15

votes

Is 2012 the year Paleo turns in on itself?

Answered on September 12, 2014
Created January 11, 2012 at 3:14 AM

2011 started off nice enough, the big blog personalities of the Paleo sphere were one happy family, perhaps with some undercurrents. Even AHS arrived and everyone was buddy buddy, riding high and riding together, not necessarily of like mind, but it was like a college road trip, they were all going to the same destination, perhaps the same car, even though everyone had a bit different ideas of the route, manner, stops, etc...along the way.

Then Taubes slammed Guyenet Guyenet resisted impulse at first, but was egged on by Kurt to go after Taubes. And Kurt does too. Evelyn went after Taubes, but she always did, and up until that point it wasn't respectable work. Matesz the heretic goes after Kurt, and Kurt responds in kind. I enjoyed that one actually. Emily dumps on William and his new book. Then Emily dumps on Taubes, but while we are at it, nicely lets Paul down. Kurt does the same, they are all nice to him, but thats because Paul really is a nice guy (I met him at WAP conference, no one can deny he is a nice guy). But thats part of the problem? Sheesh. Paul I haven't seen respond in kind, class act he is. But Jimmy Moore's name gets dragged in. Then I see Kresser's. Robb talks trash about Paleohacks. Ok I didn't take that seriously, but of course that will be amplified.

And there are probably more I don't remember but I think people get the point. What the heck is going on folx?

I read 20 blogs religiously on Paleo, and alot of these people are my heroes. I read the differences of opinion and are glad for them, but can't people express disagreement publicly to their large audiences without adding too much of a personal touch to those opinions? These attempts to distance each other appropriately and non-appropriately all amplify in a bad way.

Can someone please hack the Paleosphere attitude in 2012? How do we all get along, heck not meaning everyone has to agree, but these folx for better or worse are a peer group of leaders in this space, can we all get along?

3b0b95dfc6dc5c18e535945f4aab0866

(2392)

on May 10, 2012
at 10:35 PM

Well said Shari

98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

(24286)

on May 10, 2012
at 10:08 PM

Agreed. Big issues there. Such a shame.

98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

(24286)

on May 10, 2012
at 10:07 PM

Honestly I think this kind of answer is just a cop out. It's along the lines of "haters gonna hate" in my book. Every community has its leaders. We learn from them. There is nothing wrong with that. To write off every leader as a guru is just stupid. They aren't all gurus. Most are just brilliant people who are willing to share with mere mortals like me and I, for one, am grateful. I live my own life thank you very much but I will never assume to know more that most of the leaders of this community and I'm not ashamed to say that I listen to what they have to say.

725220a3fc595fbb5d96e71bfd690695

(254)

on May 10, 2012
at 09:10 PM

Disagreement is a wonderful thing and is needed, especially when done in a respectful manner. I love a good debate. However, name calling and personal attacks ad naseum usually turns me off.

3b0b95dfc6dc5c18e535945f4aab0866

(2392)

on May 10, 2012
at 08:32 PM

Never understimate the power and value of leadership, even when the leadership itself is decentralized and diverse - it need not be hierarchical. No one is my guru - my paleo bookmarks list exceeds 30 I and visit most each day. But to me, the power of paleo was, for those who were the high profile bloggers, everyone was a little different, but everyone reveled in friendship and common cause. But then everyone developed egos at and following the first AHS...

464e1c66609d402615ae2b3cf72d53fb

(1472)

on May 10, 2012
at 06:44 PM

good guess, and probably too easy.

Da3d4a6835c0f5256b2ef829b3ba3393

on May 10, 2012
at 04:43 PM

Is he the guy who likes to call women "c*nts?"

293ba4c95d190bc616b27d85b10d705a

(661)

on March 18, 2012
at 02:58 PM

paul is my only hero. too many egos for my taste.

8508fec4bae4a580d1e1b807058fee8e

(6244)

on March 09, 2012
at 03:29 AM

I don't think a Vegan would be tasty to anyone or any creature ...

4ef807f4b8ed54ce8835f6f02f312e12

(65)

on January 13, 2012
at 01:04 PM

Thanks for that perspective. I tend toward dramatic statements ; )

D1c02d4fc5125a670cf419dbb3e18ba7

on January 11, 2012
at 09:21 PM

Nice answer brah.

