7

votes

Fastest way to lean out?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created June 07, 2011 at 7:09 PM

Paleo...

Top 3 key points?

I'm sure as it is a goal for many, a thread with everyone's 2-3 top tips would be awesome.

Obviously everyones body is different, just interesting to hear everyones pov, instead of having to search 'x' amount of questions

I'm sure it has been questioned before, hack away

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on September 07, 2013
at 01:28 AM

I'd like to hear results. I'm gonna put money on crash and burn. I honestly hope not but this idea that women have to go obscenely low calories to lose weight and men don't isn't true in my expierence. But then macros matter. 1200 Kcal at 30-40% protein is pretty damn filling and might be ok with strength training...

3b3a449b6705e9ec8b141d0bd07c1a64

(1489)

on June 18, 2012
at 02:20 PM

Yeah how did this go? Was it long term maintainable?

3b3a449b6705e9ec8b141d0bd07c1a64

(1489)

on June 18, 2012
at 02:19 PM

Yup for me, I like the higher protein! My body has plenty of it's own fat resources haha

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on March 05, 2012
at 03:33 PM

Lauren, could you post an update on how this ended up working for you? Did you achieve the results you were looking for? Thanks

26b7615ef542394102785a67a2786867

(7967)

on June 27, 2011
at 12:21 AM

Lauren if you want to get from 17% to 8% bodyfat, I think you're doing it all right! However I think it's very unhealthy for your body. Are you going to be in a bodybuilding competition?

3fc07ff31006b1860083f0cfe4472ae4

(561)

on June 27, 2011
at 12:02 AM

I agree Lauren--I've had good results on 1200 calories a day. After readings these boards for months, I think men have vastly different experiences w/weight loss and can get away w/eating a lot more. Even on a diet of meat, greens (no fruit, nuts) I could not lose weight until keeping calories below 1300.

Cc7381bd787721575ea9198048132adb

(5541)

on June 26, 2011
at 10:06 PM

Strength training on 1200 calories? No thanks.

47a42b6be94caf700fce9509e38bb6a4

(9647)

on June 08, 2011
at 05:06 PM

And I would add: 4. Mid-high range aerobic. There's a big gap between 3 and 4.

47a42b6be94caf700fce9509e38bb6a4

(9647)

on June 08, 2011
at 05:05 PM

The things I can do fasted, in order of ease: 1. Lifting weights. 2. Long run/long bike ride, with fairly low heart rate. 3. Sprints.

15dcceb36c2de8d448ee53e54bc7360d

(128)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:57 PM

Do your female clients have 6-8% body fat? I currently have 17.4% and am really trying to lower it. If you have any suggestions for tailoring one's regimen for low body fat on a female, I'm definitely open to trying something else. Thanks in advance. I would really appreciate any advise.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:46 PM

"Researchers from Canada’s Université Laval found that strenuous mental activities, such as concentrating on an exam, may lead people to consume more calories than they burn during the task. Subjects completed one of three assignments of varying difficulty—relaxing, reading a text and completing an intense task on a computer—then ate a buffet lunch. Although the groups burned around the same amount of energy, students who performed the strenuous mental tasks, particularly the one on the computer, consumed significantly more calories than those who relaxed."

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:43 PM

"According to behavorial neuroscientist Ewan McNay, who has conducted research in this area, a rough calculation suggests that thinking hard about a task for 30 minutes might burn about 1/30th of a gram of fat. Thinking is not likely to turn an intellectual couch potato into a lean machine."

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:40 PM

I seriously do not know what is happening here. Truthfully, I'm tempted to just bug a neurosurgeon to get on paleohacks so they can do some "due diligence" for the rest of us poor souls.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:37 PM

Are you joking, or is this a serious answer? I feel foolish saying this to a neurosurgeon, but as Lareth said, "while brain activity is a significant portion of RMR, it metabolizes at a more-or-less constant rate, with no significant difference between conscious mental exertion normal waking activity."

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:58 PM

now tell me how to reverse that and get their metabolisms healthy again. that's what i'm here for...

