2

votes

SIBO - I don't know what to eat anymore

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created December 25, 2012 at 12:41 PM

Okay, when I was on antibiotics and felt FABULOUS and for three weeks after I was eating really really well (except some macadamias). I was eating beef, bone broth and chicken meat.

About two and a half weeks after finishing antibiotics my gut flora grew back - especially the bad one. I know because I got sugar cravings all of the sudden. They were so bad - there was nothing I could do about them, they totally overcame me.

For example, yesterday I ate all the bad stuff that was given to me, all the chocolates I was supposed to give to others as gifts for Christmas and all the chocolates that my family was supposed to give to others as gifts. It has gotten so bad, I ripped the bag with flavored tea and picked all the dried fruit out of it.

Needless to say, I got a severe stomach ache that I am still dealing with.

So today I went back to all-meat diet.

Questions:

  1. What exactly does that SIBO bacteria eat (mine is methane producing)? Do they eat meat? Is there fiber in meat? Is there sugar in meat? Do I have to limit the amount of meat I eat each time?

  2. Why didn't sugar eating bacteria die from antibiotics? Is there a way to kill them completely?

  3. Could you please list foods that SIBO bacteria does not eat 100%? Even if it is only one or two items, I want to eat something that my bacteria cannot stand.

Thanks again.

88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

(10)

on March 05, 2013
at 12:40 AM

typo * ..flushes any bacteria out of the SMALL INTESTINE..

88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

(10)

on March 05, 2013
at 12:40 AM

small intestine which flushes any bacteria out of the diet - she said this should be taken for 2-3 months after the real antibiotics. I think taking a mild natural antibiotic after the pharma antibiotics as well to keep any bacterial growth minimal would be helpful too. I think for many people its at least a 3 month process. thoughts?

88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

(10)

on March 05, 2013
at 12:37 AM

Yeh fair enough. I think its very individualistic. Listening to some of what Dr Shiebecker from siboinfo.com, I have a feeling that one's overall must be optimized before taking antibiotics to overcome SIBO. What I mean is that * stomach-acid levels must be correct, * if hypothyroid, taking thyroid hormones to get thyroid up to par * been eating a healthy/supplemented diet for a couple of months already. I think figuring out what is best for you too: SCD/GAPS/ then after antibiotics she recommends another pharmaceutical drug which is like an antibiotics but it stimulates the movement of the

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 02:12 PM

I actually followed this guy's protocol and let me tell you something: his plan does not work for everyone. For example, ginger did more harm than good to my stomach.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 05:52 AM

I will find out soon.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 05:45 AM

I used Flagyl and Rifaximin.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 05:44 AM

I get sick from fermented foods. I have tried - it is not for me. Probiotics are not recommended for SIBO, in fact, Dr.Pimmentel warns about taking them. But thanks for answering :)

4bd4e2fe6a095663f80c69656936e487

(744)

on March 04, 2013
at 02:10 AM

How is your thyroid function? Hypothyroid people often have SIBO: http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/92/11/4180.full In the 1940s, people used symptoms, not lab tests, to diagnose hypothyroidism, and 40% benefited from thyroid supplementation. If we were to accept today's tests, only 2,5% is hypothyroid. So I would look for an old-school practitioner. This books explains how they saw thyroid in the 1940s: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1163825123/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i02?ie=UTF8&psc=1

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 28, 2012
at 09:17 AM

I have tried L-glutamine - it gives me a very bad reaction - racing heart, etc.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 28, 2012
at 09:16 AM

Probiotics are not recommended by many leading doctors, including Pimmentel.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 28, 2012
at 09:14 AM

I know how to cure it, it is just not available in my country :( So... the fight will go on.

Eed7dabde3d61910685845e04605267f

(2934)

on December 27, 2012
at 03:11 PM

(by the way I'm not sure about what Jaminet sahs int he context of dairy - I cut it out a year ago but while I'm having sympotoms with other foods etc am not even thinking of eating it, for better or worse (had chronic sinusis issues etc). Things can be uncertain with this life malarky...!

Eed7dabde3d61910685845e04605267f

(2934)

on December 27, 2012
at 03:11 PM

I would eat small amounts of the foods that may give a reaction, but otherwise get calories from teh foods where there doesn't seem to be one. I would also consider sourcing a biofilm disruptor such as Interfase... https://www.protherainc.com/prod/proddetail.asp?id=K-INTP It's difficult to say though of course, one can never really be in teh shoes of another, even if trying. Hope you get better.

