1

votes

Still hungry....what do you do?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created August 24, 2012 at 12:10 AM

I have a question in regards to what I should do when eating a healthy whole foods diet and remaining hungry. The problem is i'm eating and eating and getting to rather high caloric amounts (e.g. 4000 calories worth of potatoes and still hungry). The problem is It's not satisfying me and I was wondering what I should do in such situations. I have no problems eating any types of foods (i.e. carbs, fats...etc) but I usually try to keep my diet simple and repetitive. Any ideas on what to do?

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on August 25, 2012
at 10:09 PM

FYI new users http://paleohacks.com/questions/118128/meta-whats-the-deal-with-paleohacks-dr-kruse-and-the-fbi/118457#118457

Fab409ac4a30957e3ed508514f7bff02

(295)

on August 25, 2012
at 02:11 AM

Great job Monte.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on August 25, 2012
at 01:33 AM

well played, sir

336c383a3c4d28652d7ab888c79108a3

(614)

on August 24, 2012
at 11:05 PM

Exactly what do you eat in an average day?

F9638b939a6f85d67f60065677193cad

(4266)

on August 24, 2012
at 04:55 PM

Yeah, give this a try. You're already trying more and more potatoes and it's not working so what do you have to lose? I find sometimes when I go a long time eating the same stuff, I get really super hungry and need to change to something else. So for you (the OP), maybe you just need a period of time or even just a few meals away from the potatoes.

B3173217a49b5b0116078775a17eb21d

(11488)

on August 24, 2012
at 10:05 AM

subtract some potatoes and just eat the butter.

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 09:11 AM

Wow, you really can't deal with criticism can you? And i'm the moron, hmm....

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 09:09 AM

and i hope you aren't bitter that i hold you to a higher standard =)

C3bc92e6b5eba45dc55f43ac3c70cc25

on August 24, 2012
at 08:13 AM

"One aspect of hunger has to do with the status of liver glycogen, when liver glycogen is emptied, a signal is sent to the brain that can stimulate hunger; the corollary is that replenishing liver glycogen tends to make people feel fuller." http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/9-ways-to-deal-with-hunger-on-a-diet.html

6fece842bd1bcf5724f458a302a2156e

(1169)

on August 24, 2012
at 06:17 AM

I agree although for many of us cutting out fruit on a temporary basis is very very hard.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 24, 2012
at 06:05 AM

Contrary to Jimmy Moore, I eat more vegetables than meat - more like Terry Wahls.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 24, 2012
at 06:03 AM

I have lost over 20 lb in less than a month eating this way.

963322f175cdd4c5f7d52cc372b3a167

(646)

on August 24, 2012
at 05:35 AM

And you'll look like Jimmy Moore. LOL!

6d64cd6dc98d6ab763bd03678a317964

(2177)

on August 24, 2012
at 04:09 AM

Hey Jackson, your response to my answer reminds me of a great Robb Wolf quote: "Modern society has created an environment where not only can complete morons survive, they can thrive." (I might be slightly paraphrasing but he said it)

6d64cd6dc98d6ab763bd03678a317964

(2177)

on August 24, 2012
at 04:04 AM

Hey Jackson, I added some citations to back up the rational of my "stupid dogmatic limit starch crap". Hope you enjoy them.

6d64cd6dc98d6ab763bd03678a317964

(2177)

on August 24, 2012
at 04:01 AM

I added citations. Hopefully that clears up my "stupid dogmatic limit starch crap".

Fab409ac4a30957e3ed508514f7bff02

(295)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:27 AM

Better info would help, 4000 calories of potatoes (boiled, without skin or salt) is over 10 lbs of potatoes - I call bullshit.

B1d3dfe470ba901b2b107545b923b024

(184)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:05 AM

actually the complete opposite with breakfast is true (with citation) - http://www.leangains.com/2012/06/why-does-breakfast-make-me-hungry.html though in saying that i think you gotta be greatful for any advice given and then trust yourself to pick with tips you choose to implement and which tips you politely ignore

8dbe73235f73c615f20d3d0f34b4852a

(1365)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:03 AM

I also like the "life changes" comment. You're obviously a Negative Nancy that doesn't take criticism well and has trouble staying open minded to peoples' various answers to your problems. Maybe you get hungry because you're a bad listener? (I may need a citation for that one) But in all seriousness, just listen to what people say. Try it. If it doesn't work, then don't do it. But don't just shut it down.

8dbe73235f73c615f20d3d0f34b4852a

(1365)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:58 AM

Yeah. Be nice... wtf. You can't say "don't give me that dogmatic no starch crap" when you're eating lots of starches and are still hungry... Listen to your body. Maybe those starches that "have scientific evidence" aren't doing it for you? Maybe you DO need to up protein intake and limit starches. These people aren't necessarily being dogmatic, they're just saying what might have worked for them. You wanted advice. You got advice. If you want science, go read a book or a study.

