10

votes

Has anyone here tried Rami Nagel's "Cure Tooth Decay" protocol?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created June 12, 2011 at 10:37 PM

I just went to my first dentist appointment since my pregnancy and my dentist found 3 small caries, they are only on the surface, not deep at all. I've never had a cavity in my life so I'm thinking these were nutrition related at my body's expense for a healthy baby since I wasn't eating a nutrient dense diet until I was almost 9 months along.

Has anyone here successfully healed a cavity? I truly believe these are nutritional related, especially since I haven't had refined sugar in so long.

Before I buy the book is it basically just rehashing all the stuff we paleos and WAPF followers already know or should I invest in it? I know the protocol is lots of shellfish, offal, no fructose and a high dose of grassfed butter oil and fclo. Anyone know what else is on the protocol? I just don't want to waste 30 bucks on a book to tell me what I already know or doesn't work. Also I'm broke. haha

I'm currently taking 1 tablespoon of home made grassfed butter ghee I made from the Organic valley spring-summer pasture butter, 6 capsules of Cod liver oil, 5000iu Vitamin D, Prenatal vitamins (since I'm breastfeeding,) 1000mg Magnesium Malate, 1200mg Calcium citrate with D, magnesium, zinc, copper, manganese, and boron, 100mcg MK-7 K2, I now am eating a tin of bone-in sardines a day, committed to eating shellfish twice a week (mostly oysters,) grassfed beef once a day, liver (either chicken or beef) twice a week, plenty of kale cooked in coconut oil and ghee, bone broth daily, absolutely no grains or fruit, egg yolks, etc

B124653b19ee9dd438710a38954ed4a3

(1634)

on February 02, 2012
at 01:29 PM

How much xylitol do you use and do you have an update for us on how it's gone since June?

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on July 31, 2011
at 08:57 AM

I'd recommend a toothpaste w/p glycerine

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on July 31, 2011
at 02:14 AM

Yeah, that's basically the same protocol. It all comes from the WAPF school. It's been a while since I posted this, and I combined the powers of vitamin A, D, K2 (mk-4) with a xylitol and cleaning regemin by Dr. Ellie Phillips and at my last appointment the dentist decided not to drill me. So I think that was a good combo. I definetely think the xylitol was a big component in that, though since I had some mouth dryness/acidity issues.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 09:10 PM

he's pushing the green pastures or blue ice brand. Carlson makes a fine cod liver oil. :-)

8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 08:37 PM

Thank you, Cliff, for bringing that up. I wasn't thinking about the vit. A. I do have cod liver oil that I've given her, but I'll admit it, I have slacked off the most with that. I just won't buy what the dude pushes because I'm a stubborn squirrel. :) I forget that my kids don't eat liver like I do.

2f54dbe892ec89b12d1db686568e885a

(919)

on June 13, 2011
at 07:53 PM

oil pulling, and avoid glycerine based toothpastes which prevent the teeth from remineralising themselves

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on June 13, 2011
at 07:49 PM

Cod liver oil is good for the vitamin A. Your daughter has a good diet but her vitamin A is probably just the RDA. You can get 10,000iu vit A supplements derived from cod liver from whole foods(probably other places) for cheap, has a little bit of soy oil but its barely anything maybe half a gram if even that. VIt A, D and K all work together.

8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:47 PM

Oh! I just remembered something I saw on a mummy show.. They were examining a mummy from South America somewhere, and when they got to his teeth, they said he obviously lived on the coast and ate a marine diet, as he had *no* dental caries. (Sushi tonight!)

8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:42 PM

I use The Natural Dentist "Cavity Zapper" for her. I get it at whole foods. I only use a tiny bit, though. I want to use a powder, but there's nooo way she'd do it. For myself, I use a powder I get at a whole foods-ish store. :)

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:24 PM

I'm going to try the xylitol. I'm already eating mostly primal so it seems like that's the only thing I'm not doing right now. Do you use a special tooth paste or a powder/ tooth soap?

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 13, 2011
at 04:18 PM

Skip the calcium supplements. Just boil or roast your eggshells. Use a coffee grinder or some other way of pulverizing them and combine it in food or drink. That's the best calcium supplement there is.

4781cf8ae1bfcb558dfb056af17bea94

(4359)

on June 13, 2011
at 04:16 PM

He claims a baking soda rinse is bad because it inhibits oral biofilms - anybody have any references for this? I use an oral calcium/magnesium/potassium carbonate rinse to raise the ph of my mouth when I feel a cavity forming. It seems to work but I wonder what side effects there might be...

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:34 PM

I'll admit that I've fallen into the whole "I eat perfectly, stay very fit, sleep well, etc so I'll never fall ill" thinking. It's good to read sober articles like Masterjohn's to keep you grounded

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:32 PM

I feel the same after listening to him being interviewed. By of tinfoil round the head.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:11 PM

That was interesting. Thanks, Ben.

