3

votes

can you build muscle and bulk up on a high fat diet

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created November 11, 2012 at 4:39 PM

im currently eating a high carb\low fat on the days i train, and low carb\high fat on the rest day(protein is a must)..

my question is, does the macronutriens really matter...can i build muscle(calorie surplus) with fat instead of carbs, or the exess calories from fat will get stored as fat?

ps: sorry for the shitty english

1deaea445ff3b1cb5d1354a043dc8fb7

(275)

on May 10, 2013
at 10:54 PM

just realized this is an old Q

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 13, 2012
at 01:57 AM

I understand that one can eat low carb and gain muscle but its like saying eating a diet full of whole grains is going to help you lose weight. It might, but is it the most effective approach? Absolutely not. Its just crappy advice and the same goes for this situation. You can build a limited amount of muscle on low carb particularly if you've never trained before but if you have any experience and want to follow the smartest mkst efficient path to gaining muscle you need carbs it's that simple.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 08:31 PM

I'm really not interested in reopening particular debate though. Its been discussed several times with regard to how the body partitions energy and effects of training and so on and so forth. So, suffice to say I believe I understand the nuances just fine. You are more than welcome to use the search function though to revisit the issue.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 08:01 PM

Meh, I was more aggressive than need be before. I am not saying you have to be low carb, but to assert that it is necessary to carb up is just as incorrect. I think what I stated about frequency and intensity of training covers that. I'm not even gonna argue that it would be easier to gain weight with carbs than without. It would be easier. However, the question was simply can we gain lean mass without frequent carb ups. The answer is yes. To do so I would recommend a HIT protocol as they pair nicely.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 04:34 PM

And the prove lean muscle mass can't be had in low carb diets is a pathetic attempt to win this debate. Of course you can but I was stating that its inferior to the adaptations you would see while consuming carbs.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 04:29 PM

The context of my answer was based on an athlete trying to optimize their training to the fullest extent. And carbs definitely help if you are not morbidly obese or metabolically deranged and honestly if you don't believe that your wrong. Learn about the bodies energy systems and you will see that anaerobic glycolysis is much faster than lypolysis making it more ideal for intense training and what helps anaerobic glycolysis improve is the utilization and storage of glycogen

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 04:25 PM

There are a lot of points you went over so ill try to answer them generally. I don't understand your comment about 3lbs per month so in gonna ignore that. I do understand gluconeogensis and i think it's very ineffective at filling glycogen stores when compared to just eating carbs. I don't know what hit is but i was merely stating that positive adaptations occur when you have ample carbohydrates and resistance train. I also didn't say size = strength but bigger muscles generally can handle larger loads. I'm sure you convinced some people with all your crazy caps but you are wrong.

2e1591c76896828077b930de5107f1af

on November 12, 2012
at 04:01 PM

. ok

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:41 AM

Or to make it easy please just prove that eating a surplus of calories even in the reduced state of carbs DOES NOT lead to more lean mass in the presence of resistance exercise.....WILL NOT HAPPEN!

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:40 AM

Or to make it easy please just prove that eating a surplus of calories DOES NOT lead to more lean mass in the presence of resistance exercise.....WILL NOT HAPPEN! For more Paleo Diet hacks: can you build muscle and bulk up on a high fat diet - PaleoHacks.com http://paleohacks.com/questions/160697/can-you-build-muscle-and-bulk-up-on-a-high-fat-diet#ixzz2Bz4sfggL

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:40 AM

Or to make it easy please just prove that eating a surplus of calories DOES NOT lead to more lean mass in the presence of resistance exercise.....WILL NOT HAPPEN!

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:30 AM

BTW...If I read your first correctly you equate hypertrophy (bigger) with direct strength (better)...I call Bullshit. Dude I'm an X-wrestler 16 years and yes collegiate. Size is SHIT. Its all about actual STRENGTH

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:25 AM

Does not mean you are wrong or right...and vice vera

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:24 AM

Its cool that you say "do your own research" the problem is that I have. I've just come to a different set of conclusions as you it seems.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:23 AM

While your at it please prove that you have any inkling as to gluconeogenisis. Or the frequency of resistance training that I was talking about in the original answer. Do you even know what HIT is?

