3

votes

Are you doing the right kinds of exercise to target YOUR specific goals?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created August 27, 2011 at 4:32 AM

For those of us who are overweight and targeting associated health/medical conditions, or who are trying not to develop those conditions, only doing strength/resistance training may not be the best choice for our specific targets.

Since about December, I have changed my exercise and added between 2 to 2.5 hours/wk of dancercise (aerobics) to my previous circuit style resistance/strength training. Prior to this change/addition, I was doing about 3 to 3.5 hours of resistance/wk. I am now doing 1-1.5 resistance + 2-2.5 aerobics/wk and seeing and feeling good results. Although I am delighted (per the study below) to know that I am likely dropping non-observable , visceral belly fat, I am also happy to be seeing observable changes in external belly fat. I also feel that this change has enabled me to much more easily maintain my goal weight of 9+ years, as well as drop about 8 additional lbs and comfortably maintain that, while continuing to build strength and muscle.

I think the implications of this study as very important for those who have significant weight to lose, may be insulin resistant, and are beginning to put in place an exercise routine that will become habitual, as well as those with fatty liver, those who are trying to avoid fatty liver, and others as indicated in the study.

If you are overweight and/or have the conditions addressed in this study, or are trying to avoid them, do you think your current exercise regimen is on target? What is your exercise regimen and how do you think it is working for you?

"Aerobic exercise is your best bet when it comes to losing that dreaded belly fat, a new study finds. When Duke University Medical Center researchers conducted a head-to-head comparison of aerobic exercise, resistance training, and a combination of the two, they found aerobic exercise to be the most efficient and most effective way to lose the belly fat that's most damaging to your health."

"The Duke study showed aerobic training significantly reduced visceral fat and liver fat, the culprit in nonalcoholic fatty liver disease. Aerobic exercise also did a better job than resistance training at improving fasting insulin resistance, and reducing liver enzymes and fasting triglyceride levels. All are known risk factors for diabetes and heart disease."

"Resistance training achieved no significant reductions in visceral fat, liver fat, liver enzyme levels or improvements in insulin resistance. The combination of aerobic with resistance training achieved results similar to aerobic training alone."

"Resistance training is great for improving strength and increasing lean body mass," says Slentz. "But if you are overweight, which two thirds of the population is, and you want to lose belly fat, aerobic exercise is the better choice because it burns more calories." Aerobic training burned 67% more calories in the study when compared to resistance training."

"The eight-month study followed 196 overweight, sedentary adults (ages 18-70) who were randomized to one of three groups: aerobic training; resistance training or a combination of the two. The aerobic group performed exercises equivalent to 12 miles of jogging per week at 80% maximum heart rate. The resistance group performed three sets of 8 -- 12 repetitions three times per week. All programs were closely supervised and monitored to ensure maximum effort in participation."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/08/110825105018.htm

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 29, 2011
at 02:08 PM

Research about exercise does not exist in a dietary vacuum. You can't make claims about one without at least acknowledging the other. Equally ridiculous is the notion that I am advocating a "ONE SIZE" fits all approach. I disagree with the "calories in calories out" model and the researchers exact words are "What really counts is how much exercise you do, how many miles you walk and how many calories you burn." If anything, this is an example of "one size fits all" thinking.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 09:42 PM

I am interested in reading the study itself, rather than just the study conclusions reporting.

C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 28, 2011
at 06:38 PM

I work with more then you might think. Those that listen to me get great results, those that don't don't. I'm glad you get good results with what you do. My main argument is that this original "study" is deeply flawed. I feel that they can not come to the conclusion that they did with the data represented.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 04:43 PM

ONE SIZE FITS ALL = NAD!!!!!!!

