5

votes

What about the Doctors..?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created June 06, 2011 at 12:27 PM

My question arises from 'The Quilt's' question here: http://paleohacks.com/questions/42332/does-what-you-learn-about-paleo-lifestyling-empower-you-to-control-your-healthcar#axzz1OUVOIzjF

The patients are frustrated - OK - But what is stopping more in the medical community to take the Path Dr Kruse has. Why do we hear of just a small handful of practising physicians who are even willing to 'listen' to an alternative theory. What stops them from doing their own research, and if they are, what stops them from going public. Is it something to do with their education at Med School where they are trained not to question? Is it lawsuits? Is it just money money money? What happened to the Hippocrates Oath?

We, the general population, are researching, experimenting with the little tools and data that we have - Why is the medical community, with all the endowments and facilities not apparently interested? Because they survive on 'Drug corporation money' does not seem to be the only satisfactory answer..

A727956fa3f943057c4edb08ad9e864e

(4183)

on June 08, 2011
at 07:49 PM

Aw? Downvote? I'm in Ireland btw so healthcare is different here. What training are you given on prevention? What percentage is that of your total training? I'm going to guess that diagnosing and prescribing form a large bulk of your coursework? Doctors that I know didn't study health in college, they studied illness.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 09:36 PM

i had to vote this down because it is completely false. We are trained to do this but the system penalizes us to do so. that is the paradox. Every time you hear Obama care its more of the same CW system that will keep you on statins and the USDA pyramid method of eating.

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on June 06, 2011
at 03:30 PM

One of my friends who is going into med school was talking to me about naturopathy which I'm going into and he said "It's really amazing what you guys do. It just goes to show you that only focusing on patient care and not treatments can go along ways." That got him quite the lecture.

A089b683ee0498f2b21b7edfa300e405

(3895)

on June 06, 2011
at 03:15 PM

Med schools should start to give business degrees then.. LOL ! "We, the consumer, seem to have the mistaken belief that Dr.'s owe us something for free out of the kindness of their hearts." Sure they don't owe us any kindness - but We the consumer/patient believes that we expect quality, well researched, professional treatment for the money we pay. Just like I dont expect the mechanic to teach me how to change oil, but I expect him not to put re-cycled oil in my car.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:46 PM

The system rewards taking care of sick patients. Type twos are annuities for MDs

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:45 PM

Jack that is why I think the QSelf mentality wil change medicine and why think dr Harris view won't have legs. His beauty is in keeping it simple and effecting N-1 but will have zero effect on organizations. Real change comes from effecting both simultaneously

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:41 PM

I agree with that completely

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:26 PM

I think Ron Rosedale said in a great speech - it is the business of medicine, not the science of medicine (paraphrased).

0dbd7154d909b97fe774d1655754f195

(16131)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:23 PM

Individually they may not "Survive on drug corporation money" but the medical industry does. Let's not pretend, it is an industry, a business like every other. We, the consumer, seem to have the mistaken belief that Dr.'s owe us something for free out of the kindness of their hearts. They don't. They are entitled to cash the checks willing consumers write to them. It's like going to a mechanic and expecting him/her to teach you how to change your oil yourself. Why would they ever do that? Business in America doesn't work that way.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 01:36 PM

I also added explanation to the levees last night

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9 Answers

8
D30ff86ad2c1f3b43b99aed213bcf461

on June 06, 2011
at 01:10 PM

I'd venture a guess that the threat of litigation is a chief motivator to treat "by the book".

4
F5f742cc9228eb5804114d0f3be4e587

(7660)

on June 06, 2011
at 06:02 PM

It's a complex mixture of stuff. Lawsuits are a real concern. I asked my doc hubby about it and it would conceivably be possible to frame a Paleo diet as falling outside the "Standard of Care," which is how juries decide fault and awards.

And don't forget. The research behind our way of eating is new and not proven yet. Of course we all think it's correct, but that doesn't mean it's been rigorously and blindly tested in large enough populations to be considered evidence-based. We need to focus on making that happen. That said, my husband says that everyone he knew in medical school knew that nutrition was a shadowy science full of potholes and that anyone who believed that stuff wasn't very bright.

Also, don't go to a doctor if you don't want a medical solution to your problem. It's like going to a car mechanic and asking him/her to bake a cake for you.

Someday they will all catch up. But it will take time. In the meantime, continue on your path and ignore all the idiots.

3
1568416ef28477d1fa29046218d83ddd

(6235)

on June 06, 2011
at 01:03 PM

Have you met pre-med students? They really, really need to be right. It is a hyperfocus, knowing what is right. Granted it seems to largely be created by the academic system they are part of and only occasionally be the result of underlying personality, but it seems silly to expect a habit built up during childhood (because you get to be a doctor by making good grades and being right) to suddenly disappear and for flexibility and openness to suddenly become a priority.