F5f742cc9228eb5804114d0f3be4e587

(7660)

on January 11, 2012
at 09:16 PM

Ha ha! Funny you say that...I just tweeted something about that. I guess Sisson's Primal Weekend comes closest, but I'm talking one week in the woods next to a lake with huge Paleo meals.

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 08:11 PM

I just think it is too bad that some people focused on Paul being temporarily removed from Emily’s like-minds list rather than the rest of her blogpost. It is also disappointing to see the people defending Mercola and that sort of thing to defend Paul. Mercola is a guy that Emily and Kurt think could be getting people killed – not just giving out poor nutrition advice. How many of these people would be defending Mercola now without Paul’s association? Again it wasn’t that Paul spoke there, it was that he directed his audience there multiple times and continues to defend Mercola.

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on January 11, 2012
at 07:26 PM

Yeah, your right, Nance! My bad.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 06:42 PM

@Dave S, I didn't give you the down-vote but vegan bashing is getting very old, don't you think? Even for humor.

Dc5144de5078c44a2b106ff25778fd3d

(308)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:26 PM

Two words: Paleo Camp. First to jump on this concept will have a gold mine, IMHO.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:22 PM

Paul's supporters are overreacting? As opposed to Emily just taking Paul off of her like minds list on a whim that should could possibly get over after taking a shower? Heh. I have a hunch that something is going on behind the scenes that most aren't aware of...

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:11 PM

LB, what if this man tells people stuff that you strongly believe will hurt them - not just give them poorer science or poorer nutrition, but causes them to die early because they used thermography instead of mammography? Each person has their line. Deans said that the 5 posts from Paul directing his audience to this man was her personal limit at that moment in time. I don’t think that is elitist at all. I think Paul’s supporters are over-reacting.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:02 PM

Nah, it's more like a political convention where there's lots of rhetoric and fiery disagreement between members of one party. I expect it will be followed by better understanding and maybe--just maybe--emerging consensus. Besides, if you thrive on your ancestral eating sooner or later you'll have to talk to friends because they'll want to know what changed. :-))

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:33 PM

I keep thinking of all the questionable dietary routes I took before coming upon paleo a couple of years ago. If someone like Mark Sisson wasn't trying as hard as he could to put himself out there, the chances of me finding this would have been VERY slim. If Paul has to say a few nice things about a man, who in many places line up with us nutritionally, to reach his vast audience, then I say that's a small price to pay. Not everyone's an elitist or chooses a hermetic existence when it comes to this. What's the big picture here? And I'm not asking that rhetorically...

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:30 PM

@p2.0 I don't read mercola regularly so i can't comment on that one way or another. what is curiously absent to me is a SUBSTANTIVE argument against PJ. I'm a big KGH fan and I occasionally read DEANS but as far as being utterly thorough and conservative in dietary approach, I think Paul is as good or better than any blogger I read. In fact, I remember KGH praising Paul's approach during the safe starch debate. It goes back to the fact of whether you want to actually speak to the many followers that Mercola has or do you leave them to twist in the wind. The latter is unconscionable imo.

D1c02d4fc5125a670cf419dbb3e18ba7

on January 11, 2012
at 04:30 PM

Paleo 2.0 - I agree with you regarding the start of the Insulin Wars being much older. In this thread here, I pointed out that back in 2008, Stephan already planted the seeds of the current disagreement - http://paleohacks.com/questions/49970/how-do-we-reconcile-stephan-guyenets-latest-comment-with-the-insulin-story-in/50038#50038

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:19 PM

I don't think it was so much that Paul appeared on Mercola's site to spread his message - I think that it was that Paul had 5 or so posts where he directed his *own audience* to Mercola's site, and in the comments of some of those posts he defended Mercola against accusations of quackery. Does Taubes tell his fans to watch the Dr. Oz show and defend him from his critics? I don't think it is all that big of a deal. Different people are just more comfortable with different things. We need both people willing to find common ground and those willing to draw a line in the sand.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:08 PM

@luckybastard You know, when I read in several blogs that Paul is "too nice" or "dangerous" I was pretty surprised. There's plenty of room for all of us and elitism would be the fastest way I know of to kill the expansion of interest in ancestral eating. We need some nice guys and women just as we need some hard chargers. Most good recipes for success call for a lively mix and I think we have that.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:07 PM

@luckybastard You know, when I read in several blogs that Paul is "too nice" or "dangerous" I was pretty surprised. There's plenty of room for all of us and elitism would be the fastest way I know of to kill the expansion of interest in ancestral eating. We need some nice guys as women just as we need some hard chargers. Most good recipes for success call for a lively mix and I think we have that.

