3

votes

are there any 'warm bodied' ZC or VLC people

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created May 29, 2012 at 3:15 AM

Just wondering about peoples experience with their body temperature and their tolerance to cold temperature when on ZC or VLC.

There are anecdotes on this site on the subject, with people talking about feeling colder, cold hands, cold feet, cold nose etc or actual measured lower body temperatures.

But (the question), is this really true for (all) people on ZC or VLC diets....are there ZC/VLC???ers who did not experience this lowering in body temperature and their tolerance to cold temperatures did not get worse on ZC/VLC.

some other refs;

Rosedale basically says that low glucose results in a lower body temperature...and that this is a good thing (for healthy people: healthy adrenals and thyroid). http://drrosedale.com/blog/2011/11/22/is-the-term-safe-starches-an-oxymoron/ ???Glucose scarcity (deficiency may be a misnomer) elicits an evolutionary response to perceived low fuel availability. This results in a shift in genetic expression to allow that organism to better survive the perceived famine???. As part of this genetic expression, and as part and parcel of nature???s mechanism to allow the maintenance of health and actually reduce the rate of aging, certain events will take place as seen in caloric restricted animals. These include a reduction in serum glucose, insulin, leptin, and free T3???The reduction in free T3 is of great benefit, reducing temperature, metabolic damage and decreasing catabolism???. We are not talking about a hypothyroid condition. It is a purposeful reduction in thyroid activity to elicit health???

Paul Jaminet basically agrees that low glucose results in a lower body temperature, tho he does not believe this to be such a good thing. http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2011/11/safe-starches-symposium-dr-ron-rosedale/

141c6b3d5e9506dd93881e3f9737f297

(55)

on February 09, 2014
at 03:12 AM

imo, i think feeling cold/low body temp probably has more to do with under-eating rather than any particular macro-nutrient ratio.

as far as i can tell ('google research'), under eating slows the metabolism a bit, which can result in a lower body temp (a sub optimal body temp).

so as far as your Q goes, may be for those vlc'ers that report feeling the cold &/or lower body temps, could it be that their vlc diet has reduced hunger/appetite & they are unknowingly under eating. (or indeed knowingly under eating for fat loss or longevity reasons).

96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19413)

on December 02, 2013
at 04:01 PM

Careful with that "furnace" - that's thermogenesis. You're body is trying to dispose of excess protein, which in the long term is harmful - the liver has to go through some interesting acrobatics to detox that.

96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19413)

on December 02, 2013
at 04:01 PM

Same here, and it freaks people out too. I was recently walking through the park in 48'F weather in just a t-shirt. A lady in a big hot coat with gloves, scarf, and hat saw me, shivered and shrank into her coat. :-D

141c6b3d5e9506dd93881e3f9737f297

(55)

on December 02, 2013
at 12:16 AM

imo, i think feeling cold/low body temp probably has more to do with under-eating rather than any particular macro-nutrient ratio.

as far as i can tell ('google research'), under eating slows the metabolism a bit, which can result in a lower body temp (a sub optimal body temp).

so as far as your Q goes, may be for those vlc'ers that report feeling the cold &/or lower body temps, could it be that their vlc diet has reduced hunger/appetite & they are unknowingly under eating. (or indeed knowingly under eating for fat loss or longevity reasons).

141c6b3d5e9506dd93881e3f9737f297

(55)

on December 02, 2013
at 12:13 AM

test comment

Cc69a51b427eaad36251cce9dcca4d3a

(1074)

on December 24, 2012
at 07:21 AM

do u eat vegetables/fiber in your VLC?

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 30, 2012
at 11:13 PM

So when you are doing your version of PSMF, ie. psmf+VLC, your calories are still well below maintenance...? As you had written VLC+PSMF, I did wonder if you were making up any calorie deficit (from the psmf bit) with Fat (from the vlc bit)? So, if your personal experience is that your calories are well below maintenance when you are doing VLC+PSMF and your are still 'running hot' ("furnace")? That is interesting to me, 'cos that seems to go against some views i have see that calorie restriction slows the metabolic rate (...may lower T3...may lower body temperature etc) .....interesting

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 30, 2012
at 11:09 PM

So when you are doing your version of PSMF, ie. psmf+VLC, your calories are still well below maintenance...? As you had written VLC+PSMF, I did wonder if you were making up any calorie deficit (from the psmf bit) with Fat (from the vlc bit)? So, if your personal experience is that your calories are well below maintenance when you are doing VLC+PSMF and your are still 'running hot' ("furnace")? That is interesting to me, 'cos that seems to go against some views i have see that calorie restriction slows the metabolic rate (& lowers T3 & lowers body temperature) .....interesting

246ebf68e35743f62e5e187891b9cba0

(21420)

on May 30, 2012
at 05:49 PM

on a PSMF calories are well below maintenance. PSMF stands for "Protein Sparing Modified Fast" and is the basis for Lyle McDonald's writings as well as the T-Nation "Velocity Diet".