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 04:42 PM

(better) for *specific issues* in specific populations.*

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 04:42 PM

Ryan, you are firmly wedded to your experience and what you believe. I'm curious as to how many obese/morbidly obese, diabetic, apple shaped, trigycerides 600-1200 range, non-alcoholic fatty livered, metabolic syndome, osteoporotic , age range 35 -70 you work with? I work with lots and get a birdseye view or exact progress or lack thereof. I would never rec. only aerobics and never over 30min at a time. Resistance+aerobics is the name of the game for *many* in my direct experience. No argument with what strength draing DOES. Lots of interest in what additional 30min hits of aerobics does

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 02:42 AM

thhq: love this:It's not rocket science, using hands and feet for what they're good for. You have to resist the urge to intellectualize in order to do the stupid thing. The more you do it the more you realize it's what you should have been doing all along. Amen.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 28, 2011
at 02:32 AM

Thanks mem. I walked my way out of obesity. It was only later - after listening to considerable techical wrangling over the subject of very low carb dieting - that it dawned on me that paleo was about a lot more than a diet. It's not rocket science, using hands and feet for what they're good for. You have to resist the urge to intellectualize in order to do the stupid thing. The more you do it the more you realize it's what you should have been doing all along.

C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 27, 2011
at 09:39 PM

When I say resistance training I am referring to functional movements/lifts. Squats, Deadlift etc, major lifts that will improve overall strength and body composition. Also refering to people to aim to get stronger, doing a bunch of squats or deadlifts with very light weight doesn't make you strong. Aim to improve strength. Plain and simple, I would have liked to take the resistance training group for resistance training and see the results compared.

C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 27, 2011
at 09:37 PM

Proper training done right works for all. Getting stronger and faster will remove fat and improve all markers of health. If this study "proved" other wise then it is flawed and they implemented it horribly wrong. Not to mention increase the chance of maintaining your results in the long term. Stronger people live longer. Well at least according to Art Devany, they also have a decreased chance of contracting diseases. Overweight people in general will respond the best to resistance training because they have excess calories to build muscle. So they will build muscle faster.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 09:08 PM

+1 for great description of what is working for you and your experience of how it is working. It's clear that you are doing a combo of strength+aerobic. I also do additional strength by doing lots of yard work and simply losing no opportunities to pick heavy things up. The addition of dancercise has hit the jackpot for me. It FEELS GOOD and I love doing the combo as well as the different way in which my body is worked.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 09:02 PM

(cont') impact both, thereby impacting ingestive behavior as well as cortisol fat shunting. As per the research, just as in diet, I think absolutely that one size (one exercise type!) does not fit all. +1 for honest, thoughtful response.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 09:00 PM

thhq: I started out with walking, plain and simple. And I continue it, both at a more leisurely and an accelerated/aerobic pace. Over the years since 99 my exercise has gone through alot of evolution. I am also NOT a calorie person at all. I agree with Lustig wholeheartedly that exercise is NOT about calorie burning primarily at all. For overweight ppl in particular it is about increasing skeletal muscle insulin senstivity and leptin sensitivity and decreasing cortisol and promoting better sleep. As well, anxiety and depression are common "pathways" into obesity and exercise can *dramatically*

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:54 PM

(con't) those with high cortisol issues - sleep issues/anxiety/depression. It will also increase leptin sensitivity and increase skeletal muscle insulin sensitivity. Yes, for those who do not have high cortisol issues, it may make little difference in intake behaviors. But a high number of overweight ppl DO have these issues. Again, ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:51 PM

(conbt) dangerous visceral fat. You say that you disagree with the research "becasue it is not simply about 'how much exercise you do' just as it is not simply about how many calories you consume." Well, this statement really very much *agrees* with this research. We need all the tools in our tool boxes we can get when we aren't part of the less than 50% who come to paleo without weight issues. Additionally, your one size fits all statement about the effects of exercise does not fit all. Exercise will significantly REDUCE the eating intake of a significant # of overweight ppl - typically

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:45 PM

FED:The research was not about diet,; it was about exercise and the exercise. And it did not in any was diss resistance training. It says that resistance training does very well, what it does well, which is: improving strength and increasing lean body mass." There is more to the needs of MANY overweight persons who come to ancestral eating. And we have had notable questions concerning VERY active people who are basically doing resistance activities 8 hours a day in their work and STILL cannot move fat. Sure, they are building muscle, but that doesn't mean they are burning fat, including

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:37 PM

)con't) target differing needs. One size really doesn't fit all and PH questions have infact demonstrated this over and over and over again. "Resistance training is great for improving strength and increasing lean body mass."