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:58 PM

which i can imagine only helps the fat burning process. also, strength training is great when it comes down to insulin sensitivity and "re-teaching" the muscles how to properly synthesize energy. when it comes down to it, i'm not a scientist and really could care less about the minutuae that you drs and scientists have to deal with. i only care about how it translates in the real world. leptin sensitivity is the end all, be all? cool. now tell me how to translate that into someone's diet/workout regimen for them to see results. insulin sensitivity is a precursor to metabolic syndrome? cool.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:53 PM

Couple things. you're the one claiming to be the dr here, so you have a much higher bar when it comes to citing things. 2nd of all, i never talked about strenght training raising your rmr- hell, i don't even really know the science behind rmr. what i do know is that with myself and the others i help lose weight, the people who have a good strength training regimen do much better than those who don't with all else being equal. i don't know whether that's because strength training actually raises the rmr or more likely because it helps maintain a lean body mass during the period of fat loss

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:35 PM

This is not meant to be snarky......Doctors duties are not the same as researchers and you guys here really completely smear that line for your own interpretations of things. Now I beginning to understand why Kurt Harris turns off comments.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:33 PM

@lucky.......take a look see. First the Researcher you can call. Tell him I sent you.http://www.pbrc.edu/the-center/faculty/?EmployeeID=20 here is the the mans research.....talked about. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/may/16/health/la-he-fitness-muscle-myth-20110516 This guy is a stud from back in my residency days. See I can cite. I suggest you not be so intellectually lazy. Do your own due diligence. Researchers need to cite. Doctors need to treat. I do the treating. If you don't like that don't read my comments. Everything I do is based upon basic research not opinion.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 08, 2011
at 09:16 AM

Idk. I as well as the majority of my clients, maintain 6%-8% BF and I never count calories nor do I recommend it. You are most certainly developing cortisol issues that will prevent you from leaning out further. Best of luck, tho!

8b982d4beccca9fcb85affe8d4bd4ff2

(1585)

on June 08, 2011
at 07:43 AM

I do nearly the same thing but my hours are 7 am until 2 pm. and I have about 1300 calories daily, no strength training or HIIT. I do not burn as much as you because I am not working out like you though.

C33e8c236e72d67c4b6c028401d23cce

(1884)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:53 AM

Yeah, the above program is pretty rough, and may result in unsustainable stress levels, but as a short-term boost it seems to work all right.

C33e8c236e72d67c4b6c028401d23cce

(1884)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:51 AM

I dimly recall reading that, while brain activity is a significant portion of RMR, it metabolizes at a more-or-less constant rate, with no significant difference between conscious mental exertion normal waking activity. Of course, the studies I read about were probably conducted in the sixties. I'd love to see more recent developments along those lines.

15dcceb36c2de8d448ee53e54bc7360d

(128)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:41 AM

I'm battling the last ten pounds, so the restriction is necessary. Plus, 1,200 is a fairly normal calorie range for a woman trying to lose weight.

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:14 AM

It sounds like the program for leaning out you recommend is similar to the one in Metabolic Effect by Jade and Keoni Teta.

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:11 AM

FYI, RMR = Resting metabolic rate

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 08, 2011
at 01:40 AM

On that routine, you will burn out quickly on 1200 cal/day.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 12:30 AM

studies please. i guess my non-science brain is wondering why are the majority of lean people are on some kind of strength training regimen. i'm all about the counter-intuitive but i'd love to see some studies where people used brain and heart exercises(how do u do that anyways) to get lean... in agreement that cortisol is a factor. not familiar with crp and sensitivity to comment on that...

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 07, 2011
at 10:10 PM

i would add an occasional - once in 5-6 days - high carb meal to convince your body that food is not scarce, and thus to make sure it does not cling to every calorie faking fat out of it

510bdda8988ed0d4b0ec0b738b4edb73

(20888)

on June 07, 2011
at 10:03 PM

I find interval training while fasted nearly impossible. I just can't generate enough power from fat to do interval training right. But I can do a long run fasted.

34a367e60db77270bd7096dc04270fdc

(4171)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:43 PM

Thanks so much for the clarification, that helps me a ton!

4e813fcf7266312684862b945c1c3281

(462)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:27 PM

Is interval training while fasted somehow better than strength training while fasted, or doing a long run while fasted or something?

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:21 PM

i try to get in about 5 hours of walking a week. when i lost my weight and leaned out, i ate paleo(lc at first and eventually went more ckd and tkd), lifted heavy 2-3 times a week, and walked anywhere from 3-5 hours a week. i think robb wolf in a recent podcast also made similar recommendations for leaning out.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:14 PM

I walk 2-5 miles, 6 early mornings out of 7 and another mile-or-so mid-morning walk of 1-2 miles and the occasional evening stroll. IMO, anywhere from 2-8 miles.

