11

votes

What is the worst possible neolethal ingredient?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created September 09, 2010 at 7:40 PM

Let's have gluten, sugar, PUFAs, and other assorted neolethal ingredients battle it out. So which is the worst?

6371f0ae0c075ded1b8cd30aafd4bf16

on August 10, 2011
at 03:00 PM

http://www.maunaloa.com/products/macadamia/maui-onion-and-garlic.asp It was a sample pack of these Jack.

Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18472)

on August 10, 2011
at 12:29 AM

odd. that's not on the mac nuts that I buy from them. same brand too >> mac nuts, salt. http://paleohacks.com/questions/12674/datapoints-how-much-per-lb-do-you-pay-for-macadamia-nuts/24845#24845

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 09, 2011
at 09:01 PM

As a working chemist I've had my share of laughs, both here and on other diet sites. I especially the acronyms PUFA and Omega, instead of commonly used chemical names like linoleic or linolenic acid. It gives the whole thing an unnecessary whiff of pseudoscience.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 09, 2011
at 08:52 PM

I'll give you a simplified answer. Frosted mini wheats. It contains all the bad things in one irresistible-to-eat package.

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on August 09, 2011
at 05:32 PM

http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-fats/precious-yet-perilous

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on August 09, 2011
at 05:32 PM

EXCESS omega-6 is the issue. Doh.

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 09, 2011
at 05:08 PM

Jeff, one of the problems with HFCS is that it is so cheap because of subsidies, that it is put in every thing. And because it contributes moisture and mouth feel similar to fats it really took off as a fat replacement during the height of fat-phobia, so that you find it in salad dressings and in fat free baked goods at twice the amount as sugar, in spaghetti sauce and innumerable other "foods" that never or rarely contained sugar.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on August 09, 2011
at 04:27 PM

I'd wager most people realize that PUFAs are wholly essential. There is simply no need to actively seek them out since it'd be difficult to eat anything like paleo without getting them.this is mug different than n3s, which are actually quite easily missed, in many people's way of eating.

64433a05384cd9717c1aa6bf7e98b661

(15236)

on August 09, 2011
at 04:09 PM

not that I'm in favor of it, and not that sugar is good, but if sucrose is 50-50 glucose/fructose and HFCS is 45-55 glucose/fructose, is it that much worse than sugar?

B3c62d89cd47b7d7209b6a99243d0ded

(10778)

on February 04, 2011
at 03:51 PM

Travis, i think those are called deep-fried twinkies.

03281912f1cb9e4e771a8a83af302e3a

(1204)

on February 04, 2011
at 05:05 AM

To be fair to this conversation, I am going to re-read The Vegetarian Myth as objectively as possible before I comment anymore on the subject. It's not fair to discuss it without a cemented opinion. I may change my mind with a different mindset.

149af6e19a06675614dfbb6838a7d7c0

(3202)

on February 04, 2011
at 04:57 AM

Fair enough. Have you read anything that you can recommend on the subject you enjoyed more. I am looking to continue the education. Thank you.

03281912f1cb9e4e771a8a83af302e3a

(1204)

on February 03, 2011
at 11:59 PM

I liked the book, I just think the message is more for people who are already in the vegan and vegetarian clique. It was written to them, for them, and itwad the same tone as a vegetarian trying to convert a regular old omnivore. She has every right to have an agenda against the system that nearly killed her, but I didn't rank it as one of my favorite works. Don't get me wrong, the message is right on, and the woman has tremendous brass to go against the grain to spread this message. I just wasn;t as impressed as a lot of people.

149af6e19a06675614dfbb6838a7d7c0

(3202)

on February 03, 2011
at 06:28 AM

Did either of you bother to read her book? If so, lets have a dialogue on it. I would love to know how you see her agenda and how her book was flawed. I loved her book but then again I didn't feel Huck Finn was racist...so much for my sensitivity.

03281912f1cb9e4e771a8a83af302e3a

(1204)

on February 03, 2011
at 04:07 AM

I thought I might be the only person that felt that way.

034c678bff434ab3781e3f1771018af9

(279)

on February 03, 2011
at 02:32 AM

My vote goes for the unthoughtful anti-vegetarians, the kind of people who think that Lierre Kieth wrote a well-researched, rigorous critique. Agenda much?