66974b2cb291799dcd661b7dec99a9e2

(11121)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:31 AM

As for how long you should wait, that is your personal choice, whatever feels right for you. Tooth re mineralization is a slow process.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:29 AM

yeah, I'm finding a new dentist. This one was telling my husband he has 7 cavities. We just moved. It was those tiny surface kind they find on those digital xrays. I'm sure they're real cavities but I can't imagine they're incurable.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:25 AM

You might enjoy this, brandy new: http://www.westonaprice.org/blogs/cmasterjohn/

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 01:41 AM

Haha I believe that. I ate whole grains for 25 years and never had a cavity until I right now after I had my first child, which is common because those little parasites just suck the life out of ya! I'm going to try the Dr. Ellie system that Josh suggested. It seems a lot more "sciencey." hahaha

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on June 13, 2011
at 01:15 AM

I was WAP for five years before paleo so I'm well acquainted with Rami's work. Too me his stuff is borderline spacedoctor-speak. I'm willing to go out on a limb with a lot of stuff, and a lot of what he says is just straight WAP stuff like phytic acid, etc. But I heard an interview with him and he seriously came off like a wacko. I don't use toothpaste, I go with 1:3 salt:baking soda everyday. Haven't had a carie in over ten years. I'm 31.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:29 AM

Also how long do you think I should wait? It doesn't hurt or anything? All three are pretty small. I actually have a sneaking suspicion that they were already healing from starting paleo/wapf 6+ months ago.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:27 AM

Thanks. I'll definitely read it.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:27 AM

Thanks. And it worked for you?

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 12, 2011
at 11:28 PM

I have insurance. I just want to try healing it before I let them drill in to my teeth. Like I said, I've never had a cavity before.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 12, 2011
at 11:24 PM

Just so everyone knows. I'm only going to wait a month to see if they get smaller. If nothing works I will get the dental treatment, I'm not against SOME conventional medicine.

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7 Answers

best answer

3
66974b2cb291799dcd661b7dec99a9e2

(11121)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:24 AM

This is what I follow: http://askdrellie.blogspot.com/ Seems to work well, have reversed a few smaller cavities. I also take vit D, K2 and minerals. Can take more than 30 days to heal a cavity though.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:27 AM

Thanks. I'll definitely read it.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:29 AM

Also how long do you think I should wait? It doesn't hurt or anything? All three are pretty small. I actually have a sneaking suspicion that they were already healing from starting paleo/wapf 6+ months ago.

4781cf8ae1bfcb558dfb056af17bea94

(4359)

on June 13, 2011
at 04:16 PM

He claims a baking soda rinse is bad because it inhibits oral biofilms - anybody have any references for this? I use an oral calcium/magnesium/potassium carbonate rinse to raise the ph of my mouth when I feel a cavity forming. It seems to work but I wonder what side effects there might be...

66974b2cb291799dcd661b7dec99a9e2

(11121)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:31 AM

As for how long you should wait, that is your personal choice, whatever feels right for you. Tooth re mineralization is a slow process.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 12:27 AM

Thanks. And it worked for you?

best answer

2
8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:00 PM

My daughter has teeth that were never completely mineralized in utero, so she has holes in her front teeth. (They started crumbling when she was about 18 months, 4 years ago) One doctor said we needed to strap her down and fill them ASAP..I just didn't feel right about that, so I decided to wait it out and try some other things. I bought Nagel's book, and yeah, I'm with some of the others- while some of his advice really does make sense, the way he presents it turns me off. What he recommends is basically eating primal, focusing on a lot of good fat to help use those fat-soluble vitamins.

Anyway, I bought birch xylitol (NOT corn) online and put it in my daughter's water at night. People say xylitol is not paleo and they don't like it, (And Nagel is against it, too) but.. the holes didn't get bigger in her teeth until I stopped the xylitol for a couple months when we ran out and I forgot to reorder. She wasn't eating paleo at all during this time, BTW, and ate a lot of sugary stuff. Took her to another dentist, 6 months ago, who said the xylitol stabilized her teeth.

Since then, she's been eating paleo, and I give her vitamin D and vitamin K2-MK4. She also eats raw sashimi about once a week. And the xylitol in the water at night. And plenty of grass-fed beef and Kerrygold butter. I'm not buying the cod liver oil, or the butter oil that he pushes throughout the whole damn book. We have an appointment the day after tomorrow, so I'm very anxious to see what the dentist says.

Also, I too think you got your first cavity while pregnant because your body is diverting your mineral stores to your baby. My daughter with the hole-y teeth was my second baby, and I got pregnant with her very soon after having my son, so I didn't have enough time (or the knowledge, then) to replenish my nutrient stores before/during my pregnancy. My guess is that your baby's teeth are gonna be just fine, but keep eating how you eat and supplementing so you get all good n' replenished. Maybe try some Vit. K2-mk4, that's what the "activator x" is that he talks about in the book. But instead of telling you that, he just pushes the butter/cod liver oil. Hopefully my answer helps a little..sorry it's so long-winded. It's just a very important subject to me, considering my baby girl's teeth.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:24 PM

I'm going to try the xylitol. I'm already eating mostly primal so it seems like that's the only thing I'm not doing right now. Do you use a special tooth paste or a powder/ tooth soap?

