9

votes

Is PaleoHacks anti-science?

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created July 09, 2012 at 1:54 AM

I actually get downvoted for giving answers that include links to peer-reviewed research.

Odd, that.

Are we really trying to give helpful answers or just feeding our egos?

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on September 07, 2013
at 01:28 AM

This is probably the best example: http://paleohacks.com/questions/133313/hack-my-lifting-plan/133378#133378

211d4075d68b24cd0aa7ebfa94262bb9

on July 09, 2012
at 07:17 PM

I wouldn't pay any attention to the downvotes. If you want to counterbalance the downvotes, just start making a bunch of drive-by postings about how wonderful bacon is. You'll get hundreds of upvotes, maybe thousands.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:21 PM

Please do not close this, as it is real question and a legitimate concern. I am not offended in the least. Sam, I think, for the most part, PH'ers are very pro-science. But we hold that science to a high standard. You will also run into a fair bit of bro-science and woo as well. Simply continue to argue your points and make a good case. We all need to be willing to admit when we are wrong as well. Just because I cite a bunch of studies doesn't mean the truth of the matter is settled. We all should be willing to look at new ideas, wherever they come from.

61844af1187e745e09bb394cbd28cf23

(11058)

on July 09, 2012
at 12:45 PM

Calling them meatheads probably stoked the flames. They can't down vote a comment, so perhaps they hit your answer.

Cf416725f639ffd1bb90764792ce7b8a

(2799)

on July 09, 2012
at 11:37 AM

I blame the squat zealots. Some of them are carb zealots as well. I think you dared to suggest that people didn't need a load of carbs post workout. Such heresy cannot go unpunished.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 11:08 AM

The Journal of the American Statistical Association once went through the papers that had been published in their own journal and found mistakes in over half of them. Also see: "Why Most Published Research Findings Are False" http://www.plosmedicine.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pmed.0020124

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 10:50 AM

Sometimes the obvious requires stating. For example, your eyebrows are too close to see.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 10:49 AM

Where did I put my crystals and magnets?

Aa69579f867333b08158c70e25f7daf1

(1826)

on July 09, 2012
at 09:21 AM

This is a good point. While I understand that there isn't the data available to support our diet and point of view, coming from a paleo/primal perspective, I worry that we are throwing good statistical evidence for other things (vaccines, anyone?) to the wayside because of our fixation on the N=1.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 09, 2012
at 04:08 AM

+1 for being cool and giving a polite and reasonable answer.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:47 AM

Okay, I took a look at that. As I am not all that well-informed on the fitness side, I can't say whether I agree with you or your detractors - but I don't know that it's about correct/incorrect I didn't see anything wrong with your response. I don't know about overall, but on that particular example, it might be that they feel like you're saying that their hard work isn't necessary and that simpler can be just as effective, and they don't like that. Or maybe they just disagreed, but I don't see why it would be such a big deal as to d-vote. You weren't advocating anything dangerous or trolling.

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:35 AM

You state only what is obvious.

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:27 AM

Also, you seem to do a lot of stroking...

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:24 AM

You are obviously very wise...or gullible.

77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:06 AM

There's an up vote for raising the topic. Bear in mind, when it comes to influencing opinion facts do not always play a role. If that were the case, the most successful politicians would be scientists. Alas the most successful politicians are anything but scientists. What they are adept at doing is identifying the issues that resonate with the most people and they pander to them. it's the nature of things..

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:15 AM

To be fair, it's not so much the diet folks. It's the "fitness experts."

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:06 AM

Good point, and "No", but the responses seem more hysterical if I include research. Hence, my question.

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:04 AM

I don't usually get that, though. Mostly it's along the lines of "You're full of shit because some trainer(insert name here)with a blog/wrote a book/has a YouTube video says so."

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc

(14952)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:01 AM

I've down voted you once, but I told you why. Maybe it's because you're presenting evidence that supports a hypothesis, but the hypothesis is not relevant to the question being asked?

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7 Answers

12
26b0f1261d1a0d916825bd0deeb96a21

(5798)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:06 AM

Yes, we hate science! We're a lot of unicorn-strokers and alchemists! I stoke my moonstone daily, in order to make intuitive food choices.

