3

votes

What Are Vegans' Reasons For Avoiding Unfertilized Eggs from Pastured-Raised Chickens?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created August 01, 2012 at 3:53 PM

I heard this said on Joe Rogan's podcast when Robb Wolf was on there. Seriously, since no animals are harmed or killed to get them, how are vegans against eating them at all?

68655ec9711d207d69a63ebf96b37573

on June 29, 2013
at 10:15 PM

There's an interesting part of "The Vegetarian Myth" where the vegan author has a chicken to eat the slugs of her veggies, which she grows in her garden to avoid vegetables fertilised by blood-and-bone-meal fertiliser. Eventually she feels bad about the "captive" chicken and gets rid of it but then can't bear to kill the slugs or remove them from her garden. I like that you're rational enough to not have a problem with rescued layer hen eggs

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 09:33 PM

Most of the crops that need pollinating, are pollinated by captive hives that are trucked around the country to whatever needs pollinating. So any commercially grown tree fruit, nuts, squash, tomatoes, etc. would be right out.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 08:06 PM

Hostile????? "Perhaps" is like the white flag at the beginning of a sentence. Don't shoot! If you follow in the traditions of vegetarian/veganism from the 1970's, like I was raised, it was very fat phobic. You can blame it on Senator George McGovern. http://www.cnpp.usda.gov/Publications/DietaryGuidelines/2010/DGAC/Report/E-Appendix-E-4-History.pdf Veganism came to embrace things like coconut oil the same way paleo made the move from lean to saturated meats, out of necessity. And I didn't even notice coconut oil getting the green light until the 2000's, it was a pariah in the '80's.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:56 PM

Can you guess what "lacto" means in Latin?

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:56 PM

Ovo means egg for the Latin impaired.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:54 PM

I was vegetarian for almost 20 years, there is most certainly vegetable protein, it is just bound up with toxins that you might not want to eat in great quantity.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:51 PM

Having had free-range chickens, I'd say that would be a pretty lucky chicken to make it to 20 years if there were any raccoons or other predators around. I think breeding has likely left them with even smaller brains than they must have started with before they became a domesticated animal.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:48 PM

Yes, yes, and maybe. I'd go to bat to suggest you need at least a little of what those things have to offer.

7a6529ea25b655132fe58d793f95547a

(2040)

on December 13, 2012
at 07:43 PM

Thanks Chelsea. I agree, it's a far better ethical choice to consume pastured animal products from a responsible farmer than it is to support the soy, corn, or wheat mono crops that just displace the animals that would normally live there.

2a00b9a42e4cb6e489a0e69d20714576

(3043)

on December 13, 2012
at 02:58 AM

VEGETABLES ARE NOT A PROTEIN.

2a00b9a42e4cb6e489a0e69d20714576

(3043)

on December 13, 2012
at 02:57 AM

Good on you Colin, that is a valid response. Firestorm uncalled for. From my own experience, veganism was a disaster, your body needs fat and protein. It appears the vegan diet is very high in monounsatured fats like nuts.Low omega 3 / high omega 6(hemp/flax don't convert in the body so they are not a source of omega 3. If your concerned about the ethics, buy sustainably raised fish, support your local pastured raised animals/farmers. Vote with your money.

98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

(24286)

on December 12, 2012
at 09:38 PM

Thank you Firestorm for an informative and respectful answer. I don't understand all the vegan hate around here. They are just people trying to do better. We may believe them to be misguided but anyone trying to do better is o.k. in my book. And the raw vegans make THE BEST food ever! Add a little meat on the side and you'll be in heaven.

E36cb992cf0a5eba8b97a359c15f38b3

(4347)

on August 01, 2012
at 11:35 PM

Yeah, I was not vegan for nutritional reasons. I ate a high fat vegan diet that didn't have loads of crap (sugar, etc.) and had plenty of veggies, very little soy, etc. I probably would've been fine with butter save for the ethical issue I was concerned with then. (Which I think was and is a perfectly valid argument for the majority of butter found in supermarkets.) The vegans I am friends with now aren't anti-fat at all. Some are vegan for nutritional reasons, and they still eat plenty of coconut oil, olive oil, etc.

E36cb992cf0a5eba8b97a359c15f38b3

(4347)

on August 01, 2012
at 11:32 PM

I think that's a main argument, as well as the culling of male chicks because they won't lay eggs. It's an ethical argument, not a nutritional one (for many vegans, anyway).