83d6a06c93bb3490dbca339cbbb63385

(526)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:56 PM

I don't remember it happening this way.

D1c02d4fc5125a670cf419dbb3e18ba7

on January 11, 2012
at 02:44 PM

Jeff - The logical conclusion is that your anti social behavior and failure to trip GT has caused the Paleo singularity. I hope you can live with yourself.

34b560c8b9ce660d7839fb7e29d7be89

on January 11, 2012
at 06:52 AM

I'm pretty sure this is exactly what the Mayans predicted. We need to round up as many paleo-virgins as we can, there may still be a chance we can turn this all around with enough human sacrifices.

64433a05384cd9717c1aa6bf7e98b661

(15236)

on January 11, 2012
at 06:45 AM

Hypotheses for the hypothetical Butterfly effect caused by Aravind or Kamal getting to the mic before Gary really deserves its own question here. I mean, that really caused the gloves to come off in the blogosphere!

64433a05384cd9717c1aa6bf7e98b661

(15236)

on January 11, 2012
at 06:42 AM

Paul I know, I feel bad missing out on the PH hangouts. I hung out with Quilt a bit and briefly met Melissa, other than that I was unintentionally anti-social

47a42b6be94caf700fce9509e38bb6a4

(9647)

on January 11, 2012
at 06:17 AM

Every time you mention that Jeff it just makes me wish you had introduced yourself!

D1c02d4fc5125a670cf419dbb3e18ba7

on January 11, 2012
at 04:36 AM

Kamal - you asked your question. It just didn't make sense to Stephan. He's such a dummy!

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:39 AM

I was in line behind Aravind, and line-cutting Taubes is the reason I didn't get to ask my question. Maybe you should have tripped him Jeff. Unless that would have elicited the Butterfly Effect, which through several seemingly random events leads to _______ being elected. (note how I didn't list a name, as political commentary is not encouraged on paleohacks :)

64433a05384cd9717c1aa6bf7e98b661

(15236)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:29 AM

I mean, I could have stuck out my leg and tripped Taubes, I was sitting right there

64433a05384cd9717c1aa6bf7e98b661

(15236)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:29 AM

Kamal that's freakin hilarious

3b0b95dfc6dc5c18e535945f4aab0866

(2392)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:26 AM

Damnit Kamal, you made me laugh!

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:23 AM

Option #3: Go Back to the Future and stop Taubes from cutting in front of Aravind and asking Guyenet that question.

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:22 AM

Option #2: Draft a Magna Carta?

21fd060d0796fdb8a4a990441e08eae7

(24543)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:21 AM

This tends to happen in election years. Just ride it out. Paleo 2013 is for lovers.

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13 Answers

8
66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

on January 11, 2012
at 04:01 PM

I think we've reached a critical point in Paleo where people have to decide whether this is going to be some movement that is always relegated to the fringes because some of the "luminaries" don't want to associate themselves with the unwashed masses. I was very disappointed in the Emily Deans post where she goes in on Paul Jaminet. I think the post is worth reading as are the comments section. I twice tried to post my comment but it somehow didn't get through so I'll post it here. Funniest part of this post- Paul Jaminet is dangerous. Yeah.

"I don't follow the reasoning as to the disassociation with Jaminet, Sisson or Masterjohn. I read the post a couple of days ago and the subsequent comments last night. I fully understand why those 3 gentleman would go on Mercola, or a Gary Taubes would go on Dr Oz. If you believe in what you're preaching you're going to try to reach as wide of an audience as possible. Those three individuals get decent traffic I'm sure but I'm just as certain that it pales in comparison to a Mercola. What seems to have gotten the short shrift in this discussion is the types of people who make up Mercola's audience. I would imagine that many of them are like myself and many others in the paleosphere who have had many physicians- Ivy league trained and otherwise- fail them miserably. As many of us subsequently found out, in medical school, these physicians get a horrifically miniscule amount of training in nutrition. In the book Death by Prescription, M.D Ray Strand notes

'In medical school I had not received any significant instruction on the subject. I was not alone. Only approximately 6 percent of the graduating physicians in the United States have any training in nutrition. Medical students may take elective courses on the topic, but few actually do??? the education of most physicians is disease-oriented with a heavy emphasis on pharmaceuticals ??? we learn about drugs and why and when to use them.'