Cfc7dee889a66db9cd76c4f348109294

(1652)

on December 27, 2012
at 03:53 AM

@VB. Sorry to hear it - I'm going on 6 years of this myself, but haven't tried any antibiotics or prokinetics yet. I was thinking that perhaps the stronger probiotic would work after the course of antibiotics. I can see where it's not perfect...

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 06:00 PM

It helped... but what do I do now? Fermented foods? Vegetables? Not sure.

3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 26, 2012
at 05:33 PM

Have you ever taken L-Glutamine? Some people SWEAR by it for cutting sugar cravings. Supposedly the glutamine binds to glucose receptors so you get that feeling of sugar satisfaction without actually consuming any carbohydrates.

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 26, 2012
at 08:19 AM

Roth - we said bad gut flora great back "2 and 1/2 weeks ago" not yesterday. So if nothing has improved, I would do the activated charcoal, and the probiotic.

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 26, 2012
at 08:18 AM

Fibre, - insoluble, like green leafy stuff

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 26, 2012
at 08:13 AM

if you are still farting and having smelly poo, the charcoal is going to absorb and reduce this.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 05:00 AM

How do you know they do not eat coconut?

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 04:59 AM

I actually have normal stomach acid and I digest meat pretty well. My problem is that I have started craving sweets.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 04:59 AM

I was on metronidazole, because my doctor told me that. Dr. Siebecker recommends SCD diet and GAPS. Probiotics can do more harm than good in people with impaired gut motility. In my case I have a complete mess because it has been going on for many years.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 04:56 AM

As for probiotics - most SIBO sufferers have impaired gut motility. Probiotics can complicate this matter even further. Probiotics are only recommended when SIBO bacteria is killed.

42cd0feeeda5fa2e2fe1c4fd8255073a

(1930)

on December 25, 2012
at 09:38 PM

Make sure it's raw ACV with "mother" in it. No no to the commercial filtered stuff. If you have low stomach acid, try drinking a diluted ACV drink about 15 minutes before your meal. This will help increase your ability to digest the meat

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:25 PM

Lots of fiber - in what form?

3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:24 PM

Apple Cider Vinegar

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:24 PM

Apple Cider Vinegar?

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:21 PM

What is ACV? Thanks for your answer.

3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 25, 2012
at 02:36 PM

If he ate the junk yesterday, I doubt charcoal will do anything now. Charcoal is supposed to be administered ASAP after consuming the offending substance. By time he poops out the charcoal, he'll probably feel better by then.

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 25, 2012
at 01:58 PM

oh, and some activated charcoal won't hurt either

  • F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

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8 Answers

2
3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 25, 2012
at 02:43 PM

What exactly does that SIBO bacteria eat (mine is methane producing)? Do they eat meat? Is there fiber in meat? Is there sugar in meat? Do I have to limit the amount of meat I eat each time?

SIBO bugs, like all bacteria, eats sugar. It's been my experience when making kefir that most species of bacteria don't discriminate too much when it comes to the source of sugar. I've used water kefir grains in raw milk and it worked just fine. I've used lactic-acid bacteria with coconut water and successfully made coconut kefir.

There is no "sugar" in meat, but there is glycogen, which disappears after the animal is killed. You should only limit the amount of meat you eat in one sitting if you have low stomach acid. If you have SIBO, you probably have low stomach acid. Have you tried marinating your meats?

Why didn't sugar eating bacteria die from antibiotics? Is there a way to kill them completely?

Antibiotic resistance or the fact that antibiotics, in an ideal situation, are only 99.9% effective.

Could you please list foods that SIBO bacteria does not eat 100%? Even if it is only one or two items, I want to eat something that my bacteria cannot stand.

  • Gymnema Sylvestre
  • Everything coconut
  • Fasting
  • I'm tempted to say ACV too

You can maybe try Nattokinase Serrapeptase to destroy the biofilm the SIBO bacteria have probably created in your GI tract.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:21 PM

What is ACV? Thanks for your answer.

3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:24 PM

Apple Cider Vinegar

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 05:00 AM

How do you know they do not eat coconut?

3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 26, 2012
at 05:33 PM

Have you ever taken L-Glutamine? Some people SWEAR by it for cutting sugar cravings. Supposedly the glutamine binds to glucose receptors so you get that feeling of sugar satisfaction without actually consuming any carbohydrates.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:24 PM

Apple Cider Vinegar?