8de9776490016df60d49e03f23d656af

(596)

on August 01, 2012
at 10:08 PM

All of the vegans I know (there are few, I will admit) are anti-fat of any kind and happy to buy leather shoes. It's not about the sanctity of life for them, it's all about their view of optimal human nutrition.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:42 PM

This hasn't been my experience with vegans, either. Most vegans I know are very savvy about vegetable sources of protein, and actually do- eat a good bit of protein rich food, especially in what used to be called "complimentary combinations" like rice and beans, wheat and legumes, etc.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:40 PM

Pollination doesn't take any 'animal-production'... honey, though, is considered by most strict vegans as an "animal product" like milk and eggs.

A2c38be4c54c91a15071f82f14cac0b3

(12682)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:37 PM

Haha, well I can't read today. Sorry about that.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:23 PM

I get a LOT of exposure on this one, having been a vegan (I trained as a midwife with a midwife from The Farm, as well as having several friends who were "PETA" vegans. For some folk, it -is- a nutrition decision -- less protein, more alkaline-raising foods, etc., but the vegans aren't any more 'fat phobic' than the rest of the US -- they're fine with olive oil, coconut oil (saturated), palm kernel oil (saturated)... it's strictly -animal- fats that get the kaibosh.

1398eff69b192c35de5e0dbaad59052a

(2024)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:59 PM

What Christine says.

1d0497f8781845ab371b479455bfee8e

(11157)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:50 PM

Correction: It's chicken ovulation, man. Note how OP said "UNFERTILIZED". You can't abort something that isn't fertilized, be it a human or chicken egg. Durr.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:40 PM

How come they have abortions every other day? Don't tell republicans - they will come up with a new pro-chick law!

0a9ad4e577fe24a6b8aafa1dd7a50c79

(5150)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:16 PM

CAFO polar bears maybe

0a9ad4e577fe24a6b8aafa1dd7a50c79

(5150)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:15 PM

Colin was not being hostile, sheesh. He made an observation and a valid one at that. It would be both incorrect and irresponsible to say that pretty much all vegans aren't anti-saturated fat.

78964c5cc470f86a5897db8e1ce8e6f9

on August 01, 2012
at 05:57 PM

Those are lacto-ovo vegetarians. Vegans are strict no-animal-products, to eat, wear, etc.

Adeb72a71b7cd3f4dd75795eb9c11ad9

(130)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:50 PM

^^^ LMAO! Touche!

Adeb72a71b7cd3f4dd75795eb9c11ad9

(130)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:49 PM

HA! Maybe that's not a bad thing Raney lol.

Adeb72a71b7cd3f4dd75795eb9c11ad9

(130)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:46 PM

Why can't I raise the above comments reputation? lol

0d0842381492a41b2173a04014aae810

(4875)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:42 PM

...'cause its totally natural for a wolf to have a chicken dinner, but not for a human to do so. Clearly the level of intelligence we have evolved to has brought about a spiritual imperative wherein we no longer qualify as mammal. Have we learned nothing from the panda?! One has to wonder how many generations of strict veganism it would take to produce a human incapable of breeding...

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:39 PM

Yeah. Good luck eating all that vegan food that requires pollination by bees.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:38 PM

What about lacto-ovo vegans?

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:37 PM

Try to have a conversation about logical fallicies with any regious fanatic and you are not going to get anywhere fast. Vegans are equivalent to religious fanatics. (A few paleos are as well. You know who you are...)

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:35 PM

I go with the counter argument that there would be more polar bears if they were tasty for breakfast.

7a6529ea25b655132fe58d793f95547a

(2040)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:10 PM

I apologize if it seemed hostile that wasn't my intention. In my experiments in diet I remember that being along with others a justification for that way of life when I went through it. Perhaps it was also a sorry attempt at humor.....my bad.

Ef9f83cb4e1826261a44c173f733789e

(13635)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:49 PM

I'd guess that a domesticated bird won't last long in the wild and will die anyway, but then again a vegan might say that being eaten by a wild animal is better than by a human.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:42 PM

What if a chicken eventually will be set free? Like a free-range going wild?

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:38 PM

Colin, that is actually NOT part of the equation, and the tone of your response seems un-useful and hostile. The arguments about cholesterol and saturated fat are more often used by vegetarians -- especially those heavily into promoting their own vegetarian fitness plan. Veganism is much more related to the sanctity of life, and, I think, in some ways is a response to the corporatization and industrialization of our food system.

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12 Answers

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12
Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:33 PM

Vegans, in general, from a philosophical perspective, believe that retaining ANY animal in captivity for the purpose of providing food for humans (including, for truly strict vegans, using honey -- which they consider 'stolen' from bees), is unethical. They do not believe that animals or creatures of -any- sort should be exploited for the purposes of feeding another species.

