9

votes

Are added fats really Paleo?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created September 17, 2011 at 9:10 PM

This is something I've wondered over for a while as I like to peruse the paleo foodie sites for ideas. It seems to me that our ancestors would not have even had the means let alone the patience to separate the fat from the coconut or avocado or nut ... or even render fat. Ghee especially confounds me in that it's still a source of fat from a non-paleo source even if the proteins are gone.

So this one makes me curious. Why not just boiled/poached eggs? Grilled/baked/poached meats, poultry, fish & seafood?

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 18, 2011
at 05:40 PM

@Jan - regarding bone marrow composition http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/ethnic-foods/8088/2 have you eaten it? It's definitely fat:)

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 18, 2011
at 05:37 PM

It's an odd thought indeed. Many adult humans take issue with an infant human eating the biologically appropriate food of it's species - the milk of it's mother from her mammary glad....yet at the same time we, oddly enough, don't give it a second though when we drink the expressed "breastmilk" of an entirely different species. Imagine the uproar if we started expressing our our breastmilk and sharing it with the neighbors! having said that, I think dairy consumption is an individual thing. I just can't bear the question "is it paleo" anymore. It's driving.me.crazy. :D

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:52 PM

I hear ya ROB, I'm not a big fan of the CO, but give me coconut to nosh on anyday!

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:50 PM

Hey Melissa. Uggh ... I'll pass on the grubs too. I'd love to find a source of marrow bones nearby. I've got one place where I can get all the pork shoulder bones I want. They make awesome broth, very gelatinous but no grease.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:46 PM

Chuckle ... Katherine I'm the last person someone should ask on what is or isn't Paleo ;-) And while I love me my dairy whenever I think too deeply on it, isn't it awfully creepy the foods we adult humans consume made from the infant food of other species?

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:43 PM

Per my comment to Eric above, I just question the source of the the fat. All dairy fat has a considerably different fatty acid profile vs. other animal fats and non-animal fats.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:39 PM

I get the thinking behind this, but I question whether the types of fats we're adding are proper substitutes for the fats we would get from eating other portions. For example, brain is high omega 3. Chitterlings have an interesting fatty acid profile! http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/pork-products/2185/2

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:30 PM

Interesting. Would make a case for animal fats at least.

44348571d9bc70c02ac2975cc500f154

(5853)

on September 18, 2011
at 03:44 AM

Hmm can marrow bone really be 80%? Cause i have sometimes cooked them for a long time and there is still alot of that nice juicy gel left. Which is propably some sort of proteins like glycine, not sure. Alot of fat renders out tho... I havent weighted the bones so i dont know how much does.

7d189666820da6f61b9d0b90976185e9

(70)

on September 18, 2011
at 02:20 AM

some curry powder, salt, and black pepper and you have yourself a feast.

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:27 PM

Make sure you're getting equivalent nutrients then from brain, marrow,organs and all of the visceral fat was consumed.

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:26 PM

If I could upvote this 100x I would.

Efc949694a31043bfce9ec86e8235cd7

(970)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:14 PM

Scrambled eggs and chopped onion, fried in ghee...nothing quite like it. :)

35a8b223ae5d863f17a8c9e3a8eed5eb

(571)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:01 PM

I do consider fat from avocado, nuts, coconut and olives as totally un-paleo! Guacamole and coconut smoothies are actually newer neolithic staples than bread. And don't get me started on sweet potatoes! LMAO

35a8b223ae5d863f17a8c9e3a8eed5eb

(571)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:00 PM

I do consider fat from avocado, nuts, coconut and olives as totally un-paleo! Guacamole and coconut smoothies are actually newer neolithic staples than bread. And con't get me started on sweet potatoes! LMAO

A65499f2f8c65602881550fe309cd48c

(3501)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:44 PM

mmm brains...(just had a zombie moment)

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:41 PM

and the bone marrow (80% fat) and all of the visceral fat from the abdomen and around the organs...

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:41 PM

CarbSane - don't take away my duck fat! It's the only way I can get my 'tater food group in.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25477)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:38 PM

absolutely spot on.....plus 100

2c8c421cf0e0c462654c7dc37f8b9711

(2729)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:20 PM

Great question! Have wondered that myself.

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6 Answers

11
D5cde8031564f905260ce9aa7a1f5e2c

on September 07, 2013
at 12:44 AM

They were actually pretty adept at bone-grease rendering: http://www.alexandriaarchive.org/bonecommons/items/show/1058

More evidence (free full text): http://www.u.arizona.edu/~mstiner/pdf/Manne_etal2005.pdf

From that link -

The second family of bone processing techniques emerged during the Upper Paleolithic (though not in all regions) and is a good deal more complex. Heat- in-liquid rendering (sensu Binford 1978; Brink 1997; Delpech & Rigaud 1974; Lupo & Schmitt 1997; Wandsnider 1997), also called ???bone grease rendering???, allows a wider range of nutrients to be extracted per carcass. The technique is far more labor-intensive than cold processing methods, however. The advantages of the method are greatest where key resources are limited, whether due to unpredictable supplies or prey, constriction of hunting territories, or both. For this extraction technique, large amounts of spongy bone tissues of vertebrae and softer limb ends (Figure 3) are fragmented or pulverized, and then boiled in water by such methods as adding heated stones to the mixture. The heated fatty components float to the top of the mixture and form discrete, relatively pure layers of fat that can be skimmed-off and stored. Heat-in-liquid techniques maximize both the protein and fat yields per carcass, well in excess of what is possible from cold extraction techniques alone (Binford 1978; Lupo & Schmitt 1997; Wandsnider 1997). The purified fatty components can be stored for months (Soffer 1989).

