5

votes

does ketosis curb your appetite?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created August 17, 2011 at 1:43 AM

my short answer? NO!

i certainly don't walk around feeling hungry all day or deprived, like when i counted calories while following the conventional wisdom re. health (whole grains, no fat, no fun).

but all this talk of just forgetting to eat meals, or losing your appetite... it's for the birds! man, i can always eat three square ones a day. admittedly, i'm not a snacker, but breakfast lunch & dinner go down, and they go down nicely.

now when i was a big fat guy eating the SAD, i was dealing with a lot of emotional eating issues. i don't subscribe to stephan guyenet's food reward theory, as i could compulsively over-eat anything... carrot sticks, diet cokes, donuts, chocolate, potatoes, you name it. it wasn't the specific foods or flavors triggered some hormonal rush to keep eating. it's an emotional thing, not a hormonal thing at that level.

thankfully it's not like that anymore. but since going paleo, and i go low carb, mostly staying in mild ketosis, my normal appetite has not been diminished to any real extent. anybody else feel the same way?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 30, 2012
at 11:58 PM

Certain aminos are broken down into glucose and certain ones actually ketogenic.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 10:26 PM

i don't think you can store aminos either. i just don't see why the extra protein wouldn't be excreted, rather than converted to glucose. i am NOT an expert though, and would love to get a definitive answer. its seem like gluconeogenesis would take more energy than simply excreting the excess. i'm basing these assumptions on my observation of my own body: excess protein has never really caused weight gain for me. soooooo not an expert...

7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on August 17, 2011
at 06:02 PM

Hmm. I've heard the reverse ... that amino acids not needed as building blocks are deaminated (nitrogen removed) and converted. To my knowledge (and I'm not the Kraken!), there's no amino acid storage in the body.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:39 PM

thanks, beth. i do consume a good deal of protein, but i find that it helps with muscle recovery from workouts (i lift weights frequently), and overall satiety. though it triggers an insulin release, it also triggers a simultaneous glucagon release, which really balances things. i definitely don't consume any sugar alcohols or processed foods at all! i'm not convinced that the excess protein is automatically converted to glucose. i think your body only does that to the extent that it needs glucose, and no more. i'll take a look at jaminet's article though, thank you for sharing!

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:09 PM

congratulations on getting healthy! walking around with 20# extra (5'6", 150#) sucks enough; i'm *very* grateful that i'm not obese. "There but by the grace of [...], go I".

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:07 PM

congratulations on getting healthy! walking around with 20# extra (5'6", 150#) sucks enough; i'm *very* grateful that i'm not obese. "There but by the grace of _?_ go I".

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:05 PM

congratulations on getting healthy! walking around with 20# extra sucks enough (5'6", 150#), i'm *very* grateful that i'm not obese. "There but by the grace of __?__ go I".

7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on August 17, 2011
at 04:56 PM

Paleo4ever, I have made major improvements to my emotional eating by doing neurofeedback (after reading about it in Nora Gedgaudas' book). It's pricy (and insurance doesn't cover it), but well worth it. That said, you may be able to do some of this on your own with meditation (or with a tool like HeartMath which is "assisted" meditation).

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:03 PM

well, count your blessings! you've never been a true fatty. i, on the other hand, know what it feels like to walk around at 230lbs when you're 5'7", and it sucks!

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:02 PM

lol, moo binge! enjoy it.

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:48 AM

Yes; usually two eggs a day, and sometimes no eggs for days at a time. And I'm currently on a moo binge, which means I'm in the mid-150s, instead of the mid- to high-140s, where I settle when I yank myself away from the udder. :-/

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:41 AM

wish i could say the same re body comp. i feel pretty wtf about it. i've never been a true fatty, but i'm in the upper realms of a 'normal' bmi. i would love to ditch summa this junk.. grr.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:39 AM

okay, that's an interesting idea. i'm skinny now, but i used to weigh upwards of 70lbs more. if i flex my abs, you can count 'em, but i don't think i'm at single digit bodyfat or anything... but maybe that's the key, appetite diminishes in ketosis proportionally to the amount of fat your body can provide for fuel. that makes sense.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:37 AM

interesting, thanks rose. i think i eat enough eggs to push me above 2 or 3 carbs each day, no kidding! not sure i could ever really qualify for ZC, i like to eat 2 oz of either macadamia nuts or almonds every day too. do you limit eggs and cheese to stay that low?