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 30, 2012
at 08:07 AM

with your 'VLC + High Protein (PSMF)', what would your calorie intake be? (ie. normal, restricted, higher than normal,....?)

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on May 30, 2012
at 02:11 AM

Daz, coconut oil sites'll tell you it's the lauric acid. I don't know for sure - I take B Complex, fish oil, Vit D3 4,000, magnesium, and rhodiola. I'm all about coconut oil, and I'm warm. N=1, it works for me. Others I know eat a lot of fresh ginger too. If you have iron-deficient anemia, then iron will warm you back up. If you're not eating enough calories, eat more, esp. coconut oil. Or you can just rock out w/Rosedale & cruise on to 125 as a test of his radical life extension. Sounds great to me! Starches don't work for me - I love my designer jeans way more than any 'taters. :)

0905a0f8cd1e48f6d39fe625a65b6ef1

(2890)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:35 PM

Hi daz - I don't restrict. I am 46, female, not a larger person, and I eat probably 3500 calories a day of meat and fat. I generally eat two meals a day - first thing in the a.m. as I wake up hungry, and then another meal around lunch. I don't like to eat at night. I never snack. I do consume dairy (hard cheeses, heavy cream, butter). I eat veggies (usually low starch) a couple times a week. I try to eat grass fed but will eat conventional if need be. :)

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:27 PM

thx Sam, i will give that post a thorough read. now i have a question you may be able to help with; is there any info (studies?) on body temperature over a fasting period, after last meal ie. 24hours. Would body temp typically start to decline after approx X hours (as metabolism slows?), i'm sure X would vary depending on a number of factors???

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:08 PM

thx Twinkletoes, looking at a few of the comments above, what are your eating habits & calories like, if you don't mind me asking; ie. do you calorie restrict (i'm guessing not), how often do you eat/snack, & do you do any fasting (if yes, does fasting change anything, temperature wise). cheers

246ebf68e35743f62e5e187891b9cba0

(21420)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:04 PM

yuppers daz, not to be confused with "CORN" - Calorie Overboard Radioactive Neurosis.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 10:57 PM

cron=Calorie Restriction with Optimal Nutrition, right?

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 06:23 AM

i wonder if the studies/reports that state lowering of; free T3, metabolism and body temperature are associated with low Glucose have taken calorie intake in to account. As i have also seen mention that calorie restriction may also result in these things.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 05:59 AM

Wowza, I have used coconut oil in the past, but cannot recall if it had any warming effect on me. I'll buy some more & give a go. I currently do use MCT oil, but this does not seem to have any warming effect. Do you think it could be the Lauric (C12) &/or Myristic (C14) fatty acids in the coconut oil that may be doing the "warming", these make up about 49% & 16% of coconut oil, but don't really exist in MCT oil to any extent. what do you think?

60af23519906aa54b742ffc17477c3d3

(1186)

on May 29, 2012
at 04:04 AM

I've had the opposite response. When I was lean on a traditional BB diet I was always freezing, but now I am comfy during the day and super warm at night (which is frustrating).

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:42 AM

Agree with JayJay. I'm a big Volek fan, lift weights regularly, eat tons of coconut oil and I'm on fire. No cold hands or feet. Coconut oil is awesome for this, actually. I cook in it and also eat 1 tablespoon a day as a snack. Have you tried adding it to your diet, daz?

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:35 AM

thx for the feedback JayJay, good to know

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:24 AM

good feedback, thx JayJay

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7 Answers

4
246ebf68e35743f62e5e187891b9cba0

(21420)

on May 29, 2012
at 10:46 PM

VLC + Low Cal (Cron-inspired fasting) = very cold.

Normal VLC w/high fat = normal.

VLC + High Protein (PSMF) = furnace.

In my experience, anyway.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 10:57 PM

cron=Calorie Restriction with Optimal Nutrition, right?

246ebf68e35743f62e5e187891b9cba0

(21420)

on May 30, 2012
at 05:49 PM

on a PSMF calories are well below maintenance. PSMF stands for "Protein Sparing Modified Fast" and is the basis for Lyle McDonald's writings as well as the T-Nation "Velocity Diet".