Medium avatar

(39831)

on February 02, 2011
at 11:30 PM

What about *partially hydrogenated* high fructose wheat gluten?

C2502365891cbcc8af2d1cf1d7b0e9fc

(2437)

on January 04, 2011
at 11:54 AM

downvoted for the formatting

Medium avatar

(3029)

on January 03, 2011
at 07:23 PM

Couldn't even comment. Don't remember what McDonalds french fries taste like. Haven't eaten there for decades.

Eafee106d73d49bdaec8cb3dae41d514

on January 03, 2011
at 06:38 PM

I would agree with this. Making sugar subsidized and cheap, yum yum.

Cab7e4ef73c5d7d7a77e1c3d7f5773a1

(7304)

on January 02, 2011
at 09:11 PM

Mcdonalds french fries are delicious. I make my own now with tallow, but rancid vegetable oils can taste very good.

Medium avatar

(3029)

on January 01, 2011
at 07:30 AM

I'm sorry, I understand the logic, but there is something deeply disturbing about buying food with the intention of throwing half of it away.

48f9bb680fbc1bc1bd0d9cb09ee10273

(230)

on September 11, 2010
at 08:39 PM

Its insidious!!! Its in every thing that's a manufactured food product - which for most American's is a huge part of the SAD. Oh, and don't get me started on those fraking "HFCS is natural" commercials they run on TV sometimes - argh!!!!!

Af842c68e3d07fa0e35b4274f3acaeec

on September 11, 2010
at 07:30 PM

oh yeah, I'm not saying you can't live on it, I'm just saying that it causes a lot of problems. I also think that the way foods are processed and prepared have changed recently, and this has allowed these substances to become more prevalent in their active forms in food.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 11:35 PM

Which nonpaleo eaters consume few industrial oils? 90% of the vegetable-based oil consumed in the US is from soy and corn.

1a8020e101199de55c1b3b726f342321

(1973)

on September 10, 2010
at 09:39 PM

Quite variable depending on the diet, some people consume few industrial oils but lots of gluten and vice versa.

77732bf6bf2b8a360f523ef87c3b7523

(6157)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:41 PM

The question wasn't based on impact/ubiquitousness, at least as Melissa framed it.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on September 10, 2010
at 01:45 PM

devil's advocate but, couldnt you kind of similarly argue that gluten-grains have fed many pretty industrial peoples throughout history? Granted, much less than our paleo foods, but still, not till pretty recently were so many people so busted up from gluten. (i avoid it like the plague and rec others to, too - just sayin)

A89f9751a97c3082802dc0bcbe4e9208

(13978)

on September 10, 2010
at 06:29 AM

I made some recently... http://clubfritch.com/2010/09/01/gluten-free-timbits/

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:17 AM

Instead of relative concentrations, typical dietary concentrations may be more practical.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:17 AM

Hi Jae, it's your nemesis Kamal. I wouldn't vote for trans fat because it's the only one on the list that looks to be on its way out. Once Michael Bloomberg and CSPI target something, it's kaput!

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:15 AM

coconut flour, heavy cream, and egg donuts; coated with dark chocolate glaze, sprinkled with bone marrow and bacon bits? i believe the paleo military contingent to iraq gets these in their rations.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:12 AM

That is pure genius. To take it to another level, I could go to my mom's house and put worms in all the grains and sugar. That'll teach her!

F82f7d4dafb6d0ffc4c2ee2a85420786

(484)

on September 10, 2010
at 04:35 AM

I saw the best solution to that dilemma on a bad reality show recently - if you don't want to eat all of something bad, eat half, spray it with windex and throw it out, then it can't call its siren song to you. Ok, so you don't get any the next day, but if it's a desperate case...

4b97e3bb2ee4a9588783f5d56d687da1

(22913)

on September 10, 2010
at 03:23 AM

And dates have alot of sugar. I'm all for donut shaped steak.

4b97e3bb2ee4a9588783f5d56d687da1

(22913)

on September 10, 2010
at 03:22 AM

Almond flour has Pufas.