3aea514b680d01bfd7573d74517946a7

(11996)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:12 AM

Yeah, I certainly didn't eat fewer calories the first few months of VLC, nor the first few months of ZC. In both cases I ate like a demon and still lost a literal buttload of weight. On VLC, however, my appetite never really abated. For me, I had to go waaaay down in carb count (<2 or 3g/day) to *eventually* arrive at the place where I could go all day without eating, and without chewing the walls. That happened at about the time I arrived at my "normal" weight, 75 pounds down from the starting point.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:11 AM

i don't want you to think i'm perfect, or that i've mastered this either. i have days where i get depressed or anxious, and over eat. HUGE tip: keep it to low carb, paleo foods.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:10 AM

paleo4ever, i'm sorry to hear that you're struggling big time. it sounds like we both have emotional eating issues, though they're very different. the one thing we likely have in common with everyone that has emotional eating issues, is that we will never be totally rid of this relationship with food & eating. we must learn to manage it, and to cope with our emotions separately and not take emotional relief from our food. an alcoholic can quit drinking; we can't quit eating. this is tough! hang in there buddy. every person we meet is fighting a great struggle in some way. this is ours.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:02 AM

actually, i don't snack between meals. almost never. thanks for the vote of confidence! i just read so much about ketosis or low carb diets decreasing appetite, and these theories that people just eat fewer calories when they eat like this, and it cracks me up. not the case!!

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:00 AM

gotcha, re. the yup! i'm pretty much where i want to be weight wise, anything more i lose is just icing on the cake, so to speak (so to speak in a totally non-paleo way!). eating lc or vlc feels great to me, and frankly, i don't crave the conventional junk food so i guess this works. i notice more of a change in body composition though, than anything reflected on the scale; i.e. more muscle & less fat, but same number on that scale.

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 03:52 AM

wait the yup is to the question in the body "anybody else feel the same way?" -- not to the title question...obvsly.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on August 17, 2011
at 02:27 AM

do you snack between meals? if you're eating 3 squares with no snacking, i'd say that's a pretty healthy appetite with a control on cravings and hunger.

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4 Answers

1
7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on August 17, 2011
at 05:01 PM

One clue may be your comment re being in 'mild' ketosis. If you're eating more protein than you need, perhaps excess amino acids are essentially acting as dietary carbs. Or, any chance you're eating LC products with their sugar alcohols?

Paul Jaminet has suggestions for how you can make a diet more ketogenic. Might be worth experimenting with that to see if that helps.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:39 PM

thanks, beth. i do consume a good deal of protein, but i find that it helps with muscle recovery from workouts (i lift weights frequently), and overall satiety. though it triggers an insulin release, it also triggers a simultaneous glucagon release, which really balances things. i definitely don't consume any sugar alcohols or processed foods at all! i'm not convinced that the excess protein is automatically converted to glucose. i think your body only does that to the extent that it needs glucose, and no more. i'll take a look at jaminet's article though, thank you for sharing!

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 10:26 PM

i don't think you can store aminos either. i just don't see why the extra protein wouldn't be excreted, rather than converted to glucose. i am NOT an expert though, and would love to get a definitive answer. its seem like gluconeogenesis would take more energy than simply excreting the excess. i'm basing these assumptions on my observation of my own body: excess protein has never really caused weight gain for me. soooooo not an expert...

7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on August 17, 2011
at 06:02 PM

Hmm. I've heard the reverse ... that amino acids not needed as building blocks are deaminated (nitrogen removed) and converted. To my knowledge (and I'm not the Kraken!), there's no amino acid storage in the body.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on March 30, 2012
at 11:58 PM

Certain aminos are broken down into glucose and certain ones actually ketogenic.

