4

votes

Mom tells me I eat too much meat.

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created November 11, 2011 at 4:08 AM

I eat bacon or ground beef/pork with eggs (with a little onion, sometimes peppers) for my first meal of the day around noon. Then usually have chicken or steak for dinner, sometimes with a side of veggies (broccoli or cauliflower.) I also eat a big salad like once or twice a week.

She sends me an email tonight quoting this article http://www.jonbarron.org/weight-loss/paleo-diet-review-good-bad "Men who eat red meat as a main dish five or more times a week have four times the risk of colon cancer than men who eat red meat less than once a month."

No way in hell I'm only eating meat once a month. What do I need to tell her?

I supplement 2000mg Salmon Oil, 5000UI Vitamin D3 and Zinc everyday.

D5d982a898721d3392c85f951d0bf0aa

(2417)

on December 12, 2011
at 04:49 PM

And you don't need a crockpot to make broth. Just go low and slow in a big pot. If your burners permit, you can push the pot a third off the burner to create a cool spot/convection and help keep the temp down.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on November 12, 2011
at 03:11 PM

Hey, my first downvote! Awesome, now I really feel like part of the family. I assume it was for the snarky "lifestyle" stuff, which is fair. The whole thing was definitely written with tongue firmly in cheek.

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2011
at 12:09 AM

This would have also went well in the "should I get a colonoscopy at 50" thread.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 07:50 PM

You can add bison to that list.. the point of the question was to get feedback on how I should explain things to my mom.

5e36f73c3f95eb4ea13a009f4936449f

(8280)

on November 11, 2011
at 06:39 PM

Is Pork considered red meat? I always linked that with Beef. So bacon/pork/chicken/beef. Only one part in four is red meat. ;0

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:36 PM

Well said, thank you +1

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:32 PM

Mainly for convenience, that and I just love the way I feel when I eat mostly meat. I do understand the importance of variety though, getting some good feedback from this thread.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:31 PM

Thanks for the tips, will do.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:28 PM

I love meat and it's convenient.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:27 PM

Honestly because I love meat and its convenient.

6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on November 11, 2011
at 02:38 PM

+1 In addition to more leafy greens you should also add some gelatin (aka bone broth) to your diet. If you are only eating muscle meat you are missing out on some important amino acid if you don't consume both broth. http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/gelatin.shtml

E5c7f14800c5992831f5c70fa746dc5c

(12857)

on November 11, 2011
at 02:23 PM

why is your diet so restricted if your a lean 21 yr old male?

6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on November 11, 2011
at 09:42 AM

Sorry, great find too, Stabby, +1

6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on November 11, 2011
at 09:40 AM

I can get grass feed Australian meat everywhere. And its awesome :)

286a4ff7c362241c5c4b020df4972212

(1288)

on November 11, 2011
at 07:13 AM

Also that study was with men eating red meat and whole grain - they are looking at the wrong culprit !

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:58 AM

Good point Dorado!

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:56 AM

Great answer!!!

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:55 AM

You can get that type at costco! Leg of Lamb from Australia

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:54 AM

+10 Travis, Perfect answer!!!

Medium avatar

(10663)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:50 AM

I don't know if the "tone" of these are any better but Mark's post are always very convincing and eye-opening. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/meat-eating-human-evolution/ & http://www.marksdailyapple.com/in-defense-of-meat-eaters/

D117467bf8e8472464ece2b81509606c

(2873)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:02 AM

Can you find one a little more... mom friendly? I wanna steer my mom towards Paleo but I think she'd be put off by the tone of the piece (I really enjoyed it though).

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:28 AM

The "I love you" part works but mom's going to believe who she's used to believing. Unfortunately. About all you can do is smile and go your own way.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:28 AM

Pretty much what I've been telling her thus far.. :)

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:27 AM

I've only started reading this article and I LOVE IT. +1

Medium avatar

(39821)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:21 AM

Tell her if she doesn't clam up about it, you'll go vegan.

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12 Answers

best answer

12
Be1dbd31e4a3fccd4394494aa5db256d

(17969)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:24 AM

Well there are other epidemiological studies that show an inverse association with some types of red meat. For example here baked red meat from Australia which would be grass-fed was strongly inversely associated with instance of colorectal cancer http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21364608

So I don't think that she should be using epidemiological studies to try to pull an "Aha, gotcha foo'!" on you, and I think that everyone should take into consideration the type of meat, the cooking technique and any confounding factors associated with meat in the studies.