34a367e60db77270bd7096dc04270fdc

(4171)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:07 PM

I see you guys comment all the time with "lots of walking" I wish I knew what lots of walking meant =) Does that mean 2 miles a day, 5 miles, 10 miles? It would be helpful for people (me mostly) to have some sort of guideline with regards to how much walking constitutes lots of walking.

07ca188c8dac3a17f629dd87198d2098

(7970)

on June 07, 2011
at 07:36 PM

Trying to get ready for summer/beach weather? :)

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11 Answers

best answer

10
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 07, 2011
at 07:50 PM

Lift heavy. High fat/high protein/low carb. Sleep.

6
C33e8c236e72d67c4b6c028401d23cce

(1884)

on June 07, 2011
at 07:19 PM

  1. Low-Carb or Zero-Carb
  2. Intermittent Fasting
  3. Interval training while fasted

Won't work for everyone, and there's a trend of stalled results or reduced performance after the first six weeks or so, but if you want fast results, that seems to work pretty well for most people.

510bdda8988ed0d4b0ec0b738b4edb73

(20888)

on June 07, 2011
at 10:03 PM

I find interval training while fasted nearly impossible. I just can't generate enough power from fat to do interval training right. But I can do a long run fasted.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 07, 2011
at 10:10 PM

i would add an occasional - once in 5-6 days - high carb meal to convince your body that food is not scarce, and thus to make sure it does not cling to every calorie faking fat out of it

47a42b6be94caf700fce9509e38bb6a4

(9647)

on June 08, 2011
at 05:06 PM

And I would add: 4. Mid-high range aerobic. There's a big gap between 3 and 4.

4e813fcf7266312684862b945c1c3281

(462)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:27 PM

Is interval training while fasted somehow better than strength training while fasted, or doing a long run while fasted or something?

47a42b6be94caf700fce9509e38bb6a4

(9647)

on June 08, 2011
at 05:05 PM

The things I can do fasted, in order of ease: 1. Lifting weights. 2. Long run/long bike ride, with fairly low heart rate. 3. Sprints.

C33e8c236e72d67c4b6c028401d23cce

(1884)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:53 AM

Yeah, the above program is pretty rough, and may result in unsustainable stress levels, but as a short-term boost it seems to work all right.

3
66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

on June 07, 2011
at 07:34 PM

protein sparing modified fast

heavy lifting

lots of walking or low-level cardio...

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:21 PM

i try to get in about 5 hours of walking a week. when i lost my weight and leaned out, i ate paleo(lc at first and eventually went more ckd and tkd), lifted heavy 2-3 times a week, and walked anywhere from 3-5 hours a week. i think robb wolf in a recent podcast also made similar recommendations for leaning out.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:14 PM

I walk 2-5 miles, 6 early mornings out of 7 and another mile-or-so mid-morning walk of 1-2 miles and the occasional evening stroll. IMO, anywhere from 2-8 miles.

34a367e60db77270bd7096dc04270fdc

(4171)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:43 PM

Thanks so much for the clarification, that helps me a ton!

34a367e60db77270bd7096dc04270fdc

(4171)

on June 07, 2011
at 08:07 PM

I see you guys comment all the time with "lots of walking" I wish I knew what lots of walking meant =) Does that mean 2 miles a day, 5 miles, 10 miles? It would be helpful for people (me mostly) to have some sort of guideline with regards to how much walking constitutes lots of walking.

3b3a449b6705e9ec8b141d0bd07c1a64

(1489)

on June 18, 2012
at 02:19 PM

Yup for me, I like the higher protein! My body has plenty of it's own fat resources haha

3
A8d95f3744a7a0885894ee0731c9744c

(3761)

on June 07, 2011
at 07:20 PM

Low-Carb

Plenty of sleep

HIIT

2
15dcceb36c2de8d448ee53e54bc7360d

on June 08, 2011
at 01:35 AM

Right now I am doing the following:

  1. Fasting 16 hours out of every 24 hours. (I only eat between 10am and 6pm daily)
  2. HIIT every other day for 20 mins (Sprinting on treadmile)
  3. Strength training every day on one muscle group each day.
  4. Limiting calories to 1,200
  5. Limiting carbs to under 20g and strict paleo.