It isn't about whether the egg is fertile, or whether the chickens have been raised 'naturally' for food -- the issue is that, for a vegan, -any- consumption that exploits animals or 'steals' their 'babies' or their production is unethical. That includes milk from cows, eggs from chickens, honey from bees, leather, animal-based glue, etc.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:35 PM

I go with the counter argument that there would be more polar bears if they were tasty for breakfast.

0a9ad4e577fe24a6b8aafa1dd7a50c79

(5150)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:16 PM

CAFO polar bears maybe

Adeb72a71b7cd3f4dd75795eb9c11ad9

(130)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:46 PM

Why can't I raise the above comments reputation? lol

98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

(24286)

on December 12, 2012
at 09:38 PM

Thank you Firestorm for an informative and respectful answer. I don't understand all the vegan hate around here. They are just people trying to do better. We may believe them to be misguided but anyone trying to do better is o.k. in my book. And the raw vegans make THE BEST food ever! Add a little meat on the side and you'll be in heaven.

6
A2c38be4c54c91a15071f82f14cac0b3

(12682)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:06 PM

Because it's basically chicken abortion, man.

1d0497f8781845ab371b479455bfee8e

(11157)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:50 PM

Correction: It's chicken ovulation, man. Note how OP said "UNFERTILIZED". You can't abort something that isn't fertilized, be it a human or chicken egg. Durr.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:40 PM

How come they have abortions every other day? Don't tell republicans - they will come up with a new pro-chick law!

A2c38be4c54c91a15071f82f14cac0b3

(12682)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:37 PM

Haha, well I can't read today. Sorry about that.

4
7a6529ea25b655132fe58d793f95547a

(2040)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:31 PM

Perhaps the fat has something to do with it. I can remember reading different blogs when I was a Vegan/Vegetarian and there was quite a bit of fear surrounding saturated fat & cholesterol. But that also happens in the mainstream too.

7a6529ea25b655132fe58d793f95547a

(2040)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:10 PM

I apologize if it seemed hostile that wasn't my intention. In my experiments in diet I remember that being along with others a justification for that way of life when I went through it. Perhaps it was also a sorry attempt at humor.....my bad.

E36cb992cf0a5eba8b97a359c15f38b3

(4347)

on August 01, 2012
at 11:35 PM

Yeah, I was not vegan for nutritional reasons. I ate a high fat vegan diet that didn't have loads of crap (sugar, etc.) and had plenty of veggies, very little soy, etc. I probably would've been fine with butter save for the ethical issue I was concerned with then. (Which I think was and is a perfectly valid argument for the majority of butter found in supermarkets.) The vegans I am friends with now aren't anti-fat at all. Some are vegan for nutritional reasons, and they still eat plenty of coconut oil, olive oil, etc.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:38 PM

Colin, that is actually NOT part of the equation, and the tone of your response seems un-useful and hostile. The arguments about cholesterol and saturated fat are more often used by vegetarians -- especially those heavily into promoting their own vegetarian fitness plan. Veganism is much more related to the sanctity of life, and, I think, in some ways is a response to the corporatization and industrialization of our food system.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:23 PM

I get a LOT of exposure on this one, having been a vegan (I trained as a midwife with a midwife from The Farm, as well as having several friends who were "PETA" vegans. For some folk, it -is- a nutrition decision -- less protein, more alkaline-raising foods, etc., but the vegans aren't any more 'fat phobic' than the rest of the US -- they're fine with olive oil, coconut oil (saturated), palm kernel oil (saturated)... it's strictly -animal- fats that get the kaibosh.

0a9ad4e577fe24a6b8aafa1dd7a50c79

(5150)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:15 PM

Colin was not being hostile, sheesh. He made an observation and a valid one at that. It would be both incorrect and irresponsible to say that pretty much all vegans aren't anti-saturated fat.

8de9776490016df60d49e03f23d656af

(596)

on August 01, 2012
at 10:08 PM

All of the vegans I know (there are few, I will admit) are anti-fat of any kind and happy to buy leather shoes. It's not about the sanctity of life for them, it's all about their view of optimal human nutrition.

7a6529ea25b655132fe58d793f95547a

(2040)

on December 13, 2012
at 07:43 PM

Thanks Chelsea. I agree, it's a far better ethical choice to consume pastured animal products from a responsible farmer than it is to support the soy, corn, or wheat mono crops that just displace the animals that would normally live there.