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:55 AM

You can get that type at costco! Leg of Lamb from Australia

6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on November 11, 2011
at 09:40 AM

I can get grass feed Australian meat everywhere. And its awesome :)

6b8d12fc3e43179f9ae1765a4d1a9dc2

(5914)

on November 11, 2011
at 09:42 AM

Sorry, great find too, Stabby, +1

5
98bf2ca7f8778c79cd3f6c962011cfdc

on November 11, 2011
at 04:23 AM

"I love you mom and appreciate your concern but your sources are shit and I promise I'm going to be just fine."

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:28 AM

The "I love you" part works but mom's going to believe who she's used to believing. Unfortunately. About all you can do is smile and go your own way.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:28 AM

Pretty much what I've been telling her thus far.. :)

4
D117467bf8e8472464ece2b81509606c

(2873)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:29 AM

I got the cholesterol talk after I told my grandma I eat 4 eggs a day. I love her but there's no way in hell I'm gonna stop eating eggs or red meat. Instead of trying to reason with her, I shrugged and changed the subject. It's a tough situation for you because while your mother is genuinely concerned for your health and well-being, she's probably incredibly ignorant when it comes to what is healthy nutrition for the human body. All you can do is tell her how great you feel (I'm just assuming)... go prep that sirloin steak dinner for you both afterwards.

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:56 AM

Great answer!!!

4
F4d04667059bc682540fdfd8b40f13a7

on November 11, 2011
at 04:19 AM

I've not been able to find the study he refers to yet, but I believe that particular study categorised red meat with processed meat. Given that organic grass fed beef couldn't be much further removed from processed meat I think the study was pretty meaningless.

Anyway, I have a link to it somehwere, I'll keep looking!

3
03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on November 11, 2011
at 02:14 PM

I think everyone here knows it's not true, but you're probably not going to convince her that the government experts, university researchers, talk show hosts, late night comedians, magazine writers, TV people, and her doctor are all wrong about the same thing in the same way. You're one voice up against a multitude that shouts the conventional wisdom every day. Until a person takes the red pill by her own choice, arguing against all that just makes you look like a crackpot.

So you could try another tack: assume what she believes is true, but baffle her with statistics. According to the Interwebs, the chance of a man developing colon cancer in his lifetime is about 5%. That's the average, so if you assume that people with bad diets and good diets are spread fairly evenly on either side of that number, and a bacon-and-steak diet gives you 5 times the chance that a fish-chicken-veggies diet does, that would mean the best diet would give you a chance of 1.65%, and the worst would give you 8.25%. (Yes, I'm shamelessly oversimplifying the math, and it would depend on the standard deviation and the shape of the curve, etc. This is just back-of-the-napkin stuff to make a point.)

So, even if that worst-case scenario were true, would it be worth basically giving up red meat for the rest of your life except for a treat a few times a year, to reduce your chance of colon cancer from 1-in-12 to 1-in-60? Also, about 2/3 of colon cancer patients survive beyond the 5-year point, so if you look at just fatalities, it's more like the difference between .55% and 2.75%, or 1-in-182 versus 1-in-36. Also, the median age for developing colon cancer is 70, which means half of the cases happen beyond that age, near the average life expectancy anyway, and very few cases occur before age 50. Even if a meatless diet protected against it, you'll have time to adjust later. (I'm assuming here that you're not near 50, since you need to justify your eating habits to your mother.)

Presumably, you'd also have to adopt the rest of the typical red-meatless man's lifestyle, since we don't know how much of this is correlation with other aspects of that. So you'd not only have to give up meat and other "bad" foods like butter and salt, but you'd also have to start wearing cardigans, watch a lot of Alan Alda movies, get one of those "This is what a feminist looks like" t-shirts, and call your pet dog or cat your "companion animal." I'm just not sure the extra years would be worth it.

Like most health scares (and other scares), even if it's true, it's not that significant. It's the difference between a small chance and a somewhat smaller chance. If you went through life dodging everything that had a 1-in-36 chance of hurting you someday, you'd be paralyzed.

03fa485bfd54734522755f47a5e6597e

(3944)

on November 12, 2011
at 03:11 PM

Hey, my first downvote! Awesome, now I really feel like part of the family. I assume it was for the snarky "lifestyle" stuff, which is fair. The whole thing was definitely written with tongue firmly in cheek.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:36 PM

Well said, thank you +1

3846a3b61bc9051e4baebdef62e58c52

(18635)

on November 12, 2011
at 12:09 AM

This would have also went well in the "should I get a colonoscopy at 50" thread.