Not to justify daily butter stick habits or anything, just to establish precedent for some added fat.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:30 PM

Interesting. Would make a case for animal fats at least.

10
9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on September 17, 2011
at 10:31 PM

N-thing the bone grease processing, also there are many foraging cultures that process nuts to produce fat to add to food, such as dika nuts. There are also several highly fatty grubs in Africa people would add to meals.

Either way, I guess I do get most of my fat from bone grease since I use the fat from stock to cook with, but paleo is not about specific foods. If it were, I'd have to squeeze some grubs over my potatoes and I'm just grossed out by that, though I know I should be more open minded. Marrow on potatoes is good though! Paleo is more about metabolism and autoimmune awareness than eating foods that paleo people actually ate, but I think most people would benefit from eating bone grease, red palm oil, marrow, and brain as added fats rather than coconut oil or lard, since comparatively these are much more nutrient dense, though coconut oil has specific fats that can be quite useful to the body, particularly for lactating women.

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:26 PM

If I could upvote this 100x I would.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:50 PM

Hey Melissa. Uggh ... I'll pass on the grubs too. I'd love to find a source of marrow bones nearby. I've got one place where I can get all the pork shoulder bones I want. They make awesome broth, very gelatinous but no grease.

9
1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:26 PM

Our ancestors had a large selection of grass feed meat and they ate portions of the animal that many of us no longer do (such as the fatty brain).

You need the extra fat to make up for the loss of very high carbs in a typical SAD diet.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:39 PM

I get the thinking behind this, but I question whether the types of fats we're adding are proper substitutes for the fats we would get from eating other portions. For example, brain is high omega 3. Chitterlings have an interesting fatty acid profile! http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/pork-products/2185/2

44348571d9bc70c02ac2975cc500f154

(5853)

on September 18, 2011
at 03:44 AM

Hmm can marrow bone really be 80%? Cause i have sometimes cooked them for a long time and there is still alot of that nice juicy gel left. Which is propably some sort of proteins like glycine, not sure. Alot of fat renders out tho... I havent weighted the bones so i dont know how much does.

A65499f2f8c65602881550fe309cd48c

(3501)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:44 PM

mmm brains...(just had a zombie moment)

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:41 PM

and the bone marrow (80% fat) and all of the visceral fat from the abdomen and around the organs...

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 18, 2011
at 05:40 PM

@Jan - regarding bone marrow composition http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/ethnic-foods/8088/2 have you eaten it? It's definitely fat:)

5
8c75fd947f7cece22c0770fa80549cbe

(222)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:35 PM

I second Eric's answer, but I want to address your comment about ghee. Nearly all of the carbohydrates and proteins are removed from butter to make ghee. Those are also the things that make dairy "questionably" paleo. IMO ghee is a fine paleo food.

Efc949694a31043bfce9ec86e8235cd7

(970)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:14 PM

Scrambled eggs and chopped onion, fried in ghee...nothing quite like it. :)

7d189666820da6f61b9d0b90976185e9

(70)

on September 18, 2011
at 02:20 AM

some curry powder, salt, and black pepper and you have yourself a feast.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25477)

on September 17, 2011
at 09:38 PM

absolutely spot on.....plus 100

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:43 PM

Per my comment to Eric above, I just question the source of the the fat. All dairy fat has a considerably different fatty acid profile vs. other animal fats and non-animal fats.

2
742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on September 17, 2011
at 10:29 PM

I don't think they are, and if they are I don't consider them optimal. Added fats, are in a sense empty calories, they are the white rice of fats, very micro nutrient poor. They do have some benefits I suppose, but I rather get my fats from whole foods ie. eating the coconut and not just the oil, or olives over olive oil, egg yolks, fatty cuts of meat, etc.

Take it from someone who use to dump coconut oil over everything just for calories.

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 17, 2011
at 11:27 PM

Make sure you're getting equivalent nutrients then from brain, marrow,organs and all of the visceral fat was consumed.

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:52 PM

I hear ya ROB, I'm not a big fan of the CO, but give me coconut to nosh on anyday!

1
Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

on September 17, 2011
at 11:25 PM

I think the "dairy is not paleo" think can be put to bed.

True, it was not consumed during the evolution of the majority of the human genome, but that's not relevant. Signficant portions of the worlds population have evolved genotypes to benefit from the consumption of dairy.

Everyone have a listen to LaLonde's talk (for the theoretical perspective). Kresser has a great article as well: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=dairy+chriskresser

24df4e0d0e7ce98963d4641fae1a60e5

on September 18, 2011
at 12:46 PM

Chuckle ... Katherine I'm the last person someone should ask on what is or isn't Paleo ;-) And while I love me my dairy whenever I think too deeply on it, isn't it awfully creepy the foods we adult humans consume made from the infant food of other species?

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on September 18, 2011
at 05:37 PM

It's an odd thought indeed. Many adult humans take issue with an infant human eating the biologically appropriate food of it's species - the milk of it's mother from her mammary glad....yet at the same time we, oddly enough, don't give it a second though when we drink the expressed "breastmilk" of an entirely different species. Imagine the uproar if we started expressing our our breastmilk and sharing it with the neighbors! having said that, I think dairy consumption is an individual thing. I just can't bear the question "is it paleo" anymore. It's driving.me.crazy. :D

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