2

votes

Hormones & Eating Fat

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created December 12, 2011 at 2:23 PM

I have been reading Dr. Harris' and other blogs on fat storage being about your hormonal state and not 100% about "if you eat fat you get fat" that whole thing, but my question is..

If I know right now my body is NOT in a hormonal state for fat burning ( I went through stress and have high cortisol for right now) how can I make sure that I don't worsen the problem? and how can i eat to minimize fat storage? (for the time being that is, until cortisol is back to normal)

Here is blood work just for extra info :

Cortisol Fasting = 924. Dheas 6.5 PTH 2.8 Testoterone 0.5 Estradiol 46 Insulin 47

Is it ok to be eating a high level of fat in this state? ( With the goal of NOT storing fat)

Thanks

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 12, 2011
at 10:48 PM

@Paleo4ever, I can't guarantee that none of the fat you eat in the next few weeks will be stored, but I do think you won't improved by feeling paralyzed by the possibilities. If you eat enough protein for your lean mass and enough fat for that amount of protein, then 60-70g of carbs should be perfect to nudge you into the burning of stored fat. And once that victory is achieved, then you can assume your body will become more and more willing to release stored fat as long as your food intake includes enough fat to avoid a starvation response.

Dfada6fe4982ab3b7557172f20632da8

(5332)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:54 PM

The body is in a constant dynamic state. Every time you eat it stores food to use up all the time you're not eating. Chances are you're not going to outsmart your body in determining the most efficient way to do this. Don't worry about the exact biological pathways, you don't need to understand it all in order to do it - no more than you need to study differential calculus to catch a ball.

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:48 PM

So, if i cook in Coconut oil, the mcts are used and the LCTs are stored? but if I'm creating a caloric deficit by working out etc than perhaps i am using the LCTS? do i have that right?

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:46 PM

Wonderful Nance, Thank you! So perhaps if I keep my Carbs around 50-60grams per day and moderate protein and fat that should be ok? I am just worried that If my cortisol is so high, and I'm eating high fat, Im giving my body sooooo much of what it is looking to store? does that sound silly?

7b11ed525ffa23bc7257684e27488a6a

(366)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:45 PM

I have no idea what your present eating and exercise schedule looks like. Moreover, I don't think there is a one-size-fits-all plan. I just wanted to demonstrate that there is more here than carbs to consider. Dogma on this front can run high. I am a low carb eater, and I feel best with ample protein and moderate fat. I exercise regularly and don't have any hormonal impairment, to the best of my knowledge. You may want to try out different things and see how you feel. Or work with a health professional.

Medium avatar

(39831)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:40 PM

The long chain fats you eat are pretty much always stored; whether or not you then burn those fats is a separate issue.

Dfada6fe4982ab3b7557172f20632da8

(5332)

on December 12, 2011
at 07:23 PM

Eat means you frequently miss the point, and spend a lot of time telling other people how wrong they are. That website you linked to is a good example of your level of critical thinking.

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 06:24 PM

Satya, so should i be lowering my fat right now?

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 04:09 PM

Thanks will read through that this evening.

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 04:03 PM

@Mash, I applaud your open and curiosity-driven approach to learning, it's far too rare nowadays. A good place to start is here: http://weightology.net/?p=265 . @Andy, I don't even know what that means, but I'm pretty sure you just like swinging from the wrong telephone pole.

Dfada6fe4982ab3b7557172f20632da8

(5332)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:59 PM

You're not completely wrong Mash, conciliator just likes beating off on the wrong end of the stick.

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:58 PM

I assume from your comments that you have read the book and so understand (and disagree) with his major thrust in terms of thermodynamics and nonindependent variables, in relation to calorie/energy ingestion. I read through a few of your posts on other questions and would be interested to know more and if you can point me to some articles which brought you into disagreement. Thanks.