42cd0feeeda5fa2e2fe1c4fd8255073a

(1930)

on December 25, 2012
at 09:38 PM

Make sure it's raw ACV with "mother" in it. No no to the commercial filtered stuff. If you have low stomach acid, try drinking a diluted ACV drink about 15 minutes before your meal. This will help increase your ability to digest the meat

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 28, 2012
at 09:17 AM

I have tried L-glutamine - it gives me a very bad reaction - racing heart, etc.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 04:59 AM

I actually have normal stomach acid and I digest meat pretty well. My problem is that I have started craving sweets.

1
88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

on March 04, 2013
at 09:18 AM

I think I've got SIBO too. Haven't had any tests done but I plan to soon.

I found this interesting post:

http://www.ibsgroup.org/forums/topic/102286-after-5-relapses-now-cured-heres-how/

Im a big fan of the PHD. I find the adding some rice and potatoes (safe starches) haven't caused me any apparent problems - in fact, i think they've helped me overall. Like Paul says, they are mainly digested in the colon rather than the Small Intestine.

Any thoughts with this?

88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

(10)

on March 05, 2013
at 12:40 AM

typo * ..flushes any bacteria out of the SMALL INTESTINE..

88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

(10)

on March 05, 2013
at 12:40 AM

small intestine which flushes any bacteria out of the diet - she said this should be taken for 2-3 months after the real antibiotics. I think taking a mild natural antibiotic after the pharma antibiotics as well to keep any bacterial growth minimal would be helpful too. I think for many people its at least a 3 month process. thoughts?

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 02:12 PM

I actually followed this guy's protocol and let me tell you something: his plan does not work for everyone. For example, ginger did more harm than good to my stomach.

88f6be7968132eb9d0710ae09033b886

(10)

on March 05, 2013
at 12:37 AM

Yeh fair enough. I think its very individualistic. Listening to some of what Dr Shiebecker from siboinfo.com, I have a feeling that one's overall must be optimized before taking antibiotics to overcome SIBO. What I mean is that * stomach-acid levels must be correct, * if hypothyroid, taking thyroid hormones to get thyroid up to par * been eating a healthy/supplemented diet for a couple of months already. I think figuring out what is best for you too: SCD/GAPS/ then after antibiotics she recommends another pharmaceutical drug which is like an antibiotics but it stimulates the movement of the

1
De50cc684c8a57f22c4dca66c977ebf2

on March 04, 2013
at 02:40 AM

Find the best cultured food you can find that has a diverse collection of a large number of probiotics. Example: high quality Kefir, Probiotic bottle shakes. Combine this with Florastor (expensive) Continue this therapy every day for 4-6 weeks and then ween off it. This should restore you back to normal. I also suggest some non-dairy probiotic blends (see if you can some fermented vegetables).

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 05:44 AM

I get sick from fermented foods. I have tried - it is not for me. Probiotics are not recommended for SIBO, in fact, Dr.Pimmentel warns about taking them. But thanks for answering :)

1
F6a3c668a0cae92df0cb7af18b4dd047

on March 04, 2013
at 01:34 AM

The best antibiotic i belive actually works is Rifaximin 3x day with neomycin 2x day for 14 days. very expensive, but effective, with scd.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on March 04, 2013
at 05:45 AM

I used Flagyl and Rifaximin.

1
7a6529ea25b655132fe58d793f95547a

(2030)

on December 27, 2012
at 07:56 PM

Perhaps getting in touch with one of these Ladies, they're both well respected in "real food" circles and they would each have no problem with your diet.

http://www.pamkilleen.com/

http://www.biodynamicwellness.com/about-us/

I still tinker around with diet a bit but I gave up trying to figure myself out and started working with a practitioner. I'm not totally better yet but I'm starting to feel like my old self. It helps me having someone to lean on who's knowledgeable about traditional foods.

From what I've come to understand getting healthy is just about giving the body plenty of energy and vitality so it can heal on it's own. This explains to me why people on a Peat, HED, or even a processed food diet can get themselves better.

I don't think there's a problem with your diet. The great thing about animal/sea foods is you get all the minerals in their proper proportions.

1
Eed7dabde3d61910685845e04605267f

on December 26, 2012
at 05:15 PM

You might be interested in this quote from Paul Jaminet in a podcast a while ago...