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:19 AM

Jake...lets start with glycogen stores...while not fixed they dont grow or reduce quickly...unless you would like to claim better than 3lbs of muscle mass a month...please do.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:14 AM

Do you understand that your utilization of glycogen is dependent on your metabolic health and flexability? Please. Like I said it depends on your goals. If its simply hypertrophy without regard to health or actual strength I could map a way for your.....however, if you would like to be metabolically fit and strong/athletic...that is something quite different.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 03:24 AM

So by not eating enough carbohydrates you are not optimizing your workout given that you actually want to improve in the most effective way.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 03:21 AM

You fail to understand that glycogen stores aren't fixed in number. The more muscle your body produces the more glycogen you can store which makes you not only have bigger muscles but it also largely improves athletic abilities.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 03:14 AM

oh i see, i thought op was confused about my wording. honestly, i know this is lazy but i don't have the energy to explain. sorry. just know that if you arent obese and metabolically deranged and you want to perform at your highest athletic potential, carbs are your friend. do your own research from there.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 02:08 AM

I the question was why....but, I'm pro fat anyhow....I'll post in my own answer.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 12:07 AM

where's the confusion? if you eat low carb while trying to bulk up it will be suboptimal.

2e1591c76896828077b930de5107f1af

on November 11, 2012
at 11:33 PM

please explain what you are implying

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 11, 2012
at 09:48 PM

depends on how much you wanna bulk up and how difficult you want to make it for yourself. if you enjoy working harder for less gains by all means eat a low carb diet.

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5 Answers

best answer

1
3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 11, 2012
at 06:17 PM

Yes you can....I did anyhow.

So continued. IMO its fairly easy to gain lean mass when you are metabolically healthy. Eating at a surplus is the only REAL requirement. How much volume you plan on doing and at what intensity may determine your carb requirements. Personally, I perform HIT which means I'm a proponent of less frequent exercise at higher intensity. This also means that I will have plenty of time between lifting bouts to refill my glycogen stores even if I stick to a lower carb protocol.

If however you are working out five days a week at high intensity you may need to ingest more carbohydrate to compensate.

The real question is if one way or another will equate to better muscular gain. In my experience the HIT protocol is sufficient for everyone but those who are ACTUAL bodybuilders. Which is to say I think its just as good for strength as the volume approach. It is sufficient for strength, athleticism, and size ...BUT...there are only a few well known body builders that follow that protocol. I think strict hypertrophy does require a bit more volume. But, your talking about a very specific effect for a very small percent of "athletes" there.

I mean if you wanna get swolled eat up the carbs to get the big look...but, also realize that most bodybuilders dehydrate prior to the show to accentuate their leanness and get the cut look.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 04:34 PM

And the prove lean muscle mass can't be had in low carb diets is a pathetic attempt to win this debate. Of course you can but I was stating that its inferior to the adaptations you would see while consuming carbs.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 03:24 AM

So by not eating enough carbohydrates you are not optimizing your workout given that you actually want to improve in the most effective way.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 03:21 AM

You fail to understand that glycogen stores aren't fixed in number. The more muscle your body produces the more glycogen you can store which makes you not only have bigger muscles but it also largely improves athletic abilities.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:30 AM

BTW...If I read your first correctly you equate hypertrophy (bigger) with direct strength (better)...I call Bullshit. Dude I'm an X-wrestler 16 years and yes collegiate. Size is SHIT. Its all about actual STRENGTH

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:40 AM

Or to make it easy please just prove that eating a surplus of calories DOES NOT lead to more lean mass in the presence of resistance exercise.....WILL NOT HAPPEN!

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:25 AM

Does not mean you are wrong or right...and vice vera

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 08:01 PM

Meh, I was more aggressive than need be before. I am not saying you have to be low carb, but to assert that it is necessary to carb up is just as incorrect. I think what I stated about frequency and intensity of training covers that. I'm not even gonna argue that it would be easier to gain weight with carbs than without. It would be easier. However, the question was simply can we gain lean mass without frequent carb ups. The answer is yes. To do so I would recommend a HIT protocol as they pair nicely.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 04:29 PM

The context of my answer was based on an athlete trying to optimize their training to the fullest extent. And carbs definitely help if you are not morbidly obese or metabolically deranged and honestly if you don't believe that your wrong. Learn about the bodies energy systems and you will see that anaerobic glycolysis is much faster than lypolysis making it more ideal for intense training and what helps anaerobic glycolysis improve is the utilization and storage of glycogen

