1

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Hashimoto-like symptoms triggered by rice?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created March 11, 2012 at 10:46 AM

Hi hackers,

it's well known that gluten may trigger an autoimmune reaction against the thyroid. A friend of mine is sensitive to gluten and has recently experienced brain-fog and fatigue after eating rice.

I read somewhere that there's the possibility of cross reactivity among gluten and any other types of grain (including rice). I guess the storage proteins do have similar properties and even rice may trigger a gluten-like reaction.

Does anyone know, if rice can cause an autoimmune response against the thyroid? Gluten obviously can and I presume rice protein has this ability as well, but some references and even n=1 experiences would be nice.

Thanks :)

1a512e7c9ebcb7842db8f3fad51d6710

(0)

on June 03, 2014
at 11:15 AM

I totally agree to cut out grain, dairy, and legumes, so I guess I have a lot in common with paleo although I'm vegan so I wouldn't eat the meat. I eat the veggies, avocados or brazil nuts occasionally for fats, and fruits and find that my body feels cleanest this way. I fasted and tried adding foods back in and testing this way realized that the grains, legumes, and dairy caused inflammation, brain fog, mucus, and mood swings as well as skin problems, lethargy, constipation, etc. I found Arnold Ehret's Mucusless diet system to be spot on- he pointed out that all grains cause mucus.

E2b72f1912f777917d8ee6b7fba43c26

(2384)

on May 02, 2012
at 05:35 AM

Thanks! I'm currently avoiding all types of seeds/kernels/nuts etc. since they share similar storage proteins with high chance of cross reactivity.

518bce04b12cd77741237e1f61075194

(11577)

on March 13, 2012
at 02:12 AM

Yeah, they just studied rice because it is an abundant food. miRNAs are not a unique thing, they are in plant matter and cows milk, regardless of who the cow is. It's not a rice or even grain specific thing- it's just a plant and some-other-foods thing.

742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab

(3536)

on March 12, 2012
at 11:58 PM

@ Travis Culp...Brown rice that is??

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 12, 2012
at 09:40 PM

The Chinese researchers happened to choose rice, for obvious reasons. This is not an effect that is peculiar to rice in any way.

D4d83e7981ca572aaaa19fc620bb54f1

(467)

on March 12, 2012
at 09:28 PM

I don't understand the miRNAs well, but could it be that they don't exist so much in milk if the cows eat grass instead of grains?

Bb2adc4df725b56e99e0652c0feb4640

(254)

on March 12, 2012
at 09:17 PM

Is there more research on the effect of say milk miRNAs ? I would suspect that plant miRNAs might have different effects than animal ones.

518bce04b12cd77741237e1f61075194

(11577)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:39 PM

Yeah, I am erring on the side of this opinion- reactions to rice, period, are very rare. There is probably another component of diet or environment that is having an impact, might take some brain storming.

518bce04b12cd77741237e1f61075194

(11577)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:38 PM

This article does a poor job of displaying what miRNAs are, and takes some leaps where it gets to complicated to explain the science to a general audience. miRNAs are abundant in milk and in many plants, not specific to rice, and it isn't a new concept that what you eat alters your genes. It is a really neat field that is probably going to get huge support soon, but I think these preliminary studies are being a bit misrepresented in media.

Bb2adc4df725b56e99e0652c0feb4640

(254)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:33 PM

The LDL receptor is basically what drives hormone production, starting with pregnenolone. Eat 'too much' rice, and steroidogenesis will drop, and LDL cholesterol will rise. I deleted the bit about cortisol levels, because I don't know wtf im talking about there.

50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

(813)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:29 AM

"If it doesn't work for you..." How do I find out? When my radiologist shows me the MRIs of an MSers brain with holes ... ????

D63a9a7789b948a1e88647f6c0e504ca

(1453)

on March 12, 2012
at 01:45 AM

Paul Jaminet regards white rice as a safe starch, and I trust him a lot more than some absolute a priori assumption that it is incompatible with paleo.