3
19acef0aed67ef8dc1118d8e74edb349

(2954)

on November 11, 2011
at 09:37 AM

I ate about that much meat per day as that when I was a little five year old girl. Everyday. Plus lots (lots!) of full fat cheese and milk for my afternoon tea, and sometimes before bed as well. You're OK.

But you really should eat a lot more vegetables, specially leafy greens.

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:31 PM

Thanks for the tips, will do.

6714718e2245e5190017d643a7614157

on November 11, 2011
at 02:38 PM

+1 In addition to more leafy greens you should also add some gelatin (aka bone broth) to your diet. If you are only eating muscle meat you are missing out on some important amino acid if you don't consume both broth. http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/gelatin.shtml

D5d982a898721d3392c85f951d0bf0aa

(2417)

on December 12, 2011
at 04:49 PM

And you don't need a crockpot to make broth. Just go low and slow in a big pot. If your burners permit, you can push the pot a third off the burner to create a cool spot/convection and help keep the temp down.

3
13a44ea00b0c9af0b6d0f3d5f5c2cfca

(7223)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:28 AM

That study didn't differentiate between processed meats and fresh meats. There is a lot of evidence pointing to processed meats as the culprit in these studies. Nitrate and nitrites (which are found in most processed meats) are known carcinogens.

Also, that article, while critical of the theories behind the paleo-ness of the diet was not actually particularly critical of diet itself. The author seemed to be agreeing with most of the dietary principles at the end of the article and didn't discourage eating meat so long as it was pastured/grass fed.

286a4ff7c362241c5c4b020df4972212

(1288)

on November 11, 2011
at 07:13 AM

Also that study was with men eating red meat and whole grain - they are looking at the wrong culprit !

3
Medium avatar

(10663)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:18 AM

She's stuck on conventional wisdom. If she can send you an article, you can send her one back:
http://www.gnolls.org/1141/eat-like-a-predator-not-like-prey-paleo-in-six-easy-steps-a-motivational-guide/

Medium avatar

(10663)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:50 AM

I don't know if the "tone" of these are any better but Mark's post are always very convincing and eye-opening. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/meat-eating-human-evolution/ & http://www.marksdailyapple.com/in-defense-of-meat-eaters/

D117467bf8e8472464ece2b81509606c

(2873)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:02 AM

Can you find one a little more... mom friendly? I wanna steer my mom towards Paleo but I think she'd be put off by the tone of the piece (I really enjoyed it though).

De641ff2accb4975e1f42886b43009db

(2227)

on November 11, 2011
at 04:27 AM

I've only started reading this article and I LOVE IT. +1

2
Medium avatar

on November 11, 2011
at 04:42 AM

Mom is doing what moms are programmed to do: imagine their sons as permanently 6 years old. I have no idea how old you are, but you don't sound or look like 6. You can't dissuade mom's claim on your identity, but you can, and should, be yourself. This means eating what you want to. (Unless, of course, you are still living at Mom's house, in which case, if she's supporting you, eat what she serves for heaven's sake.) Assuming you're on your own: Don't spend a lot of time arguing with Mom for arguing with whatever your independent food choices represent (to Mom). Her sending you that article is her way, one of her ways, of letting you know she loves you, and that you need her to surivive. You once needed her for that, but no more. But she doesn't know that, so it's up to you to play the compassion card. Find ways to let her know you love her back, and move on with everything that moves, touches, and inspires you, in your truest life.

1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:58 AM

Good point Dorado!

0
E167c0387a5f0b87bb1f2c3e6aec73a8

(1240)

on November 11, 2011
at 08:45 PM

Lol, that's what mothers do. They worry all the time. For now tell hey you know what? you might be right, but hey im healthy and there are worst things to worry about ( teh drugs!) is she keeps going on just say that you are going to TRY to eat less meat. ( and do whatever the hell you want) my 2 cents

0
Ca2c940a1947e6200883908592956680

(8574)

on November 11, 2011
at 10:09 AM

Take the time to sit with her and talk about it all. Spend some time summarizing the Paleo diet in a few bullet points and go through it together. Have some good clear references available, but you are not trying to start or win a fight but rather trying to show her that actually you are looking after yourself better with these eating habits rather then hurting yourself. Mums are mums and all they want is for their kids to be healthy and happy. All you need to show her is that you are both and most of all investing in your health for the future and the future of your kids. Grandkids make Mums exceedingly happy to.

I am no expert of course but put more greens on your plate with the meat heap, as this is probably what she is seeing and panicking about. You can keep the meat the same, just add foliage.

0
1a98a40ba8ffdc5aa28d1324d01c6c9f

(20378)

on November 11, 2011
at 05:58 AM

Good point Dorado!

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