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:14 AM

Do you understand that your utilization of glycogen is dependent on your metabolic health and flexability? Please. Like I said it depends on your goals. If its simply hypertrophy without regard to health or actual strength I could map a way for your.....however, if you would like to be metabolically fit and strong/athletic...that is something quite different.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:40 AM

Or to make it easy please just prove that eating a surplus of calories DOES NOT lead to more lean mass in the presence of resistance exercise.....WILL NOT HAPPEN! For more Paleo Diet hacks: can you build muscle and bulk up on a high fat diet - PaleoHacks.com http://paleohacks.com/questions/160697/can-you-build-muscle-and-bulk-up-on-a-high-fat-diet#ixzz2Bz4sfggL

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:41 AM

Or to make it easy please just prove that eating a surplus of calories even in the reduced state of carbs DOES NOT lead to more lean mass in the presence of resistance exercise.....WILL NOT HAPPEN!

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:19 AM

Jake...lets start with glycogen stores...while not fixed they dont grow or reduce quickly...unless you would like to claim better than 3lbs of muscle mass a month...please do.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 12, 2012
at 04:25 PM

There are a lot of points you went over so ill try to answer them generally. I don't understand your comment about 3lbs per month so in gonna ignore that. I do understand gluconeogensis and i think it's very ineffective at filling glycogen stores when compared to just eating carbs. I don't know what hit is but i was merely stating that positive adaptations occur when you have ample carbohydrates and resistance train. I also didn't say size = strength but bigger muscles generally can handle larger loads. I'm sure you convinced some people with all your crazy caps but you are wrong.

Medium avatar

(2338)

on November 13, 2012
at 01:57 AM

I understand that one can eat low carb and gain muscle but its like saying eating a diet full of whole grains is going to help you lose weight. It might, but is it the most effective approach? Absolutely not. Its just crappy advice and the same goes for this situation. You can build a limited amount of muscle on low carb particularly if you've never trained before but if you have any experience and want to follow the smartest mkst efficient path to gaining muscle you need carbs it's that simple.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:23 AM

While your at it please prove that you have any inkling as to gluconeogenisis. Or the frequency of resistance training that I was talking about in the original answer. Do you even know what HIT is?

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 05:24 AM

Its cool that you say "do your own research" the problem is that I have. I've just come to a different set of conclusions as you it seems.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2012
at 08:31 PM

I'm really not interested in reopening particular debate though. Its been discussed several times with regard to how the body partitions energy and effects of training and so on and so forth. So, suffice to say I believe I understand the nuances just fine. You are more than welcome to use the search function though to revisit the issue.

1
C326acd0ae246a39c5685f2ba72e3136

on November 11, 2012
at 06:52 PM

You can, however I would not recommend it. Eat some fruit and starch.

0
1deaea445ff3b1cb5d1354a043dc8fb7

(275)

on May 10, 2013
at 10:51 PM

I suppose you could eat high fat and build muscle, not sure why you would want to, unless your into the low carb dogma.

You will find it much easier with carbs, like 30%. Your muscles will look flat without them, you need them for training aswell, you cannot fuel weight training with fat, it must be carbs (carbs already stored in your muscles count, meaning you don't have to eat carbs before working out)

1deaea445ff3b1cb5d1354a043dc8fb7

(275)

on May 10, 2013
at 10:54 PM

just realized this is an old Q

0
3c7150f971f65f52bb066bf21baa0f1d

on November 11, 2012
at 07:37 PM

Stick most of your carbs around the workout and you should consider rice and white potato as supps if you don't want usually eating them. I try to take pro and fat every day the same quantity but i'm not able to eat so much carbs in training days, so when i relax myself I enjoy more easily and alkaline carbs. Roasted chestnuts is the way!

-1
61f7c1630bd769b710ec031419e52032

on November 14, 2012
at 09:38 AM

Seems really interesting, thanks for sharing these. I believe maintaining a healthy diet is crucial for losing weight. Some interesting ideas are given here - http://howtoloseweight-tips.com/daily-diet-plan-for-losing-weight/. You will find lots of other useful suggestions.

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