246ebf68e35743f62e5e187891b9cba0

(21420)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:04 PM

yuppers daz, not to be confused with "CORN" - Calorie Overboard Radioactive Neurosis.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 30, 2012
at 08:07 AM

with your 'VLC + High Protein (PSMF)', what would your calorie intake be? (ie. normal, restricted, higher than normal,....?)

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 30, 2012
at 11:13 PM

So when you are doing your version of PSMF, ie. psmf+VLC, your calories are still well below maintenance...? As you had written VLC+PSMF, I did wonder if you were making up any calorie deficit (from the psmf bit) with Fat (from the vlc bit)? So, if your personal experience is that your calories are well below maintenance when you are doing VLC+PSMF and your are still 'running hot' ("furnace")? That is interesting to me, 'cos that seems to go against some views i have see that calorie restriction slows the metabolic rate (...may lower T3...may lower body temperature etc) .....interesting

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 30, 2012
at 11:09 PM

So when you are doing your version of PSMF, ie. psmf+VLC, your calories are still well below maintenance...? As you had written VLC+PSMF, I did wonder if you were making up any calorie deficit (from the psmf bit) with Fat (from the vlc bit)? So, if your personal experience is that your calories are well below maintenance when you are doing VLC+PSMF and your are still 'running hot' ("furnace")? That is interesting to me, 'cos that seems to go against some views i have see that calorie restriction slows the metabolic rate (& lowers T3 & lowers body temperature) .....interesting

Cc69a51b427eaad36251cce9dcca4d3a

(1074)

on December 24, 2012
at 07:21 AM

do u eat vegetables/fiber in your VLC?

96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19413)

on December 02, 2013
at 04:01 PM

Careful with that "furnace" - that's thermogenesis. You're body is trying to dispose of excess protein, which in the long term is harmful - the liver has to go through some interesting acrobatics to detox that.

2
3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:22 AM

The low body temp thing is a crock and measuring it on a daily basis has zero diagnostic value in and of itself.....

But since I have done stints of VLC I'll state it has never...ever...ever....resulted in me feeling colder than those around me. I never wear a coat (mid west), and am not uncomfortable in the cold. In fact, I would say I tolerate extreme temps HEAT AND COLD better than most I know.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:24 AM

good feedback, thx JayJay

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:35 AM

thx for the feedback JayJay, good to know

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on May 30, 2012
at 02:11 AM

Daz, coconut oil sites'll tell you it's the lauric acid. I don't know for sure - I take B Complex, fish oil, Vit D3 4,000, magnesium, and rhodiola. I'm all about coconut oil, and I'm warm. N=1, it works for me. Others I know eat a lot of fresh ginger too. If you have iron-deficient anemia, then iron will warm you back up. If you're not eating enough calories, eat more, esp. coconut oil. Or you can just rock out w/Rosedale & cruise on to 125 as a test of his radical life extension. Sounds great to me! Starches don't work for me - I love my designer jeans way more than any 'taters. :)

80890193d74240cab6dda920665bfb6c

(1528)

on May 29, 2012
at 03:42 AM

Agree with JayJay. I'm a big Volek fan, lift weights regularly, eat tons of coconut oil and I'm on fire. No cold hands or feet. Coconut oil is awesome for this, actually. I cook in it and also eat 1 tablespoon a day as a snack. Have you tried adding it to your diet, daz?

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 05:59 AM

Wowza, I have used coconut oil in the past, but cannot recall if it had any warming effect on me. I'll buy some more & give a go. I currently do use MCT oil, but this does not seem to have any warming effect. Do you think it could be the Lauric (C12) &/or Myristic (C14) fatty acids in the coconut oil that may be doing the "warming", these make up about 49% & 16% of coconut oil, but don't really exist in MCT oil to any extent. what do you think?

1
0905a0f8cd1e48f6d39fe625a65b6ef1

(2890)

on May 29, 2012
at 10:53 PM

I eat Very Low Carb, and most days "Zero" Carb (meaning animals in my mouth only), and I wear flip flops or go barefoot year-round, even when it snows. I haven't measured my body temperature as I haven't felt a need to do so. I sleep with my windows open, even in winter. I used to feel cold when I followed a vegan diet, but these days, not so much.

I live at over 5500 feet altitude, and perhaps that makes a difference.