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:35 PM

Just a is true with diet (there is NO ONE optimum ancestral diet for ALL needs) so is it highly probably that it is true that exercise needs to be indvidualized. This study is targeting overweight, sedentary and very specifically targeting "significant reductions in visceral fat, liver fat, liver enzyme levels and insulin resistance." It is NOT in any way saying that weight training is in any way inferior FOR WHAT IT EXCELS AT. And a combination of resistance training + aerobics was found to achieve similar results. I find it most plausible that different types of exercise would be needed to

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 27, 2011
at 07:19 PM

Keep up the good work Meghan! I think that having "feel really good" as your main goal is awesome :)

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 27, 2011
at 07:17 PM

I think that plenty of walking, generally moving about, getting good sleep, productive/rewarding work (family, business, personal) and quality nutrition is all you really need.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 27, 2011
at 04:21 PM

The status quo is fat, not lean. I'm getting pretty sick of reading about how exercise has to be "just so" or it's not properly paleo.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 27, 2011
at 04:13 PM

The status quo is fat, not lean. How you get lean doesn't matter as much as getting there and staying there.

B4e1fa6a8cf43d2b69d97a99dfca262c

(10255)

on August 27, 2011
at 01:54 PM

+1 that was my exact thought while reading this post. i see people doing resistance training at this level all the time at my gym. it tough to fight the urge to suggest they put some weight on the bar and slow down.

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4 Answers

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1
06325b762f78a2b8aaa977161cca4a1f

(539)

on August 27, 2011
at 02:27 PM

My goal is to feel really good so I do what my body craves on any given day. I'm 146 pounds and 5'6 and definitely would like to slim down but my even bigger priority is to feel good. At first, when I started following my "feel good" protocol, I generally wanted to walk and so I did. Now I actually enjoy running for the majority (or at least 1/2) of my 3-4 mile route and it isn't forced at all; I stop and walk when I get tired. There are also some big rocks on the trail and on some days, I squat, deadlift or throw them just for fun. I'll also do some (assisted) pull-ups, pushups or other bodyweight exercises as desired which might be one or two sets multiple times a day (some days). Other days of the week I want to do some volleyball or soccer, which has the added benefit of social stimulation. Other days I really REALLY don't want to do anything and I am SURE to just rest. I've forced exercise before, and I am rarely better for it.

I am starting to "feel" lighter, stronger and more energetic and crave physical activity more and more which is what I actually wanted from the weight loss anyway. And I think I AM losing a little bit of weight, but it's hard to pin if it's from the exercise or the diet specifically.

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 27, 2011
at 07:19 PM

Keep up the good work Meghan! I think that having "feel really good" as your main goal is awesome :)

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 09:08 PM

+1 for great description of what is working for you and your experience of how it is working. It's clear that you are doing a combo of strength+aerobic. I also do additional strength by doing lots of yard work and simply losing no opportunities to pick heavy things up. The addition of dancercise has hit the jackpot for me. It FEELS GOOD and I love doing the combo as well as the different way in which my body is worked.

2
Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 27, 2011
at 02:15 PM

This study was set up to validate the conventional wisdom regarding exercise and diet.

The researcher said, "What really counts is how much exercise you do, how many miles you walk and how many calories you burn," he says. "If you choose to work at a lower aerobic intensity, it will simply take longer to burn the same amount of unhealthy fat." And, in a study comparing the short-term fat loss effects of three sets of 8-12 reps (across how many exercises/body parts? It doesn't say) 3 times a week vs the equivalent of jogging 12 miles per week you can pretty much guarantee that your results will match your expectations.

What they don't discuss is how moderate aerobic exercise (80% max heart rate in this study) increases appetite and ultimately leads to increased food consumption post exercise. They also failed to discuss any dietary interventions, which, again, support the notion of "calorie in calorie out". Given that the participants were "overweight, sedentary" individuals, it is rather likely that they were consuming a SAD diet full of processed foods, high in carbohydrates and fat, and low in nutrient density.