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:49 AM

ditto, sugar/ carbs right before a main meal usually helps out a lot for me as well

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc

(14952)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:49 AM

Then stop eating potatoes. It is possible that you are experiencing reactive hypoglycemia, and the low blood sugar will set of hunger signals.

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:38 AM

no need to bash anyone just for giving advice

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:36 AM

each piece of information/ advice you get here is from a stranger who may or may not know what the hell they're talking about - and that's the only truth you'll ever find here.

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:35 AM

maybe he's speaking from personal experience - it's what we all do here - you don't know the credentials of ANYONE here (not that it matters) so to take advice from some person you've never met before at face value is just plain dumb

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:29 AM

"The most satiating meal of the day is breakfast, the least satiating is dinner." -- So i should just take that as fact and follow?

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:25 AM

dude, he's only giving suggestions - it's exactly what you asked for - why the hell would you want scientific citations for an answer to a question that doesn't even require them. If you want scientific proof, do some work, and look it up on the interweb toobz for journals. simple.

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:20 AM

no citations for any of your claims, stupid dogmatic limit starch crap, more unsubstantiated claims. NO thank you

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:16 AM

tried it..doesn't work

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:16 AM

tried it doesn't work

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc

(14952)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:15 AM

Try increasing your protein.

  • Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

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13 Answers

9
6d64cd6dc98d6ab763bd03678a317964

(2177)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:17 AM

The most satiating meal of the day is breakfast, the least satiating is dinner. Be sure to eat a large breakfast full of protein. Try to limit your starches. Snaking also perpetuates hunger. Try eating 3 large meals a day. Liquid calories are out. You need to chew all of your food. Increase your fat AND fiber intake. I would also make sure that the hunger isn't an underlying nutritional deficiency. Log your food and see what your low on. Typical things are going to be choline, omega 3s, and magnesium.

Lifestyle changes may also help:

Awake with the sun and sleep early. It's been shown that late night eating, and staying up late in general stimulate hunger the next day. Too much stress does the same thing. Certain herbals may help with this. (Holy basil, ashwagandha, etc etc)

And finally... psychological triggers. For me, I know there are certain places, smells, situations, foods, that automatically trigger hunger. I try to avoid these. ;)

EDIT: ADDED CITATIONs

Satiating effects of breakfast:

1. http://www.colorado.edu/intphys/Class/IPHY3700_Greene/pdfs/atkins/Holt.pdf

Please read the introduction to that PDF. It gives many many cites on why breakfast (especially a high protein breakfast) greatly reduces ghrelin secretion and increases CCK which greatly slows gastric emptying.

2. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1727908/

In particular long chain fatty acids (along with protein) are the most effective in lowering caloric intake (reducing hunger).

Late Night Eating AND Starch Reduction

Here we need to discuss Neuropeptide Y.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuropeptide_Y

Higher levels of NPY in the brain cause carbohydrate cravings (hunger) and/or eating disorders.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9748512

These studies consistently demonstrated a close association between the ingestion of carbohydrate and NPY levels, specifically in the arcuate nucleus (ARC) and medial portion of the paraventricular nucleus (PVN) of the hypothalamus. In addition to revealing increased NPY activity in animals that naturally select high carbohydrate when given a choice of macronutrients, a single diet with 65% carbohydrate (10% fat), compared to a control diet with 45% carbohydrate (30% fat), significantly potentiates NPY gene expression and NPY-immunoreactivity,

This is why I said to limit your starch intake if your struggling with hunger.

The reason why you shouldn't be eating late at night is that it inhibits the bodies ability to burn fat as we sleep. What happens when your metabolism is not well tuned to burn internal fat stores? You get hungry! If you want to know more read up on Prolactin and Leptin....

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:36 AM

each piece of information/ advice you get here is from a stranger who may or may not know what the hell they're talking about - and that's the only truth you'll ever find here.

8dbe73235f73c615f20d3d0f34b4852a

(1365)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:58 AM

Yeah. Be nice... wtf. You can't say "don't give me that dogmatic no starch crap" when you're eating lots of starches and are still hungry... Listen to your body. Maybe those starches that "have scientific evidence" aren't doing it for you? Maybe you DO need to up protein intake and limit starches. These people aren't necessarily being dogmatic, they're just saying what might have worked for them. You wanted advice. You got advice. If you want science, go read a book or a study.

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:20 AM

no citations for any of your claims, stupid dogmatic limit starch crap, more unsubstantiated claims. NO thank you

Fab409ac4a30957e3ed508514f7bff02

(295)

on August 25, 2012
at 02:11 AM

Great job Monte.