77732bf6bf2b8a360f523ef87c3b7523

(6157)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:34 AM

I'm with you on trans fats and I can't believe it's not getting more votes. Trans fat is by far the newest addition to the Neolethal arsenal, extremely harmful even in small doses, and is present in many processed foods. We've been eating sugar in various forms for much longer than that, and gluten as well. Both sugar and gluten are harmful, but there is no way to neutralize trans fats. Sugar can be consumed in moderation in real foods such as fruit and tubers; even gluten can be (mildly) mitigated through fermentation.

62ed65f3596aa2f62fa1d58a0c09f8c3

(20807)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:10 AM

You took my answer! I don't know why exactly, but that stuff creeps me out more than the others.

691f120a3e7a1a036845d105d86c99a3

(3641)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:04 AM

mmm, donuts. has anyone made a donut from coconut and almond flour fried in lard and dusted with erm... finely chopped dates?

1a8020e101199de55c1b3b726f342321

(1973)

on September 09, 2010
at 08:15 PM

Equal amounts of each? Gluten is the clear winner as it works at nanomolar concentrations.

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27 Answers

15
C0fcb48d7da4f76fac17318efd2cd6b8

on September 09, 2010
at 08:09 PM

High fructose corn syrup.

62ed65f3596aa2f62fa1d58a0c09f8c3

(20807)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:10 AM

You took my answer! I don't know why exactly, but that stuff creeps me out more than the others.

48f9bb680fbc1bc1bd0d9cb09ee10273

(230)

on September 11, 2010
at 08:39 PM

Its insidious!!! Its in every thing that's a manufactured food product - which for most American's is a huge part of the SAD. Oh, and don't get me started on those fraking "HFCS is natural" commercials they run on TV sometimes - argh!!!!!

Eafee106d73d49bdaec8cb3dae41d514

on January 03, 2011
at 06:38 PM

I would agree with this. Making sugar subsidized and cheap, yum yum.

64433a05384cd9717c1aa6bf7e98b661

(15236)

on August 09, 2011
at 04:09 PM

not that I'm in favor of it, and not that sugar is good, but if sucrose is 50-50 glucose/fructose and HFCS is 45-55 glucose/fructose, is it that much worse than sugar?

5ccb98f6ae42ce87e206cf3f6a86039f

(11581)

on August 09, 2011
at 05:08 PM

Jeff, one of the problems with HFCS is that it is so cheap because of subsidies, that it is put in every thing. And because it contributes moisture and mouth feel similar to fats it really took off as a fat replacement during the height of fat-phobia, so that you find it in salad dressings and in fat free baked goods at twice the amount as sugar, in spaghetti sauce and innumerable other "foods" that never or rarely contained sugar.

14
3f61ba25dff05b513c7769a22408169a

on September 09, 2010
at 07:43 PM

My vote goes for gluten with PUFA's running a close second. At least that is the order that they punish me in.

9
F5698e16f1793c0bb00daea6a2e222a4

(678)

on September 09, 2010
at 07:51 PM

I think it might vary by individual.

The biggest offender imo is hydrogenated oil, with trans fat being the worst.

77732bf6bf2b8a360f523ef87c3b7523

(6157)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:34 AM

I'm with you on trans fats and I can't believe it's not getting more votes. Trans fat is by far the newest addition to the Neolethal arsenal, extremely harmful even in small doses, and is present in many processed foods. We've been eating sugar in various forms for much longer than that, and gluten as well. Both sugar and gluten are harmful, but there is no way to neutralize trans fats. Sugar can be consumed in moderation in real foods such as fruit and tubers; even gluten can be (mildly) mitigated through fermentation.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:17 AM

Hi Jae, it's your nemesis Kamal. I wouldn't vote for trans fat because it's the only one on the list that looks to be on its way out. Once Michael Bloomberg and CSPI target something, it's kaput!

77732bf6bf2b8a360f523ef87c3b7523

(6157)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:41 PM

The question wasn't based on impact/ubiquitousness, at least as Melissa framed it.