I disagree with the conclusions of this study because it is not simply about "how much exercise you do" just as it is not simply about how many calories you consume. Quality is just as important (if not more so) than quantity.

Would these same participants, if eating a quality diet, require high-volume moderate aerobic exercise to achieve a reduction in visceral body fat? Probably not, but the conventional wisdom is all about maintaining the status quo.

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 27, 2011
at 07:17 PM

I think that plenty of walking, generally moving about, getting good sleep, productive/rewarding work (family, business, personal) and quality nutrition is all you really need.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:51 PM

(conbt) dangerous visceral fat. You say that you disagree with the research "becasue it is not simply about 'how much exercise you do' just as it is not simply about how many calories you consume." Well, this statement really very much *agrees* with this research. We need all the tools in our tool boxes we can get when we aren't part of the less than 50% who come to paleo without weight issues. Additionally, your one size fits all statement about the effects of exercise does not fit all. Exercise will significantly REDUCE the eating intake of a significant # of overweight ppl - typically

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 27, 2011
at 04:13 PM

The status quo is fat, not lean. How you get lean doesn't matter as much as getting there and staying there.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:45 PM

FED:The research was not about diet,; it was about exercise and the exercise. And it did not in any was diss resistance training. It says that resistance training does very well, what it does well, which is: improving strength and increasing lean body mass." There is more to the needs of MANY overweight persons who come to ancestral eating. And we have had notable questions concerning VERY active people who are basically doing resistance activities 8 hours a day in their work and STILL cannot move fat. Sure, they are building muscle, but that doesn't mean they are burning fat, including

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 27, 2011
at 04:21 PM

The status quo is fat, not lean. I'm getting pretty sick of reading about how exercise has to be "just so" or it's not properly paleo.

Medium avatar

(19469)

on August 29, 2011
at 02:08 PM

Research about exercise does not exist in a dietary vacuum. You can't make claims about one without at least acknowledging the other. Equally ridiculous is the notion that I am advocating a "ONE SIZE" fits all approach. I disagree with the "calories in calories out" model and the researchers exact words are "What really counts is how much exercise you do, how many miles you walk and how many calories you burn." If anything, this is an example of "one size fits all" thinking.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:54 PM

(con't) those with high cortisol issues - sleep issues/anxiety/depression. It will also increase leptin sensitivity and increase skeletal muscle insulin sensitivity. Yes, for those who do not have high cortisol issues, it may make little difference in intake behaviors. But a high number of overweight ppl DO have these issues. Again, ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL.

2
C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 27, 2011
at 12:58 PM

To say that Aerobic exercise beats resistance training of overweight sedentary adults preforming 8-12 reps of bicep curls and shoulder shrugs and half squats in a smith machine would most likely be right.

How about they do a study that compares real training, like running for your life, or lifting something really heavy once in a while to aerobic training.

Plain and simple for overweight people I would say that aerobic work outs probably had a lot more intensity and moving weight (themselves) up and down was more likely more weight then their resistance training routine.

So I get aerobic training beats long distance running, and crappy weight training. But they didn't compare to the training that matters, sprinting for short distance and lifting heavy stuff in functional movements.

Then again we can always find studies that "prove" just about everything. All depends on funding.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:37 PM

)con't) target differing needs. One size really doesn't fit all and PH questions have infact demonstrated this over and over and over again. "Resistance training is great for improving strength and increasing lean body mass."

B4e1fa6a8cf43d2b69d97a99dfca262c

(10255)

on August 27, 2011
at 01:54 PM

+1 that was my exact thought while reading this post. i see people doing resistance training at this level all the time at my gym. it tough to fight the urge to suggest they put some weight on the bar and slow down.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 08:35 PM

Just a is true with diet (there is NO ONE optimum ancestral diet for ALL needs) so is it highly probably that it is true that exercise needs to be indvidualized. This study is targeting overweight, sedentary and very specifically targeting "significant reductions in visceral fat, liver fat, liver enzyme levels and insulin resistance." It is NOT in any way saying that weight training is in any way inferior FOR WHAT IT EXCELS AT. And a combination of resistance training + aerobics was found to achieve similar results. I find it most plausible that different types of exercise would be needed to

C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 27, 2011
at 09:37 PM

Proper training done right works for all. Getting stronger and faster will remove fat and improve all markers of health. If this study "proved" other wise then it is flawed and they implemented it horribly wrong. Not to mention increase the chance of maintaining your results in the long term. Stronger people live longer. Well at least according to Art Devany, they also have a decreased chance of contracting diseases. Overweight people in general will respond the best to resistance training because they have excess calories to build muscle. So they will build muscle faster.