D4d83e7981ca572aaaa19fc620bb54f1

(467)

on March 12, 2012
at 01:39 AM

Thanks for posting this! Do you know how "Suppressing LDL receptor activity may cause brain fog by lowering cortisol levels"?

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on March 11, 2012
at 07:16 PM

It's completely individual. Some can eat rice, some can't. If it doesn't work for you, stop eating it - no matter what some blog guru says. You have to find your own way in this. Yes, there's trial-and-error. Find out what works for you.

E2b72f1912f777917d8ee6b7fba43c26

(2384)

on March 11, 2012
at 07:02 PM

It was white basmati and white arborio rice, properly rinsed. The symptoms appeared slowly, so it may be a reaction to the rice itself. But as you say, reactions to rice are pretty rare.

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 11, 2012
at 06:36 PM

Rice is fairly high in selenium, so it'd likely be beneficial.

E0250b1e6dc5ec1539ffb745042b4d80

(3651)

on March 11, 2012
at 04:32 PM

You don't get Hashimoto's symptoms from a bowl of rice, unless you have some powerfully messed up rice! I think the person experienced brain fog. I use to get that from simple carbs. Not sure why, my trigs were very very high.

50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

(813)

on March 11, 2012
at 12:31 PM

From minute 47 onwards Robb Wolf explains "prolamines" and YES, all grains have prolamines, even rice does.

50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

(813)

on March 11, 2012
at 11:49 AM

If you want explanations, watch this talk by Robb Wolf: Blast from the Past http://mediasite.suny.edu/mediasite/SilverlightPlayer/Default.aspx?peid=36d261682e3f4bd19d2c2e4978eddf261d

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5 Answers

4
13c5a9f1678d75b93f269cdcf69f14d5

(2339)

on March 11, 2012
at 06:46 PM

Occam says "what if the rice were cc'd with gluten?"

What brand? What type of rice - brown basmati? Rinsed before cooking? Cooked in a nice, tidy GF kitchen?

I've never seen any published research supporting the idea of cross-reactivity between gluten and other grains. I have seen research that suggests that some people are exquisitely sensitive to minute amounts of gluten. For example, the research that was done to determine a safe level of "gluten free" for celiacs. In that study, most tolerated 10 ppm but one person dropped out with a complete relapse of celiac symptoms. The proposed FDA standard is 20 ppm.

Another possibility - was the rice enriched? http://blog.glutenfreeclub.com/gluten-may-be-hiding-in-your-rice

Here's a small study showing levels of cc in "inherently gluten free" grains http://www.glutenfreedietitian.com/newsletter/contamination-of-naturally-guten-free-grains/

It is certainly possible that the problem is a reaction to the rice itself; but I don't think that is the most likely option.

518bce04b12cd77741237e1f61075194

(11577)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:39 PM

Yeah, I am erring on the side of this opinion- reactions to rice, period, are very rare. There is probably another component of diet or environment that is having an impact, might take some brain storming.

E2b72f1912f777917d8ee6b7fba43c26

(2384)

on March 11, 2012
at 07:02 PM

It was white basmati and white arborio rice, properly rinsed. The symptoms appeared slowly, so it may be a reaction to the rice itself. But as you say, reactions to rice are pretty rare.

Bb2adc4df725b56e99e0652c0feb4640

(254)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:33 PM

The LDL receptor is basically what drives hormone production, starting with pregnenolone. Eat 'too much' rice, and steroidogenesis will drop, and LDL cholesterol will rise. I deleted the bit about cortisol levels, because I don't know wtf im talking about there.

Bb2adc4df725b56e99e0652c0feb4640

(254)

on March 12, 2012
at 09:17 PM

Is there more research on the effect of say milk miRNAs ? I would suspect that plant miRNAs might have different effects than animal ones.

D4d83e7981ca572aaaa19fc620bb54f1

(467)

on March 12, 2012
at 01:39 AM

Thanks for posting this! Do you know how "Suppressing LDL receptor activity may cause brain fog by lowering cortisol levels"?

