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What's better for you? Raw cow milk or coconut milk?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created March 29, 2011 at 3:48 PM

What would be better to drink: raw grass-fed cow's milk or coconut milk? Nutrition-wise, I'm guessing cow's milk would be better for you, but if you're sensitive to that, then I'd guess coconut milk would be better, but not as nutritious?

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on March 30, 2011
at 10:26 AM

rotflamo, Jack. There is no doubt that the human genome evolved with the fuel of muscle, offal and probably blood of ruminants. So yes, "beef" (meaning grazing ruminant in this case) is appropriate for us to eat. Yes, blood is appropriate for cheetahs. Milk, not so much. I'm sure you're clever enough to see the obvious difference.

Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18452)

on March 29, 2011
at 08:03 PM

mark sisson put out a decent article on this idea of dairy/insulin. i don't trust dr davis' viewpoints on dairy and especially butter making people fat.

E2b9c679315c7c9c7265783dde89f350

(1303)

on March 29, 2011
at 07:41 PM

The nutrients are different- I personally feel better on raw cow's milk than I do on coconut milk, but others have different experiences. If you have access to both, then I'd try them both- but not at the same time or you won't be able to separate out your body's reactions.

84666a86108dee8d11cbbc85b6382083

(2399)

on March 29, 2011
at 05:29 PM

"Eliminate. Reintroduce. Figure it out for yourself." TM.

Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18452)

on March 29, 2011
at 05:09 PM

yah but we also eat butter (from that same milk meant for another species) and cream. also, what about steak. that is meat of the same animal. is that meant for us to eat? because we sure eat it. when a cheetah chases down an antelope and bites into it and drinks it's blood, is that blood meant for the cheetah? it surely is nourished by it, as are many humans that are nourished by cow's milk, because we can drink it. the question is... "should we?"

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7 Answers

7
1471beca8e3adff4ae2f89d10e5f7acb

on March 29, 2011
at 04:12 PM

Eliminate. Reintroduce. Figure it out for yourself.

Tried to do raw, grass-fed dairy...it's delicious and nutritious. But I figured out pretty quick that it's Not For Me. I'm not worried about the loss of nutrition...that's what liver and collard greens are for.

84666a86108dee8d11cbbc85b6382083

(2399)

on March 29, 2011
at 05:29 PM

"Eliminate. Reintroduce. Figure it out for yourself." TM.

2
Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18452)

on March 29, 2011
at 05:25 PM

both are potentially very healthy fats, but they each have their own strengths as a food source.

raw cow's milk has a myriad of good fatty acids and valuable proteins. it is a whole food that you could actually live off of for a time if you had to. (provided that you are not highly allergic to it)

coconut milk is a very nutritious liquid pressed from the meat of the coconut that contains the healthy MCTs. The lauric acid is very good for you, and the fats can be used for energy immediately, since they are metabolised differently than LCFAs. Coconut fat is also very beneficial for your cardiovascular health, and the myristic acids in it have a host of positive effects that could be a whole post in itself.

obviously, this comes down to personal choice and how your body responds to either or both. personally, i drink both, for all the reasons noted above. but if you have a personal issue with the cows milk, or you break out into a rash from coconut products, then that's on you to decide.

1
06d21b99c58283ce575e36c4ecd4a458

(9948)

on March 29, 2011
at 06:15 PM

Dr Davis has posted regarding the insulin response to dairy.

Dairy products, especially milk, whey, and yogurt, are insulin secretagogues: they stimulate pancreatic release of insulin. The effect is likely due to amino acids and/or polypeptides in dairy products. (The effect is less prominent with cheese.) By conventional wisdom, this may be a good thing, since the excess insulin will blunt the glucose rise after consumption. However, in my book, this is not such a good thing, since most of us have tired, beaten, overworked pancreatic beta cells from our decades of carbohydrate overconsumption. I fear that the effect of dairy products just take us a bit closer to beta cell failure: diabetes.

http://www.heartscanblog.org/2011/03/insulin-secretagogue.html

I love my cream, but I feel much much better when I consume no dairy.

If you must have something that looks like cow's milk, then drink the coconut milk.
I like my coconut...as an oil.

Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18452)

on March 29, 2011
at 08:03 PM

mark sisson put out a decent article on this idea of dairy/insulin. i don't trust dr davis' viewpoints on dairy and especially butter making people fat.

1
Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

on March 29, 2011
at 04:13 PM

Keep in mind that coconut milk really isn't milk at all. It's the fluid pressed from the flesh of a nut while milk is an animal product meant for the young of that species.

It really opens up a long discussion on the biological appropriateness (or lack) of humans drinking the milk of another species.

There are strong opinions on the topic from the various corners the traditional diet triangle (traditional/WAPF, paleo, primal).

While dairy is certainly not paleo, some appear to tolerate it just fine, some appear to even benefit from it, but for many it seems to trigger inflammation, gut irritation (inflammation), acne (inflammation)....

Eecc48184707bc26bce631485b5b7e34

(4764)

on March 30, 2011
at 10:26 AM

rotflamo, Jack. There is no doubt that the human genome evolved with the fuel of muscle, offal and probably blood of ruminants. So yes, "beef" (meaning grazing ruminant in this case) is appropriate for us to eat. Yes, blood is appropriate for cheetahs. Milk, not so much. I'm sure you're clever enough to see the obvious difference.

Af1d286f0fd5c3949f59b4edf4d892f5

(18452)

on March 29, 2011
at 05:09 PM

yah but we also eat butter (from that same milk meant for another species) and cream. also, what about steak. that is meat of the same animal. is that meant for us to eat? because we sure eat it. when a cheetah chases down an antelope and bites into it and drinks it's blood, is that blood meant for the cheetah? it surely is nourished by it, as are many humans that are nourished by cow's milk, because we can drink it. the question is... "should we?"

0
8508fec4bae4a580d1e1b807058fee8e

on May 12, 2012
at 06:23 PM

My hubby and I had issues with pasteurized dairy giving us acne in general so we avoid it at home, and limit it when eating out. EXCEPT pasteurized butter, ghee, and heavy cream don't give us any issues.

We did 30 day dairy elimination to test and reintroduced slowly in quantity and variety and that is what I would recommend.

We also tested negative for casein sensitivity. My husband is lactose tolerant. I'm lactose intolerant. However, please see: http://paleohacks.com/questions/40047/gluten-and-casein-cross-reactions-successful-reintroduction-of-dairy#axzz1ugAcq3PP

Raw milk should be started slowly like any raw dairy product because your system needs to adjust to the new probiotics (quantity and species):

You only go to the next level if you have no issues at the current level!

If you have issues you wait a few weeks and retest.

1/4 cup - Day 1 & 2

1/2 cup - Day 2 & 3

3/4 cup - Day 3 & 4

1 cup - Day 4 & 5

We rarely drink more then 1 cup of raw milk/daily because we consume such a variety of animal and plant foods.

There is a threshold so usually 1 serving of pasteurized dairy doesn't cause the acne but successive servings over several days does cause us to break out ...

We've done up to 4 servings of raw dairy/day chosen from a variety - yogurt, sour cream, fresh cream, heavy cream, milk, cheese, etc with no ISSUES. We haven't tried more then that because then we wouldn't have room to eat our seafood, meat, and produce!

See also http://paleohacks.com/questions/24852/raw-milk-vs-pasteurized-milk-the-fiery-debate#axzz1ugAcq3PP

The best article on raw milk I've seen so far! http://chriskresser.com/raw-milk-reality-is-raw-milk-dangerous

Books:

The Raw Milk Revolution: Behind America's Emerging Battle Over Food Rights by David E. Gumpert and Joel F. Salatin

The Untold Story of Milk, Revised and Updated: The History, Politics and Science of Nature's Perfect Food: Raw Milk from Pasture-Fed Cows by Dr. Ron Schmid, ND

The Raw Truth About Milk by Dr. William Campbell Douglass II, MD

I used to be terrified of raw milk until November 2011 when I started to drink it regularly.