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:15 AM

To be fair, it's not so much the diet folks. It's the "fitness experts."

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 10:49 AM

Where did I put my crystals and magnets?

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:27 AM

Also, you seem to do a lot of stroking...

9
9d43f6873107e17ca4d1a5055aa7a2ad

on July 09, 2012
at 03:26 AM

Just because you link to peer-reviewed research doesn't mean your answer is good. For example, don't you know that high-fat diets cause dementia? And cancer? Don't downvote me, it's peer-reviewed research, so I automatically must know something and deserve respect!

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:35 AM

You state only what is obvious.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 10:50 AM

Sometimes the obvious requires stating. For example, your eyebrows are too close to see.

8
C3bc92e6b5eba45dc55f43ac3c70cc25

on July 09, 2012
at 03:42 AM

Sam, i down voted you on the "hack my lifting plan" question.

So you posted some links with science junk. Cool, but what about some good ole common sense? I'll be honest with you, those long writen peer reviews are a waste of time for me.(I'm sure for others to). 2-3 paragraphs in & I'm lost. I'm not a scientist which means i dont have the proper training to fully digest & understand these reviews. Instead, I have to base my beliefs on what workef for me or people I know.

  • little to no difference in strength gains between low & high reps? Tell that to any competitive litter. They'll laugh in your face then proceed to give you a wedgie for wasting their time. Low reps are the norm if you want to increase strength. Sure I can gain some strength doing high reps of leg extensions while sipping on 25g of whey protein like in the link you posted. But low w/heavy is what's been used for years & producing greater results.

I've upvoted you in the past. But to say squats & dead lifts are the same & no need for verticle pushing/pulling proves to me your ignorance to training. That's why I felt jusifyed to down vote.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 09, 2012
at 04:08 AM

+1 for being cool and giving a polite and reasonable answer.

6
4ec0fe4b4aab327f7efa2dfb06b032ff

(5145)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:00 AM

But can you show that the downvotes were caused by the research and not merely correlated?

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:06 AM

Good point, and "No", but the responses seem more hysterical if I include research. Hence, my question.

5
B4e1fa6a8cf43d2b69d97a99dfca262c

(10255)

on July 09, 2012
at 09:21 AM

peer reviewed studies once declared eggs evil.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on July 09, 2012
at 11:08 AM

The Journal of the American Statistical Association once went through the papers that had been published in their own journal and found mistakes in over half of them. Also see: "Why Most Published Research Findings Are False" http://www.plosmedicine.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pmed.0020124

1
61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 09, 2012
at 02:25 AM

Can you provide links to examples of responses that have been downvoted? That would give us a way to look and see what the problem might be, instead of guessing.

61f9349ad28e3c42d1cec58ba4825a7d

(10490)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:47 AM

Okay, I took a look at that. As I am not all that well-informed on the fitness side, I can't say whether I agree with you or your detractors - but I don't know that it's about correct/incorrect I didn't see anything wrong with your response. I don't know about overall, but on that particular example, it might be that they feel like you're saying that their hard work isn't necessary and that simpler can be just as effective, and they don't like that. Or maybe they just disagreed, but I don't see why it would be such a big deal as to d-vote. You weren't advocating anything dangerous or trolling.

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on September 07, 2013
at 01:28 AM

This is probably the best example: http://paleohacks.com/questions/133313/hack-my-lifting-plan/133378#133378

61844af1187e745e09bb394cbd28cf23

(11058)

on July 09, 2012
at 12:45 PM

Calling them meatheads probably stoked the flames. They can't down vote a comment, so perhaps they hit your answer.

0
Cf416725f639ffd1bb90764792ce7b8a

(2799)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:12 AM

I usually vote you up. You have sensible, well thought out replies. Far better than my bacon pandering.

F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on July 09, 2012
at 03:24 AM

You are obviously very wise...or gullible.

Cf416725f639ffd1bb90764792ce7b8a

(2799)

on July 09, 2012
at 11:37 AM

I blame the squat zealots. Some of them are carb zealots as well. I think you dared to suggest that people didn't need a load of carbs post workout. Such heresy cannot go unpunished.

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