5

votes

Hacking HDL up for APOE4

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created January 28, 2012 at 2:25 PM

2 Months ago, I posted a question I'm still hacking on about finding optimum lipid profile for heart/brain health in APOE4 here... http://paleohacks.com/questions/80505/potential-hacks-resolve-heart-brain-dilemma-for-apoe4#axzz1klJhxOz9

I've been doing VAP test at 30 day intervals since this first test. Managed to push up size profile from 25% to 40% 'large and fluffy' LDL in the first month - a good early sign. Then per suggestions elsewhere on PH set out to raise HDL (which was flat at 47) in the second by adding coconut oil (2 tbsp/day), add 5000 IU D3 (for total of 8000 IU), and more fermented food (have come to love sauerkraut). Unfortunately, really no effect after another 30 days (HDL from 47 to 48). Maybe it takes time, but I'm thinking something's still not right as LDL went up from 170 to 200 and size went down a bit (only 35% large and fluffy).

Per hints @Quilt and @Grace elsewhere in cyberspace about ultra-sensitivity of APOE4's to dairy, I'm going to remove all dairy this month (I still use lots of butter and occasional cheese).

Any other hack suggestions to add to the mix? Also, happy to take suggestions for look for other clues (e.g. hormones, vitamins, minerals)?

Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on November 09, 2012
at 01:40 PM

Feel free to shoot me an email - info in my profile.

Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on November 09, 2012
at 01:40 PM

Another thing I've heard regarding trigs is the idea of getting more dietary phospholipids and fewer triglycerides (more fats from food, less from oil). So, I'm also trying that, which also means less calories from SFA (coconut oil). It's much tougher to eat higher fat getting it mainly from whole foods. How about your HDL, does that vary?

Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on November 09, 2012
at 01:40 PM

Mambo, I appreciate the feedback and very helpful to hear about your experience. Your guesses are pretty good and I was already fit before Paleo. Ironically, I was initially looking for dietary changes to improve my lipids and now I'd be happy to reach my pre-Paleo lipids while still eating whole foods. I haven't been sub-80g carbs, instead pretty consistent 150g (30%) carbs from all sources. Which is about 100g (20%) carbs from potatoes, sweet potatoes, white rice. Is your 40%, 150-200g carbs, from all sources or from potatoes and white rice (they have a little fat/protein too)?

5e92edc5a180787a60a252a8232006e9

(345)

on November 09, 2012
at 05:34 AM

I'm E2/E4 and have done enough experiments to know that if I increase SaFA, my LDL goes up by 50 points. Never more than 180 but around 120-160. If I go heavy yams, sweet potatoes, my LDL is between 60-100. Not that big a movement as some other E*/E4s so I'm lucky in that regard. Your results reflect mine but with a bigger jump in LDL and TC. My trigs also don't go down to like 40 like some people on a LC diet; instead it's around 100, whereas if I do 150-200g carbs, trigs go down to 60. Weird? No. Healthy carbs trump processed carbs.

5e92edc5a180787a60a252a8232006e9

(345)

on November 09, 2012
at 05:30 AM

Both. Your 400 TC is just too high and so is 301 LDL. What's funny is you had lower trigs with CW higher carb diet. But then I also have lower trigs with a higher carb diet. Let me guess: you were never overweight; always in shape; exercised routinely. You went Paleo already in shape, not out of shape like most people here. If so, you may not gain so much from Paleo: no weight to lose. If you did sub 80 carbs, it may have increased inflammation and CRP in response to glucose preservation and FT3 decrease. I would get carbs to about 40%: eat tubers and white rice. That's Paleo.

A1081af52b61372dbb3ed572d88968f4

(425)

on January 28, 2012
at 06:15 PM

AC, Actually forgot to mention that indeed is my next hack per plan. Just started doing McGuff/BBS HIIT lifting last week after last test (wanted to see what diet only would do). Good idea to pick up more sprints, too.

1f8384be58052b6b96f476e475abdc74

(2231)

on January 28, 2012
at 04:27 PM

interested mine is similar

  • A1081af52b61372dbb3ed572d88968f4

    asked by

    (425)
  • Views
    2.7K
  • Last Activity
    1429D AGO
Frontpage book

Get FREE instant access to our Paleo For Beginners Guide & 15 FREE Recipes!