2a00b9a42e4cb6e489a0e69d20714576

(3043)

on December 13, 2012
at 02:57 AM

Good on you Colin, that is a valid response. Firestorm uncalled for. From my own experience, veganism was a disaster, your body needs fat and protein. It appears the vegan diet is very high in monounsatured fats like nuts.Low omega 3 / high omega 6(hemp/flax don't convert in the body so they are not a source of omega 3. If your concerned about the ethics, buy sustainably raised fish, support your local pastured raised animals/farmers. Vote with your money.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 08:06 PM

Hostile????? "Perhaps" is like the white flag at the beginning of a sentence. Don't shoot! If you follow in the traditions of vegetarian/veganism from the 1970's, like I was raised, it was very fat phobic. You can blame it on Senator George McGovern. http://www.cnpp.usda.gov/Publications/DietaryGuidelines/2010/DGAC/Report/E-Appendix-E-4-History.pdf Veganism came to embrace things like coconut oil the same way paleo made the move from lean to saturated meats, out of necessity. And I didn't even notice coconut oil getting the green light until the 2000's, it was a pariah in the '80's.

3
7e1433afbb06c318c4d90860d493c49d

(5959)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:00 PM

Vegans are against any animal being "enslaved" by mankind, even bees. As for egg production not harming animals, that is not the case with either egg or dairy production. Production of both eggs and dairy involves unneeded males and old females, which all end up being slaughtered.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:39 PM

Yeah. Good luck eating all that vegan food that requires pollination by bees.

Adeb72a71b7cd3f4dd75795eb9c11ad9

(130)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:50 PM

^^^ LMAO! Touche!

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:40 PM

Pollination doesn't take any 'animal-production'... honey, though, is considered by most strict vegans as an "animal product" like milk and eggs.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 09:33 PM

Most of the crops that need pollinating, are pollinated by captive hives that are trucked around the country to whatever needs pollinating. So any commercially grown tree fruit, nuts, squash, tomatoes, etc. would be right out.

1
Ec64c76beab6a7c856d4b1080be4fb90

on June 29, 2013
at 05:41 PM

i'm vegan, and my reason is chick culling. even at the nicest, friendliest, happiest egg farms, they order female chicks from a hatchery. the hatchery disposes of all the male chicks (which as you can guess, is about half of them) often in cruel and callous ways, such as dumping them alive in a grinder, or suffocating them in plastic bags.

the other reason is that the hens, even at the nice pasture raised farms (in the bay area anyway) are killed at 2 years and sold for stew meat. 2 years is about 1/10th a chicken's natural lifespan.

so, what if you rescued a former layer and gave her a home? could you eat those eggs? i see no ethical reason not to, though it's not technically vegan. there are very few situations like this (the other being sustainable farming of bivalve mollusks such as clams, oysters, scallops and mussels.) most vegans don't agree with me on that one. these 2 foods are the only ones that i consider to be ethical choices, though not vegan ones.

ultimately though, we don't need it, so we don't eat it.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:48 PM

Yes, yes, and maybe. I'd go to bat to suggest you need at least a little of what those things have to offer.

68655ec9711d207d69a63ebf96b37573

on June 29, 2013
at 10:15 PM

There's an interesting part of "The Vegetarian Myth" where the vegan author has a chicken to eat the slugs of her veggies, which she grows in her garden to avoid vegetables fertilised by blood-and-bone-meal fertiliser. Eventually she feels bad about the "captive" chicken and gets rid of it but then can't bear to kill the slugs or remove them from her garden. I like that you're rational enough to not have a problem with rescued layer hen eggs

1
2a7481b6e84d3f3d437a8744b3b76897

on December 12, 2012
at 09:15 PM

on organic egg farms in the uk which have better animal welfare standards than pastured-raised chickens. male chickens are killed at just a few days old because they are too scrawy to be raised for meat and are not able to produce eggs. they are often ground up alive, gased or thrown into dumpsters. female chickens are often debeaked a very painful operation in which the top part of the is cut off without the use of anesthetic. the average lifespan of a chicken in the wild is 20 years but egg farmers kill them at just 3 years old when the number of eggs they produce falls. due to genetic selection chickens on farms produce six times as many eggs as wild chickens do. to produce eggs calcium is taken from their bones. the consequence of the extra calcium being taked is that hens have weak and brittle bones and often suffer from fractures.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:51 PM

Having had free-range chickens, I'd say that would be a pretty lucky chicken to make it to 20 years if there were any raccoons or other predators around. I think breeding has likely left them with even smaller brains than they must have started with before they became a domesticated animal.