'...So usually elimination of a food that gives you trouble will help because it will somewhat starve the pathogen. But it doesn???t guarantee that the pathogen will be eliminated because these pathogens are very versatile, they don???t just metabolize one thing they can metabolize lots of others, so they can survive on other foods. If you go too extreme in elimination diets and eliminate whole classes of foods, like some people go zero carbs, or all meat diet or something. They may still be able to survive metabolizing protein, and it may be that you???re starving the good bacteria even more than the bad bacteria. And it can actually get worse and then when you reintroduce the food you???re even worse off because those bad things are more dominant. So usually the elimination diets help but it???s not guaranteed. '

http://chriskresser.com/episode-15-dr-paul-jaminet-on-chronic-infections-depression-more

Don't know if it will help but still...

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 06:00 PM

It helped... but what do I do now? Fermented foods? Vegetables? Not sure.

Eed7dabde3d61910685845e04605267f

(2934)

on December 27, 2012
at 03:11 PM

(by the way I'm not sure about what Jaminet sahs int he context of dairy - I cut it out a year ago but while I'm having sympotoms with other foods etc am not even thinking of eating it, for better or worse (had chronic sinusis issues etc). Things can be uncertain with this life malarky...!

Eed7dabde3d61910685845e04605267f

(2934)

on December 27, 2012
at 03:11 PM

I would eat small amounts of the foods that may give a reaction, but otherwise get calories from teh foods where there doesn't seem to be one. I would also consider sourcing a biofilm disruptor such as Interfase... https://www.protherainc.com/prod/proddetail.asp?id=K-INTP It's difficult to say though of course, one can never really be in teh shoes of another, even if trying. Hope you get better.

1
Cfc7dee889a66db9cd76c4f348109294

on December 26, 2012
at 02:02 AM

Which antibiotic were you on? According to this protocol: http://ndnr.com/web-articles/gastrointestinal/small-intestine-bacterial-overgrowth/, it depends on the kind of bacteria you have, which antibiotic is recommended. I'm looking into this myself. I'm unclear of whether lower carb or the diet Dr. Siebecker recommends, which includes some veggies and fruits, is best. Perhaps it depends on what your gut flora is made up of.

Maybe try fasting with some of the recommendations above along with a stronger probiotic?

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 04:59 AM

I was on metronidazole, because my doctor told me that. Dr. Siebecker recommends SCD diet and GAPS. Probiotics can do more harm than good in people with impaired gut motility. In my case I have a complete mess because it has been going on for many years.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 28, 2012
at 09:16 AM

Probiotics are not recommended by many leading doctors, including Pimmentel.

Cfc7dee889a66db9cd76c4f348109294

(1652)

on December 27, 2012
at 03:53 AM

@VB. Sorry to hear it - I'm going on 6 years of this myself, but haven't tried any antibiotics or prokinetics yet. I was thinking that perhaps the stronger probiotic would work after the course of antibiotics. I can see where it's not perfect...

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 28, 2012
at 09:14 AM

I know how to cure it, it is just not available in my country :( So... the fight will go on.

1
87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

on December 25, 2012
at 01:46 PM

IMO, you need some good bacteria - a probiotic ( I have Rochway probiotic punch ) Take some apple cider vinegar in water to increase your stomach acid. I wouldn't eat much for a couple of days.

The good bacteria in the probiotic will balance out the bad. The apple cider will help increase your stomach acid, which will also get the bad guys under control.

The symptoms you are experiencing are from the malabsorption of fats and carbs due to the bacteria. I would think meat would be the best thing to eat, plus lots of fibre until you are all sorted.

You should always take probiotics after antibiotics, for a month IMO.

3327924660b1e2f8f8fc4ca27fedf2b2

(2919)

on December 25, 2012
at 02:36 PM

If he ate the junk yesterday, I doubt charcoal will do anything now. Charcoal is supposed to be administered ASAP after consuming the offending substance. By time he poops out the charcoal, he'll probably feel better by then.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 25, 2012
at 04:25 PM

Lots of fiber - in what form?

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 26, 2012
at 08:19 AM

Roth - we said bad gut flora great back "2 and 1/2 weeks ago" not yesterday. So if nothing has improved, I would do the activated charcoal, and the probiotic.

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 26, 2012
at 08:13 AM

if you are still farting and having smelly poo, the charcoal is going to absorb and reduce this.

F5a0ddffcf9ef5beca864050f090a790

(15515)

on December 26, 2012
at 04:56 AM

As for probiotics - most SIBO sufferers have impaired gut motility. Probiotics can complicate this matter even further. Probiotics are only recommended when SIBO bacteria is killed.

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 26, 2012
at 08:18 AM

Fibre, - insoluble, like green leafy stuff

87b7d250ea30415ed4c1afd809f4053f

(968)

on December 25, 2012
at 01:58 PM

oh, and some activated charcoal won't hurt either

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