With regards to how many of us have been failed by the medical establishment, is it any wonder that some of them end up with the fisherman who casts the widest net? I'm not a Mercola reader or fan but one thing I have noticed during my journey back to health is that when I google specific questions concerning diet in an ancestral eating context, Mercola articles often pop up. From those that I've read, many of them are well written and line up with what I've read on various paleo blogs and sites. As for the woo, I can't speak on it because I haven't gone there looking for it. That type of thing I don't have time for, however, I would caution though, that he who is without sin should cast the first stone. Off the top of my head, just in the past couple of years I've seen many prominent paleo bloggers and the overall zeitgeist change on many issues- from low-carb being the default paleo diet to fish oil calculators to potatoes and rice, to acid balance theories.

I say all of that to support the notion that Paul, Chris and Mark are indeed right to try to reach the widest audience possible. I would look at them cock-eyed if they didn't. Like him or not, Mercola has a wide net and he has people who listen to him and if showing up on his show enriches people's understanding, then it's a net positive.

PS. I found it disheartening that P Jaminet felt the need to defend himself for being too nice. Really? I've only been reading Paul for a few months- prior to that I read Archevore religiously, and still do when KGH posts- but he strikes me as one of the most level-headed and intellectually honest nutrition bloggers out there. He has the type of personality that can, and I predict will, reach many out there who have found Mercola."

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:08 PM

@luckybastard You know, when I read in several blogs that Paul is "too nice" or "dangerous" I was pretty surprised. There's plenty of room for all of us and elitism would be the fastest way I know of to kill the expansion of interest in ancestral eating. We need some nice guys and women just as we need some hard chargers. Most good recipes for success call for a lively mix and I think we have that.

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:11 PM

LB, what if this man tells people stuff that you strongly believe will hurt them - not just give them poorer science or poorer nutrition, but causes them to die early because they used thermography instead of mammography? Each person has their line. Deans said that the 5 posts from Paul directing his audience to this man was her personal limit at that moment in time. I don’t think that is elitist at all. I think Paul’s supporters are over-reacting.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:30 PM

@p2.0 I don't read mercola regularly so i can't comment on that one way or another. what is curiously absent to me is a SUBSTANTIVE argument against PJ. I'm a big KGH fan and I occasionally read DEANS but as far as being utterly thorough and conservative in dietary approach, I think Paul is as good or better than any blogger I read. In fact, I remember KGH praising Paul's approach during the safe starch debate. It goes back to the fact of whether you want to actually speak to the many followers that Mercola has or do you leave them to twist in the wind. The latter is unconscionable imo.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:07 PM

@luckybastard You know, when I read in several blogs that Paul is "too nice" or "dangerous" I was pretty surprised. There's plenty of room for all of us and elitism would be the fastest way I know of to kill the expansion of interest in ancestral eating. We need some nice guys as women just as we need some hard chargers. Most good recipes for success call for a lively mix and I think we have that.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:22 PM

Paul's supporters are overreacting? As opposed to Emily just taking Paul off of her like minds list on a whim that should could possibly get over after taking a shower? Heh. I have a hunch that something is going on behind the scenes that most aren't aware of...

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:19 PM

I don't think it was so much that Paul appeared on Mercola's site to spread his message - I think that it was that Paul had 5 or so posts where he directed his *own audience* to Mercola's site, and in the comments of some of those posts he defended Mercola against accusations of quackery. Does Taubes tell his fans to watch the Dr. Oz show and defend him from his critics? I don't think it is all that big of a deal. Different people are just more comfortable with different things. We need both people willing to find common ground and those willing to draw a line in the sand.

66e6b190e62fb3bcf42d4c60801c7bf6

(12407)

on January 11, 2012
at 04:33 PM

I keep thinking of all the questionable dietary routes I took before coming upon paleo a couple of years ago. If someone like Mark Sisson wasn't trying as hard as he could to put himself out there, the chances of me finding this would have been VERY slim. If Paul has to say a few nice things about a man, who in many places line up with us nutritionally, to reach his vast audience, then I say that's a small price to pay. Not everyone's an elitist or chooses a hermetic existence when it comes to this. What's the big picture here? And I'm not asking that rhetorically...