7
Medium avatar

(3029)

on January 01, 2011
at 07:27 AM

PUFA because there is no upside. A fresh-baked loaf of bread can be heavenly. We can get pleasure from a sweet treat. But what is the upside of PUFAs???? People lose their health so they can eat disgusting margarine and GMO soybean oil??? EPIC FAIL

Medium avatar

(3029)

on January 03, 2011
at 07:23 PM

Couldn't even comment. Don't remember what McDonalds french fries taste like. Haven't eaten there for decades.

Cab7e4ef73c5d7d7a77e1c3d7f5773a1

(7304)

on January 02, 2011
at 09:11 PM

Mcdonalds french fries are delicious. I make my own now with tallow, but rancid vegetable oils can taste very good.

6
B3c62d89cd47b7d7209b6a99243d0ded

on January 03, 2011
at 07:03 PM

High Fructose Wheat Gluten

You know somebody out there is going to invent it, just to put it in Corn Sugar Smack(s) Cereal.. now with Sweet Soy Milk.

C2502365891cbcc8af2d1cf1d7b0e9fc

(2437)

on January 04, 2011
at 11:54 AM

downvoted for the formatting

Medium avatar

(39831)

on February 02, 2011
at 11:30 PM

What about *partially hydrogenated* high fructose wheat gluten?

B3c62d89cd47b7d7209b6a99243d0ded

(10778)

on February 04, 2011
at 03:51 PM

Travis, i think those are called deep-fried twinkies.

6
C1ea79115a062250a7263764797faa30

(851)

on January 03, 2011
at 04:31 PM

This may sound like a flippant answer, but I would say that the one ingredient (or factor) which leads to the most problems in the modern world is convenience.

6
7bea72ef073e8f76b5828727f1460900

(2718)

on September 10, 2010
at 01:23 AM

My feelings right now are:

  1. Gluten
  2. PUFAs
  3. Sugar

You can get the unholy trinity by eating a donut.

691f120a3e7a1a036845d105d86c99a3

(3641)

on September 10, 2010
at 02:04 AM

mmm, donuts. has anyone made a donut from coconut and almond flour fried in lard and dusted with erm... finely chopped dates?

4b97e3bb2ee4a9588783f5d56d687da1

(22913)

on September 10, 2010
at 03:22 AM

Almond flour has Pufas.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:15 AM

coconut flour, heavy cream, and egg donuts; coated with dark chocolate glaze, sprinkled with bone marrow and bacon bits? i believe the paleo military contingent to iraq gets these in their rations.

4b97e3bb2ee4a9588783f5d56d687da1

(22913)

on September 10, 2010
at 03:23 AM

And dates have alot of sugar. I'm all for donut shaped steak.

A89f9751a97c3082802dc0bcbe4e9208

(13978)

on September 10, 2010
at 06:29 AM

I made some recently... http://clubfritch.com/2010/09/01/gluten-free-timbits/

5
07c86972a3bea0b0dc17752e9d2f5642

on January 01, 2011
at 12:58 PM

PUFA trans-fat and sugar. I don't think traditionally prepared wheat in normal quantities is a huge problem for some populations. It's worse for others of course. But industrial oils and sugar aren't good for anyone.

I was born in 1983 and hadn't tasted real butter until recently. I shudder at the thought of all the tubs of margarine I ate, all the hydrogenated soybean oil mayo and hydrogenated peanut butter. Every day I had gobs of all three. When I was 22 I had an ekg, ultrasound and heart monitor because I had a heart murmur and chest pain (docs concluded it was fine, but it still freaked me and my mom out).

Millions of people like my parents raised their kids on the stuff thinking they were doing the best for their health. And its the reason why I will never support any government "healthy eating" efforts, even if I ultimately agree, like the soda tax. I am of Mexican and Native American ancestry and I want to scream when I think about how many of my relatives, friends and community members have had their lives cut short as a direct result of the government meddling/guidelines. Just about everyone in my family over age 40 has diabetes and many younger ones as well.

4
21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 09, 2010
at 08:09 PM

Great question! My vote is for yellow #6, which makes Mountain Dew harmful. But for real, I'm betting against gluten, and putting money on either PUFA or sugar. Gluten can be terrible for some, can creep up on others as they age, and can seem to have no clinical effect on others. PUFA affects the body's hormonal milieu, and sugar does nothing good and is addictive as crack. I'm eating a bar of 86% chocolate right now and I have to use all my willpower to keep some for tomorrow.

