1

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Low fat rest days? vitamins and minerals absorbed more poorly on a high fat diet?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created July 17, 2012 at 10:01 AM

Okay, in trying to figure out my high stimulated state on low carb, I came across the following:

"In a 5-day metabolic study of five normal medical students given a liquid diet, such as that given to preoperative peptic ulcer patients (that delivered 138 g of fat, predominantly from whole milk and cream, and that provided only about 200 mg of magnesium daily), there was an average daily loss of 16 mg of magnesium (Macbeth and Mabbott, 1964). This amount of dietary fat is equivalent to that of the typical American diet, comprising about 40% of the daily calories (de los Rios, 1961). This liquid diet differed from that given to the young men on the linoleic acid diet (Hathaway, 1962) in that the ratio of calcium to magnesium was 9:1, rather than 2:1.

Metabolic balance studies in rats on low- and high-fat diets have also shown that increasing the fat intake decreases the amount of magnesium absorbed from the gut (Olson and Parker, 1964; Tadayyon and Lutwak, 1969)."

More details and studies on the same here: http://www.mgwater.com/Seelig/Magnesium-Deficiency-in-the-Pathogenesis-of-Disease/chapter5.shtml

It would seem river water hardness (calcium and magnesium ions combined) varies from about 50mg/L to about 500mg/L. Treated drinking water on the other hand varies from 20mg/L to about 50mg/L. Bottled water has even less.

To compound things, ontop of this wheat can have a decent amount of magnesium.

So we can guess where the inuit and massai may have been getting there magnesium from - from natural water ways. Not so easy for us high fat, low carbers, unless your one of the smaller group shown in the studies provided that dont lose magnesium absorbtion on high fat diets.

Of course theres the often cited electrolyte problem, with sodium and potassium. Certainly both the inuit and massai would have gotten some significant amount from their practice of consuming blood. Perhaps though, not such a big deal for us, we can just eat some salt, fruit, nuts and dark leafy greens. If you got your mineral foods it seems like youd be fine. At least in everything but magnesium, it would seem.

So the question is....is there any harms, or other benefits, on a low carb paleo diet, having some low-fat rest days ?

(also low carb, something like vegan, salad greens, vege soups and lean pescatarian food with some serious dark leafies and also a few berries- also oil free as magnesium is also inhibited by unsaturates as well, possibly more)

And are there any other vitamins and minerals absorbed more poorly on a high fat diet?

Do you think a rest day or two would also clear the digestive tract, enough of fat, that digestion for other things would improve in that timespan?

Of course for magnesium I could supplement (and probably will somehow), or even perhaps take an epsom salts bath, but I wonder, could I also miss out on something else by consuming basically fat with every meal...

2336245491a87ee15d4fb8f8f8283909

(1173)

on July 19, 2012
at 02:01 AM

As I said, do your research..... Fat soluble vitamins are also known as activators because they serve as the catalysts for mineral absorption. Without them, minerals cannot by used by the body, no matter how plentiful they may be in the diet

2336245491a87ee15d4fb8f8f8283909

(1173)

on July 19, 2012
at 02:01 AM

As I said, do your research fat soluble vitamins are also known as activators because they serve as the catalysts for mineral absorption. Without them, minerals cannot by used by the body, no matter how plentiful they may be in the diet.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 18, 2012
at 12:25 AM

^ Yeah, I know theres plenty of fat soluble vitamins. Minerals though seem to be largely water soluble.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 01:01 PM

"Instant oatmeal, dairy and soy milk, some types of cereals and some brands of white bread" . Oh didnt realise all that stuff was fortified. Guess cause I never brought any of it very often. Wasnt much of a breakfast eater.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 01:00 PM

^ never really used to eat breakfast, or lunch, unless it was takeout

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:51 PM

"Instant oatmeal, dairy and soy milk, some types of cereals and some brands of white bread" . Oh didnt realise all that stuff was fortified. Never used to consume any of it really (commercial bread, milk, cereal or soy), but I guess I remember seeing something about that on a pack of bread once...

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:35 PM

What fortified foods are in the sad diet? Only ones I can think of are omega 3 eggs, and fortified soy milk, lol. perhaps theres many more. Enlighten me as to what u mean. Magnesium is generally not that well absorbed, and its also highly water soluble, so this makes practical sense in some way I think.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:32 PM

I wonder how many of us low carbers with this phenomena, also have compromised digestion....?

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:19 PM

Not sure its totally coherent I agree, but it seems the most plausible explaination I have come across so far for this phenomena, that fat reduces absorbtion of magnesium. IMO Better than adrenaline/cortisol, better than electrolytes (which at least with me, are just fine). For me, its not like I got these symptoms first day of eating no carbs. Not even after a month. It just started recently really, after over a month. But then I am not sure if thats the standard pattern for this phenomenon...