Medium avatar

(39821)

on March 12, 2012
at 09:40 PM

The Chinese researchers happened to choose rice, for obvious reasons. This is not an effect that is peculiar to rice in any way.

518bce04b12cd77741237e1f61075194

(11577)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:38 PM

This article does a poor job of displaying what miRNAs are, and takes some leaps where it gets to complicated to explain the science to a general audience. miRNAs are abundant in milk and in many plants, not specific to rice, and it isn't a new concept that what you eat alters your genes. It is a really neat field that is probably going to get huge support soon, but I think these preliminary studies are being a bit misrepresented in media.

D4d83e7981ca572aaaa19fc620bb54f1

(467)

on March 12, 2012
at 09:28 PM

I don't understand the miRNAs well, but could it be that they don't exist so much in milk if the cows eat grass instead of grains?

518bce04b12cd77741237e1f61075194

(11577)

on March 13, 2012
at 02:12 AM

Yeah, they just studied rice because it is an abundant food. miRNAs are not a unique thing, they are in plant matter and cows milk, regardless of who the cow is. It's not a rice or even grain specific thing- it's just a plant and some-other-foods thing.

2
4b8476263b26991db8ae954aad2fffad

on May 02, 2012
at 02:14 AM

Cyrex Labs does a cross-reactive blood tests that looks at the auto-immune reaction to various grains. Rice is one of these tested. In a recent test I had performed, it showed Rice as very reactive for me with auto-immune reactions that could trigger Hashimoto's.

E2b72f1912f777917d8ee6b7fba43c26

(2384)

on May 02, 2012
at 05:35 AM

Thanks! I'm currently avoiding all types of seeds/kernels/nuts etc. since they share similar storage proteins with high chance of cross reactivity.

2
50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

on March 11, 2012
at 11:47 AM

Rice is a grain. All grains are doing harm even if they are free of gluten. Cut out all grains. As well as legumes and dairy. That's the basics of the paleo diet !! Just eat real food: meat, fish, all the good fat and vegetables.

50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

(813)

on March 11, 2012
at 11:49 AM

If you want explanations, watch this talk by Robb Wolf: Blast from the Past http://mediasite.suny.edu/mediasite/SilverlightPlayer/Default.aspx?peid=36d261682e3f4bd19d2c2e4978eddf261d

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on March 11, 2012
at 07:16 PM

It's completely individual. Some can eat rice, some can't. If it doesn't work for you, stop eating it - no matter what some blog guru says. You have to find your own way in this. Yes, there's trial-and-error. Find out what works for you.

D63a9a7789b948a1e88647f6c0e504ca

(1453)

on March 12, 2012
at 01:45 AM

Paul Jaminet regards white rice as a safe starch, and I trust him a lot more than some absolute a priori assumption that it is incompatible with paleo.

50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

(813)

on March 11, 2012
at 12:31 PM

From minute 47 onwards Robb Wolf explains "prolamines" and YES, all grains have prolamines, even rice does.

50e94d7b6b01e6cb87889c6541adc90c

(813)

on March 12, 2012
at 08:29 AM

"If it doesn't work for you..." How do I find out? When my radiologist shows me the MRIs of an MSers brain with holes ... ????

1a512e7c9ebcb7842db8f3fad51d6710

(0)

on June 03, 2014
at 11:15 AM

I totally agree to cut out grain, dairy, and legumes, so I guess I have a lot in common with paleo although I'm vegan so I wouldn't eat the meat. I eat the veggies, avocados or brazil nuts occasionally for fats, and fruits and find that my body feels cleanest this way. I fasted and tried adding foods back in and testing this way realized that the grains, legumes, and dairy caused inflammation, brain fog, mucus, and mood swings as well as skin problems, lethargy, constipation, etc. I found Arnold Ehret's Mucusless diet system to be spot on- he pointed out that all grains cause mucus.

0
Medium avatar

on June 03, 2014
at 01:07 PM

Here are some foods you should eliminate for autoimmune version of the Paleo diet. All the other grains rice etc. pseudo grains like buck-wheat

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