I can change, but it is almost unreasonable to expect it.

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on June 06, 2011
at 03:30 PM

One of my friends who is going into med school was talking to me about naturopathy which I'm going into and he said "It's really amazing what you guys do. It just goes to show you that only focusing on patient care and not treatments can go along ways." That got him quite the lecture.

2
Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18472)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:06 PM

An extremely important question. That's why, even though I do not agree with everything I've seen from Dr Davis, I definitely respect and appreciate his quest.

I have a close business associate whose wife has advanced cancer. They are very wealthy, so they can afford the 'best' healthcare on the planet. But why is it that they have hired a team of top medical professionals from Europe and are (in his words) "completely disconnected from American Medicine so we are free to explore many more possibilities". So sad that it has to be that way right now.

It's like there's an Iron Curtain around the medical establishment in this country. There's something inherently wrong with that at it's core and it's high time we had more qualified Docs step outside of the system and stop ignorantly turning a blind eye to the reality that everyone else seems to be able to see so clearly.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:45 PM

Jack that is why I think the QSelf mentality wil change medicine and why think dr Harris view won't have legs. His beauty is in keeping it simple and effecting N-1 but will have zero effect on organizations. Real change comes from effecting both simultaneously

2
66974b2cb291799dcd661b7dec99a9e2

(11121)

on June 06, 2011
at 01:44 PM

Ironically it was my doctor's "set in his ways" mentality that started me down the paleo path. I asked him to see why I was always feeling bloated after eating almost any meal, he brushed it off saying not to worry about it. Well that didn't sit well for me so I started doing my own research and n=1 experiments and I figured out it was because of the typical SAD I was eating at the time. Turns out I was also very close to being a type 2 diabetic as well (I started testing my own blood glucose). Once I educated myself on all things paleo I changed how I was eating, etc and now I do not bloat anymore, my blood glucose is back to normal, I lost almost 40 lbs and I have experienced a multitude of other benefits.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 02:46 PM

The system rewards taking care of sick patients. Type twos are annuities for MDs

1
B4e1fa6a8cf43d2b69d97a99dfca262c

(10255)

on June 06, 2011
at 03:19 PM

i used to work in a pharmacy here in canada and from that perspective i believe the biggest problem is that drug companies are able to buy a doctor's co-operation in the promotion of their products.

once a month each pharma would come to our little dispensery with lunch for us all and get stats about which doctors were writing scrips for their "new" product. we co-operated in return for discounts on purchases. the rep would then go to the local doctors knowing what "Ra Ra" speech they had to give. the doctors (who never receive much in the way of education about pharmaceuticals) make decisions based on the expert advice of the drug rep. and if they prescribe in suffient numbers they might just get invited to an educational convention in florida or arizona in the dead of canadian february.

and to be fair, no one is visiting the doctors promoting alternatives.

1
Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 01:34 PM

The real answer is CW is how we get paid. If you deviate or "get out of line" the system punishes you. I wrote a blog about it last night and not sure when I will publish it. The fact you brought it up here means you are already thinking about therefore I need to publish it sooner than later

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 01:36 PM

I also added explanation to the levees last night

1
332d9f75d1077abafff6887681f6b130

on June 06, 2011
at 12:39 PM

Many doctors are set in their ways. They have treated their patients the same way, and have responded to a set of symptoms the same way for years. They do this not because they're lazy, or because they don't know any better, but because they haven't been sued. People in America love to sue doctors, so when a doctor finds something that "works" they are very reluctant to change their ways. We have a lot of trouble at my work when we change a policy that requires doctors to modify their methods.

0
A727956fa3f943057c4edb08ad9e864e

on June 06, 2011
at 06:22 PM

Doctors are not trained nor advised to focus on prevention.

When all you have is hammers everything in the world is a nail. Hammers=pharmaceuticals.

I know and work with lots of doctors and I have to say they do develop a sort of 'expectation of human weakness' over their career. I'm sure some of them were young and idealistic and tried to implement lifestyle changes in their patients, and since 95% of all healthy eating plans fall by the wayside (yes, even paleo) they get cynical and want some guaranteed results.

Ed71ab1c75c6a9bd217a599db0a3e117

(25472)

on June 06, 2011
at 09:36 PM

i had to vote this down because it is completely false. We are trained to do this but the system penalizes us to do so. that is the paradox. Every time you hear Obama care its more of the same CW system that will keep you on statins and the USDA pyramid method of eating.

A727956fa3f943057c4edb08ad9e864e

(4183)

on June 08, 2011
at 07:49 PM

Aw? Downvote? I'm in Ireland btw so healthcare is different here. What training are you given on prevention? What percentage is that of your total training? I'm going to guess that diagnosing and prescribing form a large bulk of your coursework? Doctors that I know didn't study health in college, they studied illness.

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