7b11ed525ffa23bc7257684e27488a6a

(366)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:57 PM

I know many people who have gained weight on a high fat vlc-zc diet of meat and spices. Lex Rooker increased body fat by increasing fat percentage on an all meat diet years ago. http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/journals/lex%27s-journal/?PHPSESSID=ot58b3iul93uc4jqng1u6apfs7

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:35 PM

No, of course not completely. In fact there's a lot of sanity in your response, but I feel there are still some remnants of Taubes nonsense. For instance, you realize that caloric source is not hugely significant. However, I don't really subscribe to metabolic derangement. There are instances of certain deficiencies (thyroid, leptin) which can make fat loss more or less difficult but at the end of the day caloric balance is the main arbiter. Things like insulin resistance make blood sugar more difficult to control, which drives hunger, but it's not the insulin or their resistance per se.

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:24 PM

Thank you Andy...really appreciate it.

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:16 PM

Once you have a healthy amount of protein, the **only** significant thing that matters is your caloric balance at the end of the day. Things like dairy, fish oil, etc have all shown to help but the most important will always be caloric balance due to this thing called thermodynamics.

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:14 PM

conciliator, sorry do you mean I am completely wrong here?

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:12 PM

If you take everything Gary Taubes says, and reverse it, you would be more an expert on the subject than him.

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:09 PM

Unfortunately just because you personally believe it does not make it so. Let me count the ways: 1) Isonitrogenous calorically matched diets do equally well. 2) There are many more mediators of fat storage than insulin, e.g. ASP, catecholamines 3) GI does NOT have the relationship to insulin you think that it does. The greater the insulin response, the **lower** GI is (all else being equal).

082bf04a7486991c5e573a66f1404b3e

(813)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:05 PM

^ agree with this

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4 Answers

5
Dfada6fe4982ab3b7557172f20632da8

(5332)

on December 12, 2011
at 02:43 PM

If you're stressed and have high cortisol, you don't want to be adding to it by restricting your calories. Make sure you eat enough, eat fat and protein and lots of lovely multi-coloured veg, sleep well, stay active.

If you're concerned about weight the absolute best thing to do is get your body running smoothly again as soon as possible. The man who chases two rabbits catches neither. Or at best a rabbit. Chase a pig. Get bacon.

082bf04a7486991c5e573a66f1404b3e

(813)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:05 PM

^ agree with this

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:24 PM

Thank you Andy...really appreciate it.

1
Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:10 PM

From what I understand (and someone please do correct me if I am wrong), we do not store fat from eating dietary fat any quicker or differently than we store energy as fat from any calories we eat. That if I am metabolically deranged (phrase taken from "Gary Taubes - Good Calories, Bad Calories") then we will store energy in our fat cells quicker then we can release it back out.

I assume then that the choice in the type of calorie we eat is more about what alleviates metabolic derangement and hormonal imbalance rather than aggravate it further. Thus in my mind if one is in metabolic derangement or hormonal imbalance excessive calories do matter, but whether it is (x) calories of fat or carbohydrate does not matter apart from the mitigating or aggravating effect on the derangement.

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 04:09 PM

Thanks will read through that this evening.

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 04:03 PM

@Mash, I applaud your open and curiosity-driven approach to learning, it's far too rare nowadays. A good place to start is here: http://weightology.net/?p=265 . @Andy, I don't even know what that means, but I'm pretty sure you just like swinging from the wrong telephone pole.

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:12 PM

If you take everything Gary Taubes says, and reverse it, you would be more an expert on the subject than him.

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:14 PM

conciliator, sorry do you mean I am completely wrong here?

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:35 PM

No, of course not completely. In fact there's a lot of sanity in your response, but I feel there are still some remnants of Taubes nonsense. For instance, you realize that caloric source is not hugely significant. However, I don't really subscribe to metabolic derangement. There are instances of certain deficiencies (thyroid, leptin) which can make fat loss more or less difficult but at the end of the day caloric balance is the main arbiter. Things like insulin resistance make blood sugar more difficult to control, which drives hunger, but it's not the insulin or their resistance per se.

Dfada6fe4982ab3b7557172f20632da8

(5332)

on December 12, 2011
at 07:23 PM

Eat means you frequently miss the point, and spend a lot of time telling other people how wrong they are. That website you linked to is a good example of your level of critical thinking.

Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:58 PM

I assume from your comments that you have read the book and so understand (and disagree) with his major thrust in terms of thermodynamics and nonindependent variables, in relation to calorie/energy ingestion. I read through a few of your posts on other questions and would be interested to know more and if you can point me to some articles which brought you into disagreement. Thanks.

Dfada6fe4982ab3b7557172f20632da8

(5332)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:59 PM

You're not completely wrong Mash, conciliator just likes beating off on the wrong end of the stick.

1
082bf04a7486991c5e573a66f1404b3e

on December 12, 2011
at 02:31 PM

Personally, I think insulin is the key to fat storage. If you want to minimise it, in any state, try and keep insulin stable.

This basically means stay away from high glycemic loads (high GI carbs, or large quantities of medium GI carbs)

Cf32992bfa1907147c7cdc451bba9c63

(2890)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:09 PM

Unfortunately just because you personally believe it does not make it so. Let me count the ways: 1) Isonitrogenous calorically matched diets do equally well. 2) There are many more mediators of fat storage than insulin, e.g. ASP, catecholamines 3) GI does NOT have the relationship to insulin you think that it does. The greater the insulin response, the **lower** GI is (all else being equal).

7b11ed525ffa23bc7257684e27488a6a

(366)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:45 PM

I have no idea what your present eating and exercise schedule looks like. Moreover, I don't think there is a one-size-fits-all plan. I just wanted to demonstrate that there is more here than carbs to consider. Dogma on this front can run high. I am a low carb eater, and I feel best with ample protein and moderate fat. I exercise regularly and don't have any hormonal impairment, to the best of my knowledge. You may want to try out different things and see how you feel. Or work with a health professional.

7b11ed525ffa23bc7257684e27488a6a

(366)

on December 12, 2011
at 03:57 PM

I know many people who have gained weight on a high fat vlc-zc diet of meat and spices. Lex Rooker increased body fat by increasing fat percentage on an all meat diet years ago. http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/journals/lex%27s-journal/?PHPSESSID=ot58b3iul93uc4jqng1u6apfs7

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 06:24 PM

Satya, so should i be lowering my fat right now?

0
96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:20 PM

I started in exactly the place you're describing and it didn't change in a week or two but it did change. First, I read somewhere that you don't have to throw your whole system into severe stress. You can nudge rather than bludgeon.

I started at about 60g of carbs per day and unlimited protein/fats. The intent was that I would not eat quite enough carbs to keep just burning them (vs. stored fat) but I wouldn't drastically starve my system of fuel either. In keeping with Dr Jack Kruse's leptin reset, I did try to start my day with fatty meat and wait a bit before eating anything else.

Because I took such a conservative approach, there were no rapid breakthroughs but there were no major breakdowns either. I'd guess within 2 weeks there were signs I was releasing and burning stored fat because I woke up high energy and wasn't desperate to eat right away. I'm not sure when the transition was complete, but I can say now that if I don't eat I just burn as much stored fat as needed. When I eat, I seem to lose steadily but it's a gentle and invisible process and I just notice my clothes keep getting a little looser.

I've read many success stories of people who pushed much harder and lost weight faster but I wasn't up for that and I'm not sorry because I also haven't experienced some of the reported plateaus and emotional lows.

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on December 12, 2011
at 09:46 PM

Wonderful Nance, Thank you! So perhaps if I keep my Carbs around 50-60grams per day and moderate protein and fat that should be ok? I am just worried that If my cortisol is so high, and I'm eating high fat, Im giving my body sooooo much of what it is looking to store? does that sound silly?

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 12, 2011
at 10:48 PM

@Paleo4ever, I can't guarantee that none of the fat you eat in the next few weeks will be stored, but I do think you won't improved by feeling paralyzed by the possibilities. If you eat enough protein for your lean mass and enough fat for that amount of protein, then 60-70g of carbs should be perfect to nudge you into the burning of stored fat. And once that victory is achieved, then you can assume your body will become more and more willing to release stored fat as long as your food intake includes enough fat to avoid a starvation response.

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