7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 08:11 PM

I just think it is too bad that some people focused on Paul being temporarily removed from Emily’s like-minds list rather than the rest of her blogpost. It is also disappointing to see the people defending Mercola and that sort of thing to defend Paul. Mercola is a guy that Emily and Kurt think could be getting people killed – not just giving out poor nutrition advice. How many of these people would be defending Mercola now without Paul’s association? Again it wasn’t that Paul spoke there, it was that he directed his audience there multiple times and continues to defend Mercola.

D1c02d4fc5125a670cf419dbb3e18ba7

on January 11, 2012
at 09:21 PM

Nice answer brah.

8
0d2dec01a5ed9363a9915e111ae13f7e

on January 11, 2012
at 04:32 AM

It's all a tempest in a teapot. I'm glad for all the varying opinions (along with the free )time to peruse the pertinent blogs and podcasts, and books). This all allows me a chance to challenge my own understanding and implementation of the info. It's good to check out the alternative hypothesis!

Personal conflict is only offensive if one allows themselves to be offended. Seems everyone involved is a grown up, and this is in no way halting paleo progress as this general information gets out there.

4
464e1c66609d402615ae2b3cf72d53fb

(1472)

on May 10, 2012
at 04:10 PM

As of yesterday I deleted a bookmark to a blog I had followed for 2.5 years. I honestly think the guy probably has a drinking problem. He glories in stirring the shit.

464e1c66609d402615ae2b3cf72d53fb

(1472)

on May 10, 2012
at 06:44 PM

good guess, and probably too easy.

Da3d4a6835c0f5256b2ef829b3ba3393

on May 10, 2012
at 04:43 PM

Is he the guy who likes to call women "c*nts?"

98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

(24286)

on May 10, 2012
at 10:08 PM

Agreed. Big issues there. Such a shame.

4
7d64d3988de1b0e493aacf37843c5596

(2861)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:41 PM

If someone believes that somebody like Kruse or Davis or Rosedale or Taubes is a pseudoscientific quack, then I would much rather them say it than just smile politely just because their diet advice is somewhat similar.

There are two different issues to the whole Paleo/diet thing. One is diet strategy. One is science. Hopefully a better understanding of the science will result in better strategy, but the human body is so complex that it might not always be the case for many years. Quite a few things that pharmaceutical companies pursue turn out to be failures.

Even if the diet strategies are similar, some people don???t want bad science and quackery becoming injected into the mix because that will hurt progress in the long run. I think much of the strife is because some of the bloggers getting uncomfortable with the questionable crap and the support it garners. They don???t want pseudocience to become meshed with Paleo. They don???t want homeopaths and HCG diets at the next AHS.

ADDENDUM: It was clear to me that Guyenet and Harris disagreed with Taubes up to a year or so prior to the "showdown", yet many seemed to think they were all really on the same page and were surprised by it. Maybe you have to speak more forcefully sometimes to get your message through.

D1c02d4fc5125a670cf419dbb3e18ba7

on January 11, 2012
at 04:30 PM

Paleo 2.0 - I agree with you regarding the start of the Insulin Wars being much older. In this thread here, I pointed out that back in 2008, Stephan already planted the seeds of the current disagreement - http://paleohacks.com/questions/49970/how-do-we-reconcile-stephan-guyenets-latest-comment-with-the-insulin-story-in/50038#50038

725220a3fc595fbb5d96e71bfd690695

(254)

on May 10, 2012
at 09:10 PM

Disagreement is a wonderful thing and is needed, especially when done in a respectful manner. I love a good debate. However, name calling and personal attacks ad naseum usually turns me off.

4
F5f742cc9228eb5804114d0f3be4e587

(7660)

on January 11, 2012
at 06:49 AM

It's just a sign of its impending success. Probably paralleling the media blitz it's getting too. It really feels a bit inevitable, doesn't it? There's only so much Paleo grain- and refined-sugar-free pie out there, and the restlessness is becoming apparent.

Whoever's left when the dust settles will be the true Paleo adherents and will get a nice T-Bone.

P.S.- Is anyone making money off all of this Paleo business yet?

Dc5144de5078c44a2b106ff25778fd3d

(308)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:26 PM

Two words: Paleo Camp. First to jump on this concept will have a gold mine, IMHO.

F5f742cc9228eb5804114d0f3be4e587

(7660)

on January 11, 2012
at 09:16 PM

Ha ha! Funny you say that...I just tweeted something about that. I guess Sisson's Primal Weekend comes closest, but I'm talking one week in the woods next to a lake with huge Paleo meals.