1
910404bebbcbd2505810c8cd8db31966

(380)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:57 PM

Observationally, I have noticed many vegans and vegetarians, especially those that are veg from childhood, develop an aversion to protein of any kind. I was veg from age 12 to 25 and avoided most all protein sources in favor of quick acting carbs, which act like crack to the brain. I see it now again in my stepdaughters, who are vegetarian, and refuse to eat most all sources of protein, unless coated in sugar. When your body is constantly fiending for sugar, you will make up all sorts of reasons to avoid healthy fats and protein, no matter how silly it may seem.

Ca1150430b1904659742ce2cad621c7d

(12540)

on August 01, 2012
at 07:42 PM

This hasn't been my experience with vegans, either. Most vegans I know are very savvy about vegetable sources of protein, and actually do- eat a good bit of protein rich food, especially in what used to be called "complimentary combinations" like rice and beans, wheat and legumes, etc.

2a00b9a42e4cb6e489a0e69d20714576

(3043)

on December 13, 2012
at 02:58 AM

VEGETABLES ARE NOT A PROTEIN.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:54 PM

I was vegetarian for almost 20 years, there is most certainly vegetable protein, it is just bound up with toxins that you might not want to eat in great quantity.

1
1398eff69b192c35de5e0dbaad59052a

(2024)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:05 PM

Vegans don't eat eggs at all, fertilized or not.

78964c5cc470f86a5897db8e1ce8e6f9

on August 01, 2012
at 05:57 PM

Those are lacto-ovo vegetarians. Vegans are strict no-animal-products, to eat, wear, etc.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:38 PM

What about lacto-ovo vegans?

1398eff69b192c35de5e0dbaad59052a

(2024)

on August 01, 2012
at 06:59 PM

What Christine says.

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:56 PM

Can you guess what "lacto" means in Latin?

6120c989fd5b69f42a0834b69b87955b

(24553)

on June 29, 2013
at 07:56 PM

Ovo means egg for the Latin impaired.

0
374925bd0c30305e4027c25e8815b298

(113)

on June 26, 2013
at 05:18 PM

Insert what Dave S. said here.

0
57102d124f31399798a5e24ca6703f25

on June 26, 2013
at 02:03 PM

A Vegan here. The answer is more complicated than unbending devotion to an ideology against animal exploitation. I'll take battery cages, debeaking and forced molting out of the equation here. Just take a look at the logistics of egg production. Only female chickens can produce eggs. To get female chickens a chicken must give birth to them. When chickens give birth they birth both male and female chickens. Most male chickens have no value at all. Many are killed through grinding or stuffed in bags and left to suffocate. Regardless, even if killed humanely the long tail of supporting egg production by eating eggs is that it results in the death of male chickens. Very similar story with milk cows and their link to veal actually

0
7fa7c178bcea79733c2d13691c72e361

on August 01, 2012
at 09:27 PM

I drink smoothies with protein powder in them to get my protein. I'm also adverse to using animals of any kind in captivity for food. All Vegan protein powder comes from plants, so now animals are used.

To get a really good tasing one I went onto this review site http://veganproteinpowders.net and picked a high ranking one. I don't miss eggs anymore cause now I get my protein

0
Ef9f83cb4e1826261a44c173f733789e

on August 01, 2012
at 04:26 PM

The chicken itself will eventually be killed (and hopefully eaten) after it stops laying eggs.

A vegan might also just be against captivity in general.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:42 PM

What if a chicken eventually will be set free? Like a free-range going wild?

0d0842381492a41b2173a04014aae810

(4875)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:42 PM

...'cause its totally natural for a wolf to have a chicken dinner, but not for a human to do so. Clearly the level of intelligence we have evolved to has brought about a spiritual imperative wherein we no longer qualify as mammal. Have we learned nothing from the panda?! One has to wonder how many generations of strict veganism it would take to produce a human incapable of breeding...

Ef9f83cb4e1826261a44c173f733789e

(13635)

on August 01, 2012
at 04:49 PM

I'd guess that a domesticated bird won't last long in the wild and will die anyway, but then again a vegan might say that being eaten by a wild animal is better than by a human.

E36cb992cf0a5eba8b97a359c15f38b3

(4347)

on August 01, 2012
at 11:32 PM

I think that's a main argument, as well as the culling of male chicks because they won't lay eggs. It's an ethical argument, not a nutritional one (for many vegans, anyway).

Adeb72a71b7cd3f4dd75795eb9c11ad9

(130)

on August 01, 2012
at 05:49 PM

HA! Maybe that's not a bad thing Raney lol.

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