moore has a lot of people on his show. Doesn't mean they're right or wrong. You can't take what they say as gospel. You have to verify/validate it and see how it works with your own knowledge on which way you'll go.

In terms of his adrenal fatigue comment, take a look and see if there are multiple non-vegans advocating it. If there are, then he's disproved.

0
2006ccb2b60f9cc5ba5e8eff8a7abc46

on June 11, 2012
at 11:20 PM

having lived an extremely stressfull life full of depression and anxiety, eating disorders, hyper activity, allergies and hypersensitivity to food and environment and now being a 29 year old female who has the hormonal level and adrenal function of an 80 year old, i would say adrenal fatigue sure feels real when i fall asleep in so much pain from my hips or want to hike and run like i used to but can barely move one foot in front of the other.

-3
72dc57ac38e39129ad9a0bfb891d59ca

on January 03, 2012
at 03:41 PM

Adrenal fatigue is very real and you do not want to go very low carb for a long time. You adrenal glands can pump out cortisol for only so long to keep your blood glucose up.

100fd85230060e754fc13394eee6d6f1

(18696)

on January 03, 2012
at 07:52 PM

Exactly, Beth. Paul, see http://paleohacks.com/questions/25449/why-do-people-consider-ketosis-stressful-to-the-body

72dc57ac38e39129ad9a0bfb891d59ca

(55)

on January 04, 2012
at 06:09 PM

And lets be honest... Being in ketosis for long periods of time kinda sucks. Unless your life is perfectly stress free (which it certainly isn't) have a potato once in a while.

293ba4c95d190bc616b27d85b10d705a

(661)

on January 03, 2012
at 05:31 PM

i experienced this i believe. i have a ft3/rt3 issue

7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on January 03, 2012
at 03:43 PM

To be fair, your adrenals are only involved in pumping out cortisol to raise BG in times of stress. Normally your liver is quite capable of keeping your BG stable.

1c67bc28f4e44bbb8770b86df0463df3

(6719)

on January 03, 2012
at 05:21 PM

Your blood glucose will be fine even on VLC.

8949bf87b0e0aefcad10f29975e4fa2b

(8989)

on January 05, 2012
at 04:02 PM

My life isn't chronically stressful, and I certainly don't buy the "reduce stress-reduce cortisol" theory. If your cortisol is out of whack, it can be due to other factors besides outside stress.

72dc57ac38e39129ad9a0bfb891d59ca

(55)

on January 04, 2012
at 06:05 PM

And who's life isn't chronically stressful? It's also punctuated by moments of acute stress too. Don't we paleo people do some intense exercise occasionally? That's pretty stressful. Occasionally bad things happen that cause your adrenals to go into overdrive. I'm not saying ketosis is bad but it might not be a good idea to be chronically stressed while going very low carb.

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