8dbe73235f73c615f20d3d0f34b4852a

(1365)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:03 AM

I also like the "life changes" comment. You're obviously a Negative Nancy that doesn't take criticism well and has trouble staying open minded to peoples' various answers to your problems. Maybe you get hungry because you're a bad listener? (I may need a citation for that one) But in all seriousness, just listen to what people say. Try it. If it doesn't work, then don't do it. But don't just shut it down.

6d64cd6dc98d6ab763bd03678a317964

(2177)

on August 24, 2012
at 04:04 AM

Hey Jackson, I added some citations to back up the rational of my "stupid dogmatic limit starch crap". Hope you enjoy them.

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:29 AM

"The most satiating meal of the day is breakfast, the least satiating is dinner." -- So i should just take that as fact and follow?

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:25 AM

dude, he's only giving suggestions - it's exactly what you asked for - why the hell would you want scientific citations for an answer to a question that doesn't even require them. If you want scientific proof, do some work, and look it up on the interweb toobz for journals. simple.

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:38 AM

no need to bash anyone just for giving advice

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 09:09 AM

and i hope you aren't bitter that i hold you to a higher standard =)

B1d3dfe470ba901b2b107545b923b024

(184)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:05 AM

actually the complete opposite with breakfast is true (with citation) - http://www.leangains.com/2012/06/why-does-breakfast-make-me-hungry.html though in saying that i think you gotta be greatful for any advice given and then trust yourself to pick with tips you choose to implement and which tips you politely ignore

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:35 AM

maybe he's speaking from personal experience - it's what we all do here - you don't know the credentials of ANYONE here (not that it matters) so to take advice from some person you've never met before at face value is just plain dumb

4
45ace03a0eff1219943d746cfb1c4197

(3661)

on August 24, 2012
at 02:26 AM

Potatoes are not likely to ease hunger but increase it. I'm not saying never eat a potato, but if you're looking for satiety, look to protein and fat first.

3
Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25477)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:03 PM

I use high dose melatonin to offset satiety in patients in my clinic if they fail the Leptin Rx rules. This happens most often in those with eating disorders. I wrote about it in CT 7. Melatonin directly turns off ghrelin and also is a key signal at night in turning off the GI tract in circadian biology.

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on August 25, 2012
at 10:09 PM

FYI new users http://paleohacks.com/questions/118128/meta-whats-the-deal-with-paleohacks-dr-kruse-and-the-fbi/118457#118457

3
963322f175cdd4c5f7d52cc372b3a167

on August 24, 2012
at 04:06 AM

Um.....eat more?

3
20bff9cbbddf521bac87b434981502c3

on August 24, 2012
at 12:46 AM

Do you have any idea what your macronutrient breakouts are?

Sounds like you need more fat. I'm usually about 50-60% every day and have no issues with satiety. If I had to guess, I'd say that I eat 50% fat, 25% pro, 25% carb.

Why don't you track your kcals for a few days, or maybe guesstimate back in time for a couple days to see what the breakout roughly is. Maybe you are unintentionally low fat.

Info at nutritiondata.com can get you close enough, if you don't have a sense of how many kcals are in your food and what the breakout is.

And not to be captain obvious here, but have a look at your energy expenditure. Are you doing crazy CF workouts 2x daily? Calculate your BMR and daily calorie needs, look at what you're consuming and what you're expending and go from there. It's not the answer but it sure as hell is a decent starting point.

3
Medium avatar

(2338)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:15 AM

add some butter to those potatoes and i bet you won't be hungry. and maybe try drinking more water.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on August 25, 2012
at 01:33 AM

well played, sir

B3173217a49b5b0116078775a17eb21d

(11488)

on August 24, 2012
at 10:05 AM

subtract some potatoes and just eat the butter.

Dfeb3c1ef269c5dc03154d1689c14373

(716)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:16 AM

tried it..doesn't work

2
F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 24, 2012
at 05:30 AM

I know exactly what to do: no potatoes, no starches, no fruit, no berries, no sweeteners (even natural) of any kind. Not even sweet potatoes - they are starches too.

Eat some fat with everything: fat with your vegetables, fat with your protein. Your fat can come from grass-fed butter/free-range lard/any kind of animal fat.

Oh, and tons and tons of probiotics from your refigerated section.

You won't be hungry then. I promise.

F9638b939a6f85d67f60065677193cad

(4266)

on August 24, 2012
at 04:55 PM

Yeah, give this a try. You're already trying more and more potatoes and it's not working so what do you have to lose? I find sometimes when I go a long time eating the same stuff, I get really super hungry and need to change to something else. So for you (the OP), maybe you just need a period of time or even just a few meals away from the potatoes.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 24, 2012
at 06:05 AM

Contrary to Jimmy Moore, I eat more vegetables than meat - more like Terry Wahls.

963322f175cdd4c5f7d52cc372b3a167

(646)

on August 24, 2012
at 05:35 AM

And you'll look like Jimmy Moore. LOL!