8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 08:37 PM

Thank you, Cliff, for bringing that up. I wasn't thinking about the vit. A. I do have cod liver oil that I've given her, but I'll admit it, I have slacked off the most with that. I just won't buy what the dude pushes because I'm a stubborn squirrel. :) I forget that my kids don't eat liver like I do.

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on June 13, 2011
at 07:49 PM

Cod liver oil is good for the vitamin A. Your daughter has a good diet but her vitamin A is probably just the RDA. You can get 10,000iu vit A supplements derived from cod liver from whole foods(probably other places) for cheap, has a little bit of soy oil but its barely anything maybe half a gram if even that. VIt A, D and K all work together.

8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:47 PM

Oh! I just remembered something I saw on a mummy show.. They were examining a mummy from South America somewhere, and when they got to his teeth, they said he obviously lived on the coast and ate a marine diet, as he had *no* dental caries. (Sushi tonight!)

8a4ce6a9e1ab27616920b828df08b259

(354)

on June 13, 2011
at 05:42 PM

I use The Natural Dentist "Cavity Zapper" for her. I get it at whole foods. I only use a tiny bit, though. I want to use a powder, but there's nooo way she'd do it. For myself, I use a powder I get at a whole foods-ish store. :)

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 09:10 PM

he's pushing the green pastures or blue ice brand. Carlson makes a fine cod liver oil. :-)

D10ca8d11301c2f4993ac2279ce4b930

(5242)

on July 31, 2011
at 08:57 AM

I'd recommend a toothpaste w/p glycerine

B124653b19ee9dd438710a38954ed4a3

(1634)

on February 02, 2012
at 01:29 PM

How much xylitol do you use and do you have an update for us on how it's gone since June?

1
5e36f73c3f95eb4ea13a009f4936449f

(8280)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:26 AM

If it is small, wait (I'm surprised yours wants to drill now actually). My dentists always wanted to wait till it was larger because the smaller ones don't always take a filling well (they have to drill out a lot of good tooth).

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:29 AM

yeah, I'm finding a new dentist. This one was telling my husband he has 7 cavities. We just moved. It was those tiny surface kind they find on those digital xrays. I'm sure they're real cavities but I can't imagine they're incurable.

0
775958bf10f329f6f4808554779a7803

on July 30, 2011
at 06:12 PM

You might look into this. I also am pregnant and want to take care of my teeth naturally. It started years ago when my sister broke her back in a car crash. The doctor we first saw only wanted to do surgery and said she would never be "normal" again. So we went for a second opionin. We were in couraged to let her back heal naturally. After a few months she was up and walking around fine. Even now years later she is fine. So I was telling my mid-wife this and she told me about how the body even "repairs" the teeth naturally. She said it can be done with Cod Liver Oil & Ghee. So I got on-line and started searching. My best searches came up when I put in - cod liver and ghee for cavities. You might try that....

This is one website that I found helpful. Good Luck!!! http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2009/03/reversing-tooth-decay.html

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on July 31, 2011
at 02:14 AM

Yeah, that's basically the same protocol. It all comes from the WAPF school. It's been a while since I posted this, and I combined the powers of vitamin A, D, K2 (mk-4) with a xylitol and cleaning regemin by Dr. Ellie Phillips and at my last appointment the dentist decided not to drill me. So I think that was a good combo. I definetely think the xylitol was a big component in that, though since I had some mouth dryness/acidity issues.

0
E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on June 13, 2011
at 01:23 PM

-Eat low sugar -Supplement Vit A(retinol), Vit D and Vit k2 mk4. -Get 100% of the rest of your nutrition through food sources(use something like fitday or cronometer to actively track)

Follow these guidelines and they will most likely heal.

0
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on June 13, 2011
at 03:36 AM

I bought his book and then saw some of the interviews he did online. He seemed like a New Age flake, so, right or wrong, I didn't take him seriously after that.

667f6c030b0245d71d8ef50c72b097dc

(15976)

on June 13, 2011
at 02:32 PM

I feel the same after listening to him being interviewed. By of tinfoil round the head.

0
116d23135449332a8bf9106220cf632b

on June 12, 2011
at 11:27 PM

If it's a small cavity it might be able to wait awhile until you have insurance. I waited 1+ years on a small one with no harm done and got it filled a few weeks ago. FYI they billed the insurance company $175. I don't know if there's anything you can do to stop the growth but I'm upvoting so hopefully a dentist will see your question.

1da74185531d6d4c7182fb9ee417f97f

(10904)

on June 12, 2011
at 11:28 PM

I have insurance. I just want to try healing it before I let them drill in to my teeth. Like I said, I've never had a cavity before.

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