I'm on day 2, but I already feel a bit leaner. I'm pretty sure this regime is optimal for fat loss in the shortest amount of time.

15dcceb36c2de8d448ee53e54bc7360d

(128)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:41 AM

I'm battling the last ten pounds, so the restriction is necessary. Plus, 1,200 is a fairly normal calorie range for a woman trying to lose weight.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 08, 2011
at 09:16 AM

Idk. I as well as the majority of my clients, maintain 6%-8% BF and I never count calories nor do I recommend it. You are most certainly developing cortisol issues that will prevent you from leaning out further. Best of luck, tho!

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 08, 2011
at 01:40 AM

On that routine, you will burn out quickly on 1200 cal/day.

15dcceb36c2de8d448ee53e54bc7360d

(128)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:57 PM

Do your female clients have 6-8% body fat? I currently have 17.4% and am really trying to lower it. If you have any suggestions for tailoring one's regimen for low body fat on a female, I'm definitely open to trying something else. Thanks in advance. I would really appreciate any advise.

8b982d4beccca9fcb85affe8d4bd4ff2

(1585)

on June 08, 2011
at 07:43 AM

I do nearly the same thing but my hours are 7 am until 2 pm. and I have about 1300 calories daily, no strength training or HIIT. I do not burn as much as you because I am not working out like you though.

3fc07ff31006b1860083f0cfe4472ae4

(561)

on June 27, 2011
at 12:02 AM

I agree Lauren--I've had good results on 1200 calories a day. After readings these boards for months, I think men have vastly different experiences w/weight loss and can get away w/eating a lot more. Even on a diet of meat, greens (no fruit, nuts) I could not lose weight until keeping calories below 1300.

Cc7381bd787721575ea9198048132adb

(5541)

on June 26, 2011
at 10:06 PM

Strength training on 1200 calories? No thanks.

26b7615ef542394102785a67a2786867

(7967)

on June 27, 2011
at 12:21 AM

Lauren if you want to get from 17% to 8% bodyfat, I think you're doing it all right! However I think it's very unhealthy for your body. Are you going to be in a bodybuilding competition?

59ee717de524f921efb7f2984157339f

(871)

on March 05, 2012
at 03:33 PM

Lauren, could you post an update on how this ended up working for you? Did you achieve the results you were looking for? Thanks

3b3a449b6705e9ec8b141d0bd07c1a64

(1489)

on June 18, 2012
at 02:20 PM

Yeah how did this go? Was it long term maintainable?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on September 07, 2013
at 01:28 AM

I'd like to hear results. I'm gonna put money on crash and burn. I honestly hope not but this idea that women have to go obscenely low calories to lose weight and men don't isn't true in my expierence. But then macros matter. 1200 Kcal at 30-40% protein is pretty damn filling and might be ok with strength training...

1
Cc7381bd787721575ea9198048132adb

on June 26, 2011
at 10:04 PM

8-10 hours of sleep in a pitch black room (can't see your hand if it's right in front of your face)

Eating in an 8 hour window (10am - 6am)

1
510bdda8988ed0d4b0ec0b738b4edb73

(20888)

on June 07, 2011
at 10:07 PM

In order of importance

Low Carb, Grain Eliminated Diet (Doesn't have to be fully paleo, but you can't go wrong there)

Reduce Stress (this includes getting proper sleep, no chronic cardio, go for long relaxing walks in the woods, anything that raises cortosol for extended periods is bad)

High Intensity Interval Training (not the Crossfit way where you doing something everyday. Maybe 1 or 2 times a week do some sprints, lift some heavy weights)

1
77f83ec328459dce702216709762e202

(571)

on June 07, 2011
at 09:59 PM

low carb lots of sleep crossfit fasted (first thing in the morning)

0
6ba5c2ad626c35b5f00c1e483880fc6d

on June 26, 2011
at 09:13 PM

If you want to lean OUT..then CROSSFIT 6X a WEEK W/ PALEO STRICT!! THATS ALL YOU NEED!!

0
Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 08, 2011
at 12:22 AM

1.Low ultra sensitive CRP

2.Low cortisol level

3.Brain and Heart exercise.........

WHY?