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 24, 2012
at 06:03 AM

I have lost over 20 lb in less than a month eating this way.

6fece842bd1bcf5724f458a302a2156e

(1169)

on August 24, 2012
at 06:17 AM

I agree although for many of us cutting out fruit on a temporary basis is very very hard.

2
095ef76482234d3db444b77d7ed01c29

(2755)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:04 AM

Less fruits, less tubers (potatoes are a safer starch...but are in no way optimal for satiety), and more protein/fat foods...especially the fat.

Most days, my nutrient breakdown is approximately 60% fat, 35% protein, 5% carbs (from green veggies. It's damn hard to get 3600 calories a day this way.

Now if I'm prepping for a powerlifting meet the rules are off and I don't do it strictly ancestral...I do eat more potatoes (and the potatoes you can buy in the store are in no way related to the ones our ancestors would eat)...I also add dairy in the form of skim milk and whey two or three times a day. But the energy needs for meet prep for a fitness guy (I do plenty of GPP and Cardio work even when trying to gain weight) are pretty high and it's only for short term...

The rest of my time I stick with the break down listed above.

2
C0c839648b31512515daaffe8e4e9ad1

on August 24, 2012
at 12:41 AM

I have been having the same issues. However, I noticed that eating things with a lot of sugar in them (especially after meals) made me feel way fuller than expected and I ended up being too full for a long time.

Now I have figured out that if I eat a piece of fruit (like a whole serving of fruit) RIGHT BEFORE I eat my regular meal of meat and vegetables, it calms down the hungry signals in my belly and I actually (almost) feel full when I am done eating.

I am beginning to feel that hungry and full just aren't what they used to be anymore, but it's better overall.

I'm sticking to the fruit before meals. I think the sugar gets absorbed quickly by the body and tells your brain you've just eaten something, so you don't keep eating foods that don't digest quickly and then you never get that full signal until after you're done eating when you still feel hungry.

C3bc92e6b5eba45dc55f43ac3c70cc25

on August 24, 2012
at 08:13 AM

"One aspect of hunger has to do with the status of liver glycogen, when liver glycogen is emptied, a signal is sent to the brain that can stimulate hunger; the corollary is that replenishing liver glycogen tends to make people feel fuller." http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/9-ways-to-deal-with-hunger-on-a-diet.html

6b365c14c646462210f3ef6b6fecace1

(1784)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:49 AM

ditto, sugar/ carbs right before a main meal usually helps out a lot for me as well

1
742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on August 25, 2012
at 12:18 AM

I am in a similar situation. I consume close to 4000 calories daily from everything, meat, sweet potatoes, potatoes, olives, avocadoes, vegetables, coconut cream, fruit but I still go to bed hungry. I have very high activity levels and I am trying to gain weight, yet I am losing!! I don't think this is right. I am not that big, only 5'7 and 130 lbs, and I just don't know what else to eat.

I think Paul J. said that if you are malnourished your body wants more calories because it never feels satisfied, so there could be something else at play here. Absorption issues? Leaky gut?

1
3ce6a0d24be025e2f2af534545bdd1d7

(26217)

on August 24, 2012
at 01:09 PM

Jackson,

We need more info.

1) How big are you? Height/ Weight -- a 6'5" 320 lbs man probably won't get full on 10 lbs of potatoes

2) How much/ what type of exercise are you doing? Again, 4000 Calories is not going to fill up someone who is burning 6000 calories a day.

3) 10 lbs of potatoes? Really?

4) Other than the starch, what else are you eating? 4000 calories of fat? 2000 calories of protein?

1
7f1e48db1bee85b9ef8a4bc4baedd044

on August 24, 2012
at 09:44 AM

A few suggestions:

  • Spending more time chewing and mixing food with saliva can make you more satiated with less food. Check out Attentive Eating. Fibrous foods such as carrots and cabbages are excellent for practicing this eating habit.
  • Natural salt helps with satiety, energy and hydration. Try experimenting with increasing your salt intake.
  • Increase your fat intake.
  • Fructose disrupts your bodys' satiety feedback. It makes you think you're in starvation mode even when you have a stomach full of food. The popular ingredient High Fructose Corn Syrup(HFCS) is found in almost every junk food. Leptin reset by Jack Kruse is a good protocol to follow.
  • If all else fails, look into neurofeedback.

P.S. Have you tried 4000 calories of animal fat(suet, tallow, lard), butter or coconut oil?

0
194d8e8140425057fe06202e1e5822a7

(3979)

on August 24, 2012
at 12:24 PM

More vegetables! Stuff that takes up space: broccoli stems (raw or cooked) brussel sprouts, cabbage, etc. Follow your fats and protein with stomach-filling complex carbohydrates (and their fiber and water content) and that should make you feel full and satiated. It should also help with the digestion of everything else, too.

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