C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 28, 2011
at 06:38 PM

I work with more then you might think. Those that listen to me get great results, those that don't don't. I'm glad you get good results with what you do. My main argument is that this original "study" is deeply flawed. I feel that they can not come to the conclusion that they did with the data represented.

C1c86f42410cd4788bd9c5cf801dcd8f

(2246)

on August 27, 2011
at 09:39 PM

When I say resistance training I am referring to functional movements/lifts. Squats, Deadlift etc, major lifts that will improve overall strength and body composition. Also refering to people to aim to get stronger, doing a bunch of squats or deadlifts with very light weight doesn't make you strong. Aim to improve strength. Plain and simple, I would have liked to take the resistance training group for resistance training and see the results compared.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 09:42 PM

I am interested in reading the study itself, rather than just the study conclusions reporting.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 04:42 PM

Ryan, you are firmly wedded to your experience and what you believe. I'm curious as to how many obese/morbidly obese, diabetic, apple shaped, trigycerides 600-1200 range, non-alcoholic fatty livered, metabolic syndome, osteoporotic , age range 35 -70 you work with? I work with lots and get a birdseye view or exact progress or lack thereof. I would never rec. only aerobics and never over 30min at a time. Resistance+aerobics is the name of the game for *many* in my direct experience. No argument with what strength draing DOES. Lots of interest in what additional 30min hits of aerobics does

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 04:42 PM

(better) for *specific issues* in specific populations.*

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 04:43 PM

ONE SIZE FITS ALL = NAD!!!!!!!

1
Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 27, 2011
at 01:49 PM

I accomplish what I want simply by walking, which I consider to be non-aerobic at my 3.5 mph pace. My goal is transportation and weight maintenance, but it has also improved CV indicators blood pressure and HDL. In order for this to be effective you need time - think in terms of hours a day, not hours a week. I only get a net burn of 70 calories per mile.

I realize it's paleo-chic to imagine Grok raining boulders on mastodons and running from sabertooth cats. But the reality was mundane scrounging for something edible to keep from starving. No motor vehicles. Paleo is all about walking for everything.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 09:02 PM

(cont') impact both, thereby impacting ingestive behavior as well as cortisol fat shunting. As per the research, just as in diet, I think absolutely that one size (one exercise type!) does not fit all. +1 for honest, thoughtful response.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 28, 2011
at 02:42 AM

thhq: love this:It's not rocket science, using hands and feet for what they're good for. You have to resist the urge to intellectualize in order to do the stupid thing. The more you do it the more you realize it's what you should have been doing all along. Amen.

Medium avatar

(10611)

on August 28, 2011
at 02:32 AM

Thanks mem. I walked my way out of obesity. It was only later - after listening to considerable techical wrangling over the subject of very low carb dieting - that it dawned on me that paleo was about a lot more than a diet. It's not rocket science, using hands and feet for what they're good for. You have to resist the urge to intellectualize in order to do the stupid thing. The more you do it the more you realize it's what you should have been doing all along.

Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on August 27, 2011
at 09:00 PM

thhq: I started out with walking, plain and simple. And I continue it, both at a more leisurely and an accelerated/aerobic pace. Over the years since 99 my exercise has gone through alot of evolution. I am also NOT a calorie person at all. I agree with Lustig wholeheartedly that exercise is NOT about calorie burning primarily at all. For overweight ppl in particular it is about increasing skeletal muscle insulin senstivity and leptin sensitivity and decreasing cortisol and promoting better sleep. As well, anxiety and depression are common "pathways" into obesity and exercise can *dramatically*

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