F82f7d4dafb6d0ffc4c2ee2a85420786

(484)

on September 10, 2010
at 04:35 AM

I saw the best solution to that dilemma on a bad reality show recently - if you don't want to eat all of something bad, eat half, spray it with windex and throw it out, then it can't call its siren song to you. Ok, so you don't get any the next day, but if it's a desperate case...

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:12 AM

That is pure genius. To take it to another level, I could go to my mom's house and put worms in all the grains and sugar. That'll teach her!

Medium avatar

(3029)

on January 01, 2011
at 07:30 AM

I'm sorry, I understand the logic, but there is something deeply disturbing about buying food with the intention of throwing half of it away.

3
149af6e19a06675614dfbb6838a7d7c0

on January 01, 2011
at 04:45 PM

My vote goes to vegetarianism. After reading "The Vegetarian Myth" by Lierre Kieth, I want to eat them all. I loves me some grass fed/grass smoked hippy. Veg Heads are as Neolithic as you get. No Paleo tribes surviving on plants. I don't worry about the souless money chasing men and women who sell us grains and sugars and oils. They will move on to greener pastures when they are shown the money trail. But...the holier than thou Vegers who claim moral high ground have great access to the media and influence. The insulin I inject every day to keep me alive exists because dogs were sacrificed to perfect the insulin techniques. I love dogs but I love Diabetics more. I can avoid the grains and sugars and seed oil obstacle course but the Vegetarian Agenda makers want to shove a carrot down my throat. Gag. This town ain't big enough for the both of us.

149af6e19a06675614dfbb6838a7d7c0

(3202)

on February 03, 2011
at 06:28 AM

Did either of you bother to read her book? If so, lets have a dialogue on it. I would love to know how you see her agenda and how her book was flawed. I loved her book but then again I didn't feel Huck Finn was racist...so much for my sensitivity.

03281912f1cb9e4e771a8a83af302e3a

(1204)

on February 03, 2011
at 04:07 AM

I thought I might be the only person that felt that way.

034c678bff434ab3781e3f1771018af9

(279)

on February 03, 2011
at 02:32 AM

My vote goes for the unthoughtful anti-vegetarians, the kind of people who think that Lierre Kieth wrote a well-researched, rigorous critique. Agenda much?

03281912f1cb9e4e771a8a83af302e3a

(1204)

on February 04, 2011
at 05:05 AM

To be fair to this conversation, I am going to re-read The Vegetarian Myth as objectively as possible before I comment anymore on the subject. It's not fair to discuss it without a cemented opinion. I may change my mind with a different mindset.

03281912f1cb9e4e771a8a83af302e3a

(1204)

on February 03, 2011
at 11:59 PM

I liked the book, I just think the message is more for people who are already in the vegan and vegetarian clique. It was written to them, for them, and itwad the same tone as a vegetarian trying to convert a regular old omnivore. She has every right to have an agenda against the system that nearly killed her, but I didn't rank it as one of my favorite works. Don't get me wrong, the message is right on, and the woman has tremendous brass to go against the grain to spread this message. I just wasn;t as impressed as a lot of people.

149af6e19a06675614dfbb6838a7d7c0

(3202)

on February 04, 2011
at 04:57 AM

Fair enough. Have you read anything that you can recommend on the subject you enjoyed more. I am looking to continue the education. Thank you.

3
Af842c68e3d07fa0e35b4274f3acaeec

on September 09, 2010
at 09:03 PM

Gluten, I think the science shows that nearly everyone has a response to it.

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2008/12/gluten-sensitivity-celiac-disease-is.html

Sugar, though harmful, isn't the biggest worry in my opinion. Refined sugar is definitely a source of trouble, but there are are hunter-gatherer populations that get nearly all of their energy from carbs and still don't suffer from the diseases we do. So there HAS to be something else going on there.

The skewed omega-3/omega-6 balance is a pretty big deal as well, I might put that second.