Background: My mother was unable to nurse me due to severe medical issues, and cow's milk was hard to digest, so my first food was goat's milk. I drank pasteurized cow dairy later (sadly mostly low fat) products from an early age until age 26 and suffered gas. From age 11-26, I had acne which showed no improvement on various creams and antibiotics (now know the worst choice). Doctors said it "couldn't be dietary!"

At age 26,I self-diagnosed myself with lactose intolerance and switched to almond milk and using Lactaid (lactase enzyme supplement) for the occasional dairy. My acne disappeared and friends and family noticed. I never had issues with butter so ate it my entire life because all fake butters and margarines disgusted me.

I started low-carb reducing grains at age 31, then Paleo at age 32. My eczema went away on Paleo. 1 month after dairy elimination while supporting my husband on Paleo (he was going through a very rough time with gluten and autoimmune issues), we both reintroduced dairy - this time 100% whole pastured grass-fed but pasteurized.

After the Weston Price Foundation conference meeting nearly 1000+ people consuming raw dairy their entire life extolling it's virtues, reading the literature, and visiting the raw dairy farms we decided n=1000 was too big to ignore. We realized raw milk was more natural then almond milk.

Unlike in the past, as a child when I ate processed ice cream and felt addicted (perhaps opiate receptors, sugar, and gluten), the raw dairy I don't feel addicted to it. Whether I have 1-3 servings a day, I don't want anymore. When we travel and limit dairy (because it's pasteurized) we miss 2 things the most - raw dairy and fermented veggies!

We have come to believe the more probiotic species the better for the immune system and the best way to collect a wide variety is through raw dairy since fermented vegetables don't have that diversity. Even here on PH, kefir is acknowledge to have the most species! http://paleohacks.com/questions/73151/which-has-a-greater-number-of-species-and-quantity-of-probiotics-fermented-vegg#axzz1m8YbEQOt

Since raw dairy helps with allergies, which is an overreaction of the immune system - perhaps it might help with autoimmune issues too?

It is my understanding almost all the milk, dairy studies were done with pasteurized forms (often lowfat which is oxidized), so to use that data to say dairy is problematic maybe as scientific as saying coconut oil is problematic because they used hydrogenated versions in some studies.

I know raw dairy is a pain to find depending on where you live so that is why many have just written it off - but is that throwing out the baby with the bathwater? According to 23andme DNA results I'm supposed to be lactose intolerant and my husband is lactose tolerant but we are doing great on raw dairy.

Another controversy is insulin and cancer with dairy. The Maasai are drinking LITERS per day and don't have insulin resistance and cancer (which are alleged for dairy) and what about babies who drink milk- are they insulin resistant? Now I know some have said that babies are growing and milk is appropriate for them but that doesn't change the fact that some ancestral populations have consumed fermented dairy products - milk, yogurt, etc.

Of course milk is not Paleolithic, but then neither are nightshades and possibly not even coconut. Yet there are intolerances and allergies to all of the above. Not everyone has a tropical genetic ancestry, those from cold climates or from an inland route would not have had access to coconut. http://paleohacks.com/questions/1405/why-are-coconuts-considered-paleo#axzz1m8YbEQOt

0
B9cc28905ec54389c47cde031d709703

on March 29, 2011
at 07:54 PM

I eat a little coconut oil on occasion (2-3 times a week) not over 3 tablespoons though for the oil and not more than half a cup for the milk, if you eat enough of it it will possibly make you vomit and shit for a good day as it has a detox effect, odd thing is through all the vomiting (once) shitting (multiple x) you feel strangly good. I prefer the milk. I ate about half a jar of coconut oil to induce that effect.

Even if your sensitive to milk sometimes biting a peice of leather for a couple off days and letting your body adapt will do the trick. I know many people who can't drink milk off and on but who can drink it if they drink it regularly.

0
Bb1ba0d71083ceaecd3a3b405a977454

on March 29, 2011
at 04:28 PM

I just started my second dairy elimination 6 days ago (tried it for 10 days in January and since have only used cream and butter). I have MS and don't want to mess with any autoimmunity issues so I am off the dairy train.

I use coconut milk now for my coffee and berries. If I had no autoimmunity issues, then most likely I'd use cream and butter. Maybe raw milk too, but we can't get it here in Canada unless I go out and buy a cow.

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