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:16 PM

What fortified foods are in the sad diet? Only ones I can think of are omega 3 eggs, and fortified soy milk, lol. perhaps theres many more. Enlighten me as to what u mean. There has to be some reason why low carbers seem to often find then need to take magnesium supplements and get anxiety and sleep and heart issues. This offers a rationale of sorts, even if the various studies are a little mismatched and all over the place, theres quite a very saying similar things. Magnesium is generally not that well absorbed, and its also highly water soluble.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 11:34 AM

Seems like magnesium is like a muscle/brain off switch sorta, switches off the calcium channels. Probably over simplified, but thats the impression I get. Okay, thats enough on magnesium for now, lol, back to the question!

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 11:33 AM

Oh, and also, if someone does supplement with magnesium, be aware, you can have both too much and too little. Both are bad. Any magensium supplement should have its % of RDA on there somewhere. Thats a good starting point. Check that out, and based on that and the fact youll probably get a little from your food, I reckon, start with a smaller dose (split pills if ness), taken with food (preferably a less fatty or oily meal) and see where you go from there.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 11:19 AM

Re the whole magnesium issue that its notoriously hard even using just the numbers in normal foods to get the RDA. The majority of normal SAD eaters are already under whats recommended. The level of fat in those studies, is probably alot less than some of us eat, around 20-30%. A mere 138 grams caused a loss of 16mg magnesium on average. I am not certain (tommorow when i get my magnesium I may be), but it seems even eating alot of magnesium foods is not quite enough when coupled with high fat, over time, in me at least.

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2 Answers

2
Fc25b41326b954c4e5b8ce0dabb889a6

on July 17, 2012
at 11:37 AM

You also have to take into account what FORTIFIED foods are in the SAD. Don't know if the study makes a whole lot of practical sense.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 01:01 PM

"Instant oatmeal, dairy and soy milk, some types of cereals and some brands of white bread" . Oh didnt realise all that stuff was fortified. Guess cause I never brought any of it very often. Wasnt much of a breakfast eater.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 01:00 PM

^ never really used to eat breakfast, or lunch, unless it was takeout

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:19 PM

Not sure its totally coherent I agree, but it seems the most plausible explaination I have come across so far for this phenomena, that fat reduces absorbtion of magnesium. IMO Better than adrenaline/cortisol, better than electrolytes (which at least with me, are just fine). For me, its not like I got these symptoms first day of eating no carbs. Not even after a month. It just started recently really, after over a month. But then I am not sure if thats the standard pattern for this phenomenon...

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:51 PM

"Instant oatmeal, dairy and soy milk, some types of cereals and some brands of white bread" . Oh didnt realise all that stuff was fortified. Never used to consume any of it really (commercial bread, milk, cereal or soy), but I guess I remember seeing something about that on a pack of bread once...

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:16 PM

What fortified foods are in the sad diet? Only ones I can think of are omega 3 eggs, and fortified soy milk, lol. perhaps theres many more. Enlighten me as to what u mean. There has to be some reason why low carbers seem to often find then need to take magnesium supplements and get anxiety and sleep and heart issues. This offers a rationale of sorts, even if the various studies are a little mismatched and all over the place, theres quite a very saying similar things. Magnesium is generally not that well absorbed, and its also highly water soluble.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 17, 2012
at 12:35 PM

What fortified foods are in the sad diet? Only ones I can think of are omega 3 eggs, and fortified soy milk, lol. perhaps theres many more. Enlighten me as to what u mean. Magnesium is generally not that well absorbed, and its also highly water soluble, so this makes practical sense in some way I think.

0
2336245491a87ee15d4fb8f8f8283909

(1173)

on July 17, 2012
at 04:40 PM

"are there any other vitamins and minerals absorbed more poorly on a high fat diet?"

If you do your research you will more than likely find that the opposite is true.

Bb3d1772b28c02da2426e40dfcb533f5

(5381)

on July 18, 2012
at 12:25 AM

^ Yeah, I know theres plenty of fat soluble vitamins. Minerals though seem to be largely water soluble.

2336245491a87ee15d4fb8f8f8283909

(1173)

on July 19, 2012
at 02:01 AM

As I said, do your research fat soluble vitamins are also known as activators because they serve as the catalysts for mineral absorption. Without them, minerals cannot by used by the body, no matter how plentiful they may be in the diet.

2336245491a87ee15d4fb8f8f8283909

(1173)

on July 19, 2012
at 02:01 AM

As I said, do your research..... Fat soluble vitamins are also known as activators because they serve as the catalysts for mineral absorption. Without them, minerals cannot by used by the body, no matter how plentiful they may be in the diet

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