[Edit] I think a lot of it has to do with the combined damage from damaging substances (gluten, lectins, trypsin inhibitors, etc) on our gut and body and that it has made us much more susceptible to the effects of these damaging substances. It's basically the perfect storm of chronic disease.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on September 10, 2010
at 01:45 PM

devil's advocate but, couldnt you kind of similarly argue that gluten-grains have fed many pretty industrial peoples throughout history? Granted, much less than our paleo foods, but still, not till pretty recently were so many people so busted up from gluten. (i avoid it like the plague and rec others to, too - just sayin)

Af842c68e3d07fa0e35b4274f3acaeec

on September 11, 2010
at 07:30 PM

oh yeah, I'm not saying you can't live on it, I'm just saying that it causes a lot of problems. I also think that the way foods are processed and prepared have changed recently, and this has allowed these substances to become more prevalent in their active forms in food.

3
9d741bcbe702044635f2ce3078043054

(1435)

on September 09, 2010
at 07:52 PM

From what I have read, the "diseases of civilization" really ramped up when sugar became available to the masses. Rich men's diseases like gout and obesity became common after the 1700s saw sugar prices drop to the point where it became more than a rare treat for most people.

It's hard to overconsume sugar in its natural state (in fruit or even in the cane), but once refined, it is a scourge.

2
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on February 02, 2011
at 10:50 PM

In order from worst to least worst(for my body, it may be different for other people)

The worst of the Neolithic era:

  1. Gluten containing grains
  2. Soy
  3. Dairy
  4. Processed sugar

The worst of the Industrial era:

  1. MSG and aspartame(both are excitotoxins which cause cell death and damage to the brain and consequently the body.)
  2. Trans fat(soy oils, margarine ect.)
  3. Genetically Modified Organisms(patented by Monsanto the most unethical company in the world, need I say more? Avoid GMO!)
  4. Fluoridated water(can lower IQ, cause health problems ect. Is actually a poison if you do research on it you may be shocked.)

2
D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on January 03, 2011
at 06:20 PM

I'm leaning more towards sugar than gluten. It's probably not helpful to make the distinction. But fructose at current rates of consumption is drastically hampering the bodies ability to detoxify itself. I wouldn't at all be surprised to find fructose as the major factor in metabolic derangement.

Per usual, Sugar the Bitter Truth: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

The question a lot of people seem to be answering is what's the better binge: Sugar, PUFAs, or gluten. Sugar is the better binge because of the level of dosage it takes for problems to arise. But looking at the current levels of consumption, I'd say more benefit would come for removing sugar than removing the other two. But really we don't know is the answer. All of them suck.

2
8e3782b68e033763485472f414f507a5

(2433)

on September 10, 2010
at 01:13 PM

PUFAs.

A good number of primitive cultures eat/ate grains without any diseases of civilization. Most did some kind of preperation (fermentation, soaking, etc), but not all.

Perhaps PUFAs and sugars jack up our guts and induce gluten sensitivity.

2
5f0158c23fcb5636e57b4ce097784da0

(1386)

on September 10, 2010
at 01:09 PM

i'd say any undiagnosed food allergy in general. you can eat perfectly healthy, but they still can make you suffer for decades, without you even knowing why. EVERY chronic problem you have, e.g. knee pain or skin problems etc should be challenged with an elimination diet to see if it's caused by an allergy/sensitivity. for example, i had worsening knee problems (similar to arthritis), and only recently found out it's actually from milk protein. even butter is enough to trigger it for me.

2
1a8020e101199de55c1b3b726f342321

(1973)

on September 09, 2010
at 08:21 PM

Gluten, PUFA then sugar if we're talking relative concentrations.

Gluten exerts it's effect at very low concentrations (nanomolar).

PUFA exerts it's effects at the single digit gram level (4% calories as n-6 is a nasty level).

Taubes had a section ball parking sugar's effects at around 20 grams a day in indigenous cultures.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:17 AM

Instead of relative concentrations, typical dietary concentrations may be more practical.

1a8020e101199de55c1b3b726f342321

(1973)

on September 10, 2010
at 09:39 PM

Quite variable depending on the diet, some people consume few industrial oils but lots of gluten and vice versa.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on September 10, 2010
at 11:35 PM

Which nonpaleo eaters consume few industrial oils? 90% of the vegetable-based oil consumed in the US is from soy and corn.