0905a0f8cd1e48f6d39fe625a65b6ef1

(2890)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:35 PM

Hi daz - I don't restrict. I am 46, female, not a larger person, and I eat probably 3500 calories a day of meat and fat. I generally eat two meals a day - first thing in the a.m. as I wake up hungry, and then another meal around lunch. I don't like to eat at night. I never snack. I do consume dairy (hard cheeses, heavy cream, butter). I eat veggies (usually low starch) a couple times a week. I try to eat grass fed but will eat conventional if need be. :)

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:08 PM

thx Twinkletoes, looking at a few of the comments above, what are your eating habits & calories like, if you don't mind me asking; ie. do you calorie restrict (i'm guessing not), how often do you eat/snack, & do you do any fasting (if yes, does fasting change anything, temperature wise). cheers

1
F0a3e3f17d9a740810ac37ff2353a9f3

(3804)

on May 29, 2012
at 10:50 PM

When calories are held constant, lowering carbs will lower blood serum levels of T3, but there is no evidence that an otherwise adequate low-carb diet will lower body temperature or basal metabolism.

In fact, the evidence we do have shows that, other things equal, basal metabolism is a function of calories, not carbohydrate.

http://wp.me/p25oah-7l

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb

(4493)

on May 29, 2012
at 11:27 PM

thx Sam, i will give that post a thorough read. now i have a question you may be able to help with; is there any info (studies?) on body temperature over a fasting period, after last meal ie. 24hours. Would body temp typically start to decline after approx X hours (as metabolism slows?), i'm sure X would vary depending on a number of factors???

1
77877f762c40637911396daa19b53094

(78467)

on May 29, 2012
at 06:03 AM

I switched to VLC several years ago but never noticed any difference to my heat or cold tolerance. I have always hated the cold. I lived in the UK, which can get fairly cold in winter but nowhere near as cold as a lot of places. I worked outside though, which I really didn't find very pleasant in mid winter but it didn't seem any worse than in the past.

1
5e63e3fa78e998736106a4a5b9aef58c

on May 29, 2012
at 05:19 AM

I've been eating VLC since January.

I have a fairly high cold tolerance--"t-shirt weather" for me starts at around 50F, and I never took my warmest coat or sweaters out of storage this past winter (I'm in Seattle, where it gets wet and chilly, but not what I'd call serious cold).

I don't know how much improved my heat tolerance will be, as it hasn't warmed up enough here to test it. But cold? Not a problem.

96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19413)

on December 02, 2013
at 04:01 PM

Same here, and it freaks people out too. I was recently walking through the park in 48'F weather in just a t-shirt. A lady in a big hot coat with gloves, scarf, and hat saw me, shivered and shrank into her coat. :-D

0
Cbb1134f8e93067d1271c97bb2e15ef6

on May 30, 2012
at 04:13 AM

First, I have always run hotter than most people, from childhood.

My idea sleeping temp would be about 50 degrees and I have slept in temps far below that very comfortably.

I've been a low carber solidly, without breaks, since 1999. I'm maintaining a 110 total weight loss now and maintained a 90 lb weight loss from 02 -Oct 11. 5'6" 128-130lbs. I eat at a continuously ketogenic level, though over the years, I have experimented going as high as about 75gms/carbs/day, but never continuously.

Now I stay at 50 or under as it works best for me all the way around.

I basically don't cheat period, except on special occasions, and then, it will still be a low carb (no sugar etc) cheat, like a great cheesecake with an acceptable sugar sub, etc.

High fat eater.

Here's some info that explains what many if not the vast majority of weight reduced people experience.

"One of the key underlying problems is that when people lose weight, their energy expenditure does not simply fall to that of the energy expenditure of a person ‘naturally’ at that lower weight - it drops to levels far greater than expected.

Thus, a formerly-obese person burns 20% less calories than a never-obese person of that lower weight - or in other words a 200 lb person, who loses 40 lbs burns about 20% fewer calories than someone who is 160 lbs, but has never been obese. On top of this, the formerly-obese person experiences hunger, cold intolerance, and other behavioural and metabolic changes that make sustaining this lower body weight difficult.

From an evolutionary sense, this makes a lot of sense, as maintaining or ‘defending’ fat stores in the past has always been vital for human survival and therefore complex biological systems have evolved to readily take up and store excess calories when available and reduce caloric expenditure when times are tough."

http://www.drsharma.ca/obesitywhy-is-it-so-hard-to-maintain-a-reduced-body-weight.html

Given the fact that I seem to have been born quite remarkably heat intolerant, I believe that has served as a protective factor for me. As well, my protein and especially fat intake are probably also significant factors.

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