3 Answers

2
Da3d4a6835c0f5256b2ef829b3ba3393

on January 28, 2012
at 03:57 PM

Are you doing any high intensity exercising? That seems to make a huge difference in my HDL. Sprints, sprints and more sprints.

A1081af52b61372dbb3ed572d88968f4

(425)

on January 28, 2012
at 06:15 PM

AC, Actually forgot to mention that indeed is my next hack per plan. Just started doing McGuff/BBS HIIT lifting last week after last test (wanted to see what diet only would do). Good idea to pick up more sprints, too.

0
167c2d78e3123c1738a3927fd82c047f

on July 07, 2013
at 02:27 AM

I'm 4/4 and at last testing had an HDL of 85; lots of EVOO and avocados :-)

0
Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on September 03, 2012
at 02:22 PM

I thought it might be useful to see some HDL history from an APOE4/3. I don't have any VAP data, but it seems low trigs provide similar info. I have to admit I'm trying to make sense of it all myself.

My best lab numbers so far seem to be at a time when I was eating a CW healthy diet (low fat) with high intensity, shorter duration exercise most days. CRP<0.5. My best guess for the change from mid-60s is diet refinement to less processed foods/wheat.

08/30/12: TC 398, LDL 301, HDL 81, trig 79 (PHD removed multi/selenium supp, tallow for cream)
04/27/12: TC 407, LDL 315, HDL 76, trig 79, TSH 1.76, fT3 2.53 (PHD 1-year; 30% C, 20% P, 50% F)
02/23/11: TC 226, LDL 142, HDL 78, trig 32 (45-50% C, 30-35% P, 20-25% F; oats, brown rice, lean meat)
02/27/07: TC 226, LDL 149, HDL 65, trig 61 (CW healthy diet)

As you've questioned, is better to have good looking lab lipids, or maybe instead reduced inflammation/oxidation?

Do you have any updates?

Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on November 09, 2012
at 01:40 PM

Another thing I've heard regarding trigs is the idea of getting more dietary phospholipids and fewer triglycerides (more fats from food, less from oil). So, I'm also trying that, which also means less calories from SFA (coconut oil). It's much tougher to eat higher fat getting it mainly from whole foods. How about your HDL, does that vary?

Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on November 09, 2012
at 01:40 PM

Feel free to shoot me an email - info in my profile.

5e92edc5a180787a60a252a8232006e9

(345)

on November 09, 2012
at 05:34 AM

I'm E2/E4 and have done enough experiments to know that if I increase SaFA, my LDL goes up by 50 points. Never more than 180 but around 120-160. If I go heavy yams, sweet potatoes, my LDL is between 60-100. Not that big a movement as some other E*/E4s so I'm lucky in that regard. Your results reflect mine but with a bigger jump in LDL and TC. My trigs also don't go down to like 40 like some people on a LC diet; instead it's around 100, whereas if I do 150-200g carbs, trigs go down to 60. Weird? No. Healthy carbs trump processed carbs.

Cbdc8318738324492f2d5918868ce4c9

(1211)

on November 09, 2012
at 01:40 PM

Mambo, I appreciate the feedback and very helpful to hear about your experience. Your guesses are pretty good and I was already fit before Paleo. Ironically, I was initially looking for dietary changes to improve my lipids and now I'd be happy to reach my pre-Paleo lipids while still eating whole foods. I haven't been sub-80g carbs, instead pretty consistent 150g (30%) carbs from all sources. Which is about 100g (20%) carbs from potatoes, sweet potatoes, white rice. Is your 40%, 150-200g carbs, from all sources or from potatoes and white rice (they have a little fat/protein too)?

5e92edc5a180787a60a252a8232006e9

(345)

on November 09, 2012
at 05:30 AM

Both. Your 400 TC is just too high and so is 301 LDL. What's funny is you had lower trigs with CW higher carb diet. But then I also have lower trigs with a higher carb diet. Let me guess: you were never overweight; always in shape; exercised routinely. You went Paleo already in shape, not out of shape like most people here. If so, you may not gain so much from Paleo: no weight to lose. If you did sub 80 carbs, it may have increased inflammation and CRP in response to glucose preservation and FT3 decrease. I would get carbs to about 40%: eat tubers and white rice. That's Paleo.

Answer Question


Get FREE instant access to our
Paleo For Beginners Guide & 15 FREE Recipes!