1
8274ce9d4bffd8209055e1e34def04d6

(429)

on January 02, 2011
at 02:38 AM

I would say that the most neolethal food would be the one that leads to eating even more neolethal foods! Probably sugar...

1
B3c62d89cd47b7d7209b6a99243d0ded

on September 12, 2010
at 02:45 AM

Either

A: transfats, since no human has the pathways to make good use of those altered fats,

or,

B: whichever neolethal ingredient you are highly allergic to...

Example: transfats will make me obese and unhappy/demented, but red-40 will kill me quick.

1
E14f0125b66eef4e61505dba0aebb0aa

on September 12, 2010
at 02:20 AM

I am a celiac so grains/gluten and dairy are a tie for the number one spot. I react badly to both!

1
E9214b7dfa3352f4e559555f87311287

on September 10, 2010
at 11:22 PM

I'm with PUFAs. It's possible to get obesity and diabetes without gluten, but I bet it would be super tough to do without Out of balance PUFAs

1
667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on September 10, 2010
at 01:48 PM

I think its PUFA or sugar...which one, though? Tough.

If sugar includes HFCS then i'd say thats gotta take it. Even within my own time on this planet (31 years old) I've seen, and been subject to, the ill effects of the massive change in sugars' presence in the SAD. Sure, my diet growing up was never good (by what i now believe) but nearly every year it seems there is just more and more sugar in the SAD.

1
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on September 10, 2010
at 05:30 AM

What about genetically modified foods? Then fructose and gluten. Then all the other crap.

0
6371f0ae0c075ded1b8cd30aafd4bf16

on August 09, 2011
at 10:52 PM

Hydrolized Corn Gluten. I saw this listen on some mauana loa macadamia nuts. It just sounds evil.

Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18472)

on August 10, 2011
at 12:29 AM

odd. that's not on the mac nuts that I buy from them. same brand too >> mac nuts, salt. http://paleohacks.com/questions/12674/datapoints-how-much-per-lb-do-you-pay-for-macadamia-nuts/24845#24845

6371f0ae0c075ded1b8cd30aafd4bf16

on August 10, 2011
at 03:00 PM

http://www.maunaloa.com/products/macadamia/maui-onion-and-garlic.asp It was a sample pack of these Jack.

0
Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18472)

on August 09, 2011
at 07:48 PM

What is the worst possible neolethal ingredient?

First: any Partially Hydrogenated 'Vegetable' Oil

Second: High Fructose Corn Syrup

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 09, 2011
at 08:52 PM

I'll give you a simplified answer. Frosted mini wheats. It contains all the bad things in one irresistible-to-eat package.

0
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on August 09, 2011
at 04:00 PM

many people that post here and throughout the paleo/primal community have some serious misunderstandings related to PUFAs. Omega-6? it's an essential fatty acid. you NEED it, folks. too much is bad, and it's easily acquired, but to count it or any other PUFA as a neolithic food ingredient is really just wrong. PUFAs are found in meat too, so they're by definition paleolithic. and Omega-3, which we all love, is a PUFA.

i think i know the basic context in which you've offered them up as a neolithic ingredient - added oils like sunflower, corn oil etc. agreed on my end, those are no good.

but the way that people speak about PUFAs in our community would make a scientist laugh.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on August 09, 2011
at 04:27 PM

I'd wager most people realize that PUFAs are wholly essential. There is simply no need to actively seek them out since it'd be difficult to eat anything like paleo without getting them.this is mug different than n3s, which are actually quite easily missed, in many people's way of eating.

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on August 09, 2011
at 05:32 PM

EXCESS omega-6 is the issue. Doh.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 09, 2011
at 09:01 PM

As a working chemist I've had my share of laughs, both here and on other diet sites. I especially the acronyms PUFA and Omega, instead of commonly used chemical names like linoleic or linolenic acid. It gives the whole thing an unnecessary whiff of pseudoscience.

9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on August 09, 2011
at 05:32 PM

http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-fats/precious-yet-perilous

0
35deb6722604c868c610088a6d8ce09e

(295)

on September 09, 2010
at 08:24 PM

Hmm...maybe soy and all the deriative franken-foods? (think "veggie bacon", though not sure about miso, seitan, tempeh, etc.)

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