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Raw Milk Yogurt for Autoimmune Disease

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created June 23, 2011 at 12:46 AM

Apologies if this is redundant. I've seen questions that come close to addressing this issue but nothing directly... So I'm interested in exploring "zero carb" raw yogurt as a way to treat my health conditions (IBS and ankylosing spondylitis). I'm familiar with most of the arguments against dairy for autoimmunity but what about yogurt made from grass-fed, raw milk that's allowed to ferment for >24 hours (essentially lactose-free)? Could this still exacerbate autoimmunity or could it be considered a good way to build some quality gut flora? If worth trying, is there a potential "adjustment period"? Thanks!

8508fec4bae4a580d1e1b807058fee8e

(6244)

on December 04, 2011
at 04:49 PM

Do you have a reference for fermented veggies having more diverse bacteria than yogurt?

93b5fc3a75c76817eed3f43831471cec

(140)

on July 19, 2011
at 11:54 AM

Do you mean heat the milk to boiling? Doing so definitely gives a thicker yogurt, but then the milk won't be raw! True raw milk yogurt is made by heating the milk to no more than around blood heat. However, IIRC some including Peter at Hyperlipid consider that the fermentation process 'unpasteurizes' pasteurized/heated milk products, ie it changes the denatured proteins back to a less problematic form.

1ccc0b0b7a756cd42466cef8f450d0cb

(1801)

on June 27, 2011
at 05:48 PM

Thanks for the detailed answer, permiechickie! It seems like the scientific community is still up in the air over the whole A1/A2 thing but for what it's worth my local raw milk farm uses Jerseys.

2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on June 23, 2011
at 03:16 PM

What I mean is if you don't kill off the already present bacteria (by using raw milk) they may also multiply along with the starter, whether yoghurt or culture.

2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on June 23, 2011
at 03:15 PM

What I mean is if you don't kill off the already present bacteria (by using raw milk) they may also multiply along with the starter culture.

1ccc0b0b7a756cd42466cef8f450d0cb

(1801)

on June 23, 2011
at 11:48 AM

Thanks, Dean. I had planned to heat it as I've heard that doing so gives the yogurt a better, more solid consistency. What do you mean when you say that the bacteria cultures will not be as controlled? Are you not envisioning the use of a starter culture (I was planning to start this using yogurt from a previous batch).

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on June 23, 2011
at 10:53 AM

Jersey and Gurnsey milk also contain A1 casein.

6869a1f2294b3a717a53645589a91d18

(1689)

on June 23, 2011
at 03:37 AM

"is there a potential "adjustment period"?" I think there is a potential adjustment period for anybody with gut flora issues attempting something meant to modulate gut flora. I mean, even 'good' actions could still possibly make you temporarily feel bad. Hard to know i think.

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4 Answers

1
776bb678d88f7194b0fa0e5146df14f0

on June 23, 2011
at 03:08 AM

Regarding your question as to whether this is a good way to build gut flora, I have mixed views on yogurt in this respect. If you like yogurt, eat it because you like it. Fermented vegetables like sauerkraut, kimchi, beet kvass and so on might have more diverse bacterial populations than yogurt from what I have read, although this could be more a criticism of commerically produced yogurt and not applicable to raw grassfed yogurt, which I'm assuming is either homemade or very artisanal.

If you just really want to eat yogurt, as a previous poster said, fermentation will break down the lactose but won't reduce the proteins. Mass produced cow milk does seem to have inflammatory proteins that affect people with varying degrees of severity.

It's harder to get, but sheep and goat milk, as well as milk from older breeds of cows, have different casein proteins than most mass produced cow milk. The difference comes down to A1 vs. A2 casein. Human breast milk, goat milk, sheep milk, camel milk, and traditional breeds of cows have A2 casein. Mark Sisson had a good post on dairy, and he talks about this issue a little:

Milk proteins are made up of different beta-caseins, which vary between cow breeds. There are two main categories of beta-casein: A1 and A2, each with different effects. A1 cows (Holsteins and Friesians) produce A1 beta-caseins, which release an opioid-like chemical upon digestion. This chemical, called beta-casomorphin-7 (BCM7), is a protein fragment that figures into the joint pains, digestive issues, and leaky gut symptoms that detractors typically blame on just casein. A2 cows (Jerseys and Gurnseys), on the other hand, produce A2 beta-casein, which has been vindicated. Raw, pastured milk tends to come from Jersey and Gurnsey cows; Holsteins and Friesians produce far more milk and so are used by conventional, factory dairy farmers. The Masai, for example, have A2 cattle.