1
59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

on August 17, 2011
at 02:27 AM

Jakey, I am wondering how to got over your emotional eatings issues. I am struggling big time with this right now, trying to find professional help, but not sure what the best way is. I am strict Paleo, but because of the emotional disorder, i feel deprived and restricted every single day. I get upset when friends have cookies and pizza, but not because i want them ,but because i want to feel free and normal.

Any help?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:11 AM

i don't want you to think i'm perfect, or that i've mastered this either. i have days where i get depressed or anxious, and over eat. HUGE tip: keep it to low carb, paleo foods.

7dc950fc76a046048e683d2a27dced37

on August 17, 2011
at 04:56 PM

Paleo4ever, I have made major improvements to my emotional eating by doing neurofeedback (after reading about it in Nora Gedgaudas' book). It's pricy (and insurance doesn't cover it), but well worth it. That said, you may be able to do some of this on your own with meditation (or with a tool like HeartMath which is "assisted" meditation).

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:10 AM

paleo4ever, i'm sorry to hear that you're struggling big time. it sounds like we both have emotional eating issues, though they're very different. the one thing we likely have in common with everyone that has emotional eating issues, is that we will never be totally rid of this relationship with food & eating. we must learn to manage it, and to cope with our emotions separately and not take emotional relief from our food. an alcoholic can quit drinking; we can't quit eating. this is tough! hang in there buddy. every person we meet is fighting a great struggle in some way. this is ours.

0
B14dc4aa1ddefbec3bc09550428ee493

on August 17, 2011
at 04:24 AM

I think you have a misconception about what ketosis will do for you. You're not going to have zero appetite, but it will be less than normal. Your body is only getting part of its needs from your stored fat. The rest will come from what you eat and you will still feel hungry when meal time comes. Unless you have very little body fat on you, in which case your body has no stores to dip into. Is that the case wit you? You talk about being a big guy in the past tense. If you are no longer overweight, it may be that your body just doesn't have much body fat to burn and so you must get most of it by eating food.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:39 AM

okay, that's an interesting idea. i'm skinny now, but i used to weigh upwards of 70lbs more. if i flex my abs, you can count 'em, but i don't think i'm at single digit bodyfat or anything... but maybe that's the key, appetite diminishes in ketosis proportionally to the amount of fat your body can provide for fuel. that makes sense.

0
559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 03:49 AM

Yup. I did VLC for a coupla months and sadly did not experience that "never hungry" thing. For me LC is def more comfortable than high carb eating (which makes me ravenous and hypoglycemic), but VLC didn't change my appetite. I ate a normal amount of food... and (unsurprisingly?) didn't lose an ounce.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:00 AM

gotcha, re. the yup! i'm pretty much where i want to be weight wise, anything more i lose is just icing on the cake, so to speak (so to speak in a totally non-paleo way!). eating lc or vlc feels great to me, and frankly, i don't crave the conventional junk food so i guess this works. i notice more of a change in body composition though, than anything reflected on the scale; i.e. more muscle & less fat, but same number on that scale.

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 03:52 AM

wait the yup is to the question in the body "anybody else feel the same way?" -- not to the title question...obvsly.

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:09 PM

congratulations on getting healthy! walking around with 20# extra (5'6", 150#) sucks enough; i'm *very* grateful that i'm not obese. "There but by the grace of [...], go I".

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:41 AM

wish i could say the same re body comp. i feel pretty wtf about it. i've never been a true fatty, but i'm in the upper realms of a 'normal' bmi. i would love to ditch summa this junk.. grr.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 17, 2011
at 04:03 PM

well, count your blessings! you've never been a true fatty. i, on the other hand, know what it feels like to walk around at 230lbs when you're 5'7", and it sucks!

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:07 PM

congratulations on getting healthy! walking around with 20# extra (5'6", 150#) sucks enough; i'm *very* grateful that i'm not obese. "There but by the grace of _?_ go I".

559aa134ff5e6c8bcd608ba8dc505628

(3631)

on August 17, 2011
at 05:05 PM

congratulations on getting healthy! walking around with 20# extra sucks enough (5'6", 150#), i'm *very* grateful that i'm not obese. "There but by the grace of __?__ go I".

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