Brain function makes up close to 20% of RMR. Next is the heart, which is beating all the time and accounts for another 15-20%. The liver, which also functions at rest, contributes another 15-20%. Then you have the kidneys and lungs and other tissues, so what remains is muscle, contributing only 20-25% of total resting metabolism. Lifting heavy weights gets you many things but lean is not one of them.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 12:30 AM

studies please. i guess my non-science brain is wondering why are the majority of lean people are on some kind of strength training regimen. i'm all about the counter-intuitive but i'd love to see some studies where people used brain and heart exercises(how do u do that anyways) to get lean... in agreement that cortisol is a factor. not familiar with crp and sensitivity to comment on that...

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:14 AM

It sounds like the program for leaning out you recommend is similar to the one in Metabolic Effect by Jade and Keoni Teta.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:58 PM

which i can imagine only helps the fat burning process. also, strength training is great when it comes down to insulin sensitivity and "re-teaching" the muscles how to properly synthesize energy. when it comes down to it, i'm not a scientist and really could care less about the minutuae that you drs and scientists have to deal with. i only care about how it translates in the real world. leptin sensitivity is the end all, be all? cool. now tell me how to translate that into someone's diet/workout regimen for them to see results. insulin sensitivity is a precursor to metabolic syndrome? cool.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:46 PM

"Researchers from Canada’s Université Laval found that strenuous mental activities, such as concentrating on an exam, may lead people to consume more calories than they burn during the task. Subjects completed one of three assignments of varying difficulty—relaxing, reading a text and completing an intense task on a computer—then ate a buffet lunch. Although the groups burned around the same amount of energy, students who performed the strenuous mental tasks, particularly the one on the computer, consumed significantly more calories than those who relaxed."

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:53 PM

Couple things. you're the one claiming to be the dr here, so you have a much higher bar when it comes to citing things. 2nd of all, i never talked about strenght training raising your rmr- hell, i don't even really know the science behind rmr. what i do know is that with myself and the others i help lose weight, the people who have a good strength training regimen do much better than those who don't with all else being equal. i don't know whether that's because strength training actually raises the rmr or more likely because it helps maintain a lean body mass during the period of fat loss

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:11 AM

FYI, RMR = Resting metabolic rate

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:37 PM

Are you joking, or is this a serious answer? I feel foolish saying this to a neurosurgeon, but as Lareth said, "while brain activity is a significant portion of RMR, it metabolizes at a more-or-less constant rate, with no significant difference between conscious mental exertion normal waking activity."

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:58 PM

now tell me how to reverse that and get their metabolisms healthy again. that's what i'm here for...

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:40 PM

I seriously do not know what is happening here. Truthfully, I'm tempted to just bug a neurosurgeon to get on paleohacks so they can do some "due diligence" for the rest of us poor souls.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:33 PM

@lucky.......take a look see. First the Researcher you can call. Tell him I sent you.http://www.pbrc.edu/the-center/faculty/?EmployeeID=20 here is the the mans research.....talked about. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/may/16/health/la-he-fitness-muscle-myth-20110516 This guy is a stud from back in my residency days. See I can cite. I suggest you not be so intellectually lazy. Do your own due diligence. Researchers need to cite. Doctors need to treat. I do the treating. If you don't like that don't read my comments. Everything I do is based upon basic research not opinion.

C33e8c236e72d67c4b6c028401d23cce

(1884)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:51 AM

I dimly recall reading that, while brain activity is a significant portion of RMR, it metabolizes at a more-or-less constant rate, with no significant difference between conscious mental exertion normal waking activity. Of course, the studies I read about were probably conducted in the sixties. I'd love to see more recent developments along those lines.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 08, 2011
at 02:35 PM

This is not meant to be snarky......Doctors duties are not the same as researchers and you guys here really completely smear that line for your own interpretations of things. Now I beginning to understand why Kurt Harris turns off comments.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on June 08, 2011
at 03:43 PM

"According to behavorial neuroscientist Ewan McNay, who has conducted research in this area, a rough calculation suggests that thinking hard about a task for 30 minutes might burn about 1/30th of a gram of fat. Thinking is not likely to turn an intellectual couch potato into a lean machine."

0
667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on June 07, 2011
at 07:13 PM

Lift weights.

Track All your food intake.

Cook your meals.

I would also say stop cardio work but I know many swear by it.

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