3
Medium avatar

on January 11, 2012
at 05:24 PM

The paleo conversation is important to those who find it so, important enough to argue vociferously about who's right and who's wrong. The paleo conversation is not important to those who do not find it important. Like many intense conversations, the paleo conversation forgets that it is only one conversation taking place in the coffee shop of life, and in a relatively small corner. Not quite the stuff of "We are the world, we are the children..." Eat well, work out, forget about persuading anyone else to adopt "our" ways. In a word, chill. Ya savvy?

3
A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on January 11, 2012
at 03:37 PM

Cannabalism is the ultimate paleo feast. 2012 is the year we eat our own.

Although, I still want this bumper sticker:

Go Paleo, Eat a Vegan!

A968087cc1dd66d480749c02e4619ef4

(20436)

on January 11, 2012
at 07:26 PM

Yeah, your right, Nance! My bad.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 06:42 PM

@Dave S, I didn't give you the down-vote but vegan bashing is getting very old, don't you think? Even for humor.

8508fec4bae4a580d1e1b807058fee8e

(6244)

on March 09, 2012
at 03:29 AM

I don't think a Vegan would be tasty to anyone or any creature ...

2
0d0842381492a41b2173a04014aae810

(4875)

on May 10, 2012
at 04:02 PM

The vegans were right: all the red meat has left us stranded in a cesspool of testosterone and aggression! Repent thine eschewing of heart-healthy oatmeal!

1
59fa7cd87fb9d669adf21e5cf3e7ada5

on May 10, 2012
at 05:47 PM

Why do you care what a bunch of gurus do, whose life are you living, the guru's or your own?

3b0b95dfc6dc5c18e535945f4aab0866

(2392)

on May 10, 2012
at 08:32 PM

Never understimate the power and value of leadership, even when the leadership itself is decentralized and diverse - it need not be hierarchical. No one is my guru - my paleo bookmarks list exceeds 30 I and visit most each day. But to me, the power of paleo was, for those who were the high profile bloggers, everyone was a little different, but everyone reveled in friendship and common cause. But then everyone developed egos at and following the first AHS...

98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

(24286)

on May 10, 2012
at 10:07 PM

Honestly I think this kind of answer is just a cop out. It's along the lines of "haters gonna hate" in my book. Every community has its leaders. We learn from them. There is nothing wrong with that. To write off every leader as a guru is just stupid. They aren't all gurus. Most are just brilliant people who are willing to share with mere mortals like me and I, for one, am grateful. I live my own life thank you very much but I will never assume to know more that most of the leaders of this community and I'm not ashamed to say that I listen to what they have to say.

3b0b95dfc6dc5c18e535945f4aab0866

(2392)

on May 10, 2012
at 10:35 PM

Well said Shari

1
474ae29b80569199c6589e879e6cd7d1

on May 10, 2012
at 05:38 PM

It's pretty darn clear that infighting and seeking of alpha status is ancestral and consistent with our evolutionary history. The tribe has expanded to the point where multiple individuals are seeking alpha status and we are now viewing the outcome. As much as HFCS leads to obesity, increased size of group leads to intra-group conflict. It kind of reminds me of high school, it's so refreshing and makes me feel young to watch.

1
4ef807f4b8ed54ce8835f6f02f312e12

on January 11, 2012
at 04:57 PM

I hope they all get how frustrating the minutia of all this could be to a newbie who is just trying to eat well and get healthy. People are looking for something that WORKS so they can live the rest of thier lives without constantly worrying if they've got it all wrong. In fact I'm now more reluctant to discuss "paleo" with friends ect, because it seems to be imlpoding.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on January 11, 2012
at 05:02 PM

Nah, it's more like a political convention where there's lots of rhetoric and fiery disagreement between members of one party. I expect it will be followed by better understanding and maybe--just maybe--emerging consensus. Besides, if you thrive on your ancestral eating sooner or later you'll have to talk to friends because they'll want to know what changed. :-))

4ef807f4b8ed54ce8835f6f02f312e12

(65)

on January 13, 2012
at 01:04 PM

Thanks for that perspective. I tend toward dramatic statements ; )

1
1c67bc28f4e44bbb8770b86df0463df3

on January 11, 2012
at 06:56 AM

Its ridiculous Drama and thats all. Like Jerry Springer on TV. People are trying to make money folks, and where that happens, stuff happens.

0
1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on May 10, 2012
at 04:47 PM

It will all blow over and then we will have nothing to talk about...

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