A more definitive source is "The Devil in the Milk," a book that I read a sample of and have been meaning to read in its entirety. I personally have switched to goat milk yogurt for my needs. When I was a baby I was allergic to cow milk and my mother couldn't produce enough breast milk, so I drank goat milk for my babyhood. The cow milk allergy went away as I grew older, but I figure avoiding cow milk is probably safer for me.

0bc6cbb653cdc5e82400f6da920f11eb

(19235)

on June 23, 2011
at 10:53 AM

Jersey and Gurnsey milk also contain A1 casein.

1ccc0b0b7a756cd42466cef8f450d0cb

(1801)

on June 27, 2011
at 05:48 PM

Thanks for the detailed answer, permiechickie! It seems like the scientific community is still up in the air over the whole A1/A2 thing but for what it's worth my local raw milk farm uses Jerseys.

8508fec4bae4a580d1e1b807058fee8e

(6244)

on December 04, 2011
at 04:49 PM

Do you have a reference for fermented veggies having more diverse bacteria than yogurt?

1
2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on June 23, 2011
at 01:31 AM

Fermentation will replace lactose with bacteria, but I'm not aware that it will reduce the proteins like casein, which may be more problematic. I don't know if there are reliable comparisons of raw and pasteurized dairy proteins, but I don't think the difference will be huge. Could this still exacerbate autoimmunity? Probably. It may depend on individual tolerance.

Yoghurt fermented for 24 hours is part of the GAPS diet for building a healthy gut flora and, depending on tolerance, is introduced in small growing amounts starting with a teaspoon daily. With raw organic unprocessed milk, heating it before fermentation is not necessary (it is for normal milk). The bacteria cultures will, however, not be as controlled.

2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on June 23, 2011
at 03:15 PM

What I mean is if you don't kill off the already present bacteria (by using raw milk) they may also multiply along with the starter culture.

2870a69b9c0c0a19a919e54cb3a62137

(1520)

on June 23, 2011
at 03:16 PM

What I mean is if you don't kill off the already present bacteria (by using raw milk) they may also multiply along with the starter, whether yoghurt or culture.

1ccc0b0b7a756cd42466cef8f450d0cb

(1801)

on June 23, 2011
at 11:48 AM

Thanks, Dean. I had planned to heat it as I've heard that doing so gives the yogurt a better, more solid consistency. What do you mean when you say that the bacteria cultures will not be as controlled? Are you not envisioning the use of a starter culture (I was planning to start this using yogurt from a previous batch).

93b5fc3a75c76817eed3f43831471cec

(140)

on July 19, 2011
at 11:54 AM

Do you mean heat the milk to boiling? Doing so definitely gives a thicker yogurt, but then the milk won't be raw! True raw milk yogurt is made by heating the milk to no more than around blood heat. However, IIRC some including Peter at Hyperlipid consider that the fermentation process 'unpasteurizes' pasteurized/heated milk products, ie it changes the denatured proteins back to a less problematic form.

0
Medium avatar

on December 17, 2013
at 04:17 AM

I think yogurt by itself is not sufficient enough to replace the gut flora in the diet. The problem with yogurt and most other fermented foods is that it is very unlikely that the fermented microorganisms will survive the gastric juices in the stomach. And if by some chance they do survive the trip in the stomach how will they make it to the colon instead of colonizing the small intestine which is a very long passageway? You are better off taking probiotic supplements to reestablish the gut flora however fermented foods can still provide some benefits so I would not completely disregard them. You need to take a large amount of CFU's to actually benefit from the probiotics. If the number of microorganisms is in the hundreds of billions they have a higher chance of surviving through the GI tract. VSL # 3 a FDA approved probiotic supplement has hundreds of billions of microorganisms and studies have shown that it has helped relieve symptoms of people with Ulcerative Colitis. There are many other products like VSL # 3 so I would look into those. Gut problems can be very frustrating and I also suggest you read Paul Jaminets blogs on gut health. Good luck! http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2010/07/ulcerative-colitis-a-devastating-gut-disease/

0
998120e521b3e81bb54d860a98dad043

on December 17, 2013
at 01:35 AM

I would like to take my autistic child off of caesin but I would like him to continue having his yogurt(his only source of caesin). I was under the assumption that if I ferment raw cow's milk that the caesin would be broken down.

I am confused about raw cow's milk for yogurt fermentation. If I use raw milk does the A1 caesin breakdown? Also, I have only been able to find pasteurized goats milk. If I use this to make yogurt, will this be okay?

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