3

votes

Paleo and laryngopharyngeal reflux

Answered on August 19, 2014
Created December 07, 2011 at 6:53 AM

I have found extensive information on the paleo diet and GERD--all of which seems rather logical, and I'm elated that so many people have been helped by the diet. My frequent urination, anxiety attacks, and mysterious back inflammation are a thing of the past thanks to this (what logically seems obvious) miracle diet. (Gah, I said "miracle" let the flame wars begin!) Anyways, there's two issues left unresolved: the most prevalent of which is laryngopharyngeal reflux or LPR if you'd like. In short, LPR (like GERD, I'd imagine) is a * and a half to deal with. Throat burning, globus, swelling, all that good stuff! Has anyone had any success treating LPR with the paleo diet (or supplements)? If so, what have you tried? I've tried the apple cider vinegar trick, didn't seem to work. No grains, legumes, or dairy for me either. Last night I had wild salmon fillet (parsley, oregano and basil) with celery, and still got the stupid throat issue. I have been extraordinarily stressed lately, but I'm not sure if that's the cause. Also here's a list of stuff I'm trying:

Probiotics Fish Oil Magnesium Digestive Enzymes Herbal Tinctures (bitters) Licorice extract L-glutamine with arginine B vitamin supplement Multi-vitamin supplement

(all of the above contain no wheat, soy or gluten that I'm aware of--the herbal tinctures may have been from grain alcohol, but the herbalist I see says that its all filtered out (and he's intense paleo!) )

Again, any suggestions would be welcome...or encouragement even...what? I like digital head-patting!

Go-go pa-le-o!

46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 11, 2011
at 11:47 PM

add: oh, and I also stopped eating nightshades a few days ago too.

46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 11, 2011
at 11:43 PM

update: So much for the yogurt idea, GERD is back again, and I had the yogurt this morning. Unfortunately it has actually flared up only since going Paleo 2 weeks ago, before that I had been doing well with it. I ate similar to Paleo before, the only difference now is dropping starches (mostly just a little daily bread) and not eating the occasional cheese. Much as I'm otherwise loving Paleo, the not being as hungry and weight loss especially, I gotta wonder, is it the Paleo diet?

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 07:01 PM

Here's another link, about making "fruit soda" with your water kefir. That's what I do; it's naturally low-to-not-sweetened without artificial chemicals: http://wellnessmama.com/2261/how-to-make-water-kefir-soda/

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 06:57 PM

@Jon, I've been doing the water kefir for about 5 weeks. I started with small daily doses as it's much more powerful than yogurt. You can buy dairy kefir at supermarkets but I don't know how "live" it is. I haven't seen water kefir available commercially--you buy a starter culture, or get one from a friend, and make your own. Because you're feeding a live culture, it needs to be a daily routine although if you must you can rest them in the fridge occasionally. Here's a link to basic info: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-t9C7PoBRc

E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 08, 2011
at 04:27 AM

*know little about

E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 08, 2011
at 04:27 AM

To Nance, Sorry for that! That was more of me thinking...err...typing out loud in hopes to figure out a plausible answer. That's amazing to here about the water kefir! Could you please give me some more info? I really no little about it (as far as brands, if there are any or how to make it, side effects ect.). Any help would be much appreciated! Oh, and before I forget, how long have you used the water kefir? Do you feel (or have you read) that you'll be able to taper off it (or stop cold turkey) at any point? Thanks again, for the help paleo people!

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 03:35 AM

By the way, I forgot to mention that since I started drinking the water kefir my pulse, which has been fast my entire life, slowed down and is now around my age--64. It was mid-to-high 70s before.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 03:30 AM

@Jon, I'm not sure I understand your question. I agree the good effects I've experienced are from the water kefir. In fact, before drinking water kefir for a month I had a lifelong intolerance of yogurt. That said, my GI tract has been spooky quiet since I started daily use of the water kefir and, later, the yogurt.

46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 08, 2011
at 02:16 AM

Yes, I figure it's about the probiotic in the yogurt.

E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 07, 2011
at 05:31 PM

I didn't want to fit all of my reply into this tiny looming box, so I'll use this to say thank you so much for the advice...and see below for my follow-up.

0e9ddbd345ed53954d2c3eb4edc954c9

(203)

on December 07, 2011
at 09:07 AM

I'm keen to hear of any answers on this one too. No success for me so far. I did test positive for h.pylori but after taking the antibiotics my LPR symptoms haven't changed.

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9 Answers

2
Ea55e74c1ca497e748f9e00934181cea

(183)

on December 07, 2011
at 03:38 PM

I have been battling this for the last 4 year, and I can tell you it sucks and bad. I still have this but its really seems to get worse with stress, coffee and tea and it feels better when I have a bit of something in my stomach. I have been using previcid for the last 2 year which has helped but leaves me bloated. I also think weight gain impacts it lots since I have gained 20#. The use of the items you list have helped me but not as much as the 30mg pevicid first thing in the am on an empty stomach. I really wish I could use something natural but only DLG from NOW really helps and enzymes from NOW work a bit too. I feel your pain and if you don't get it under control it will get do bad it hits your gag reflex and you fell like you want to vomit. Any other ideas I am willing to share as well. Keep posting!

1
96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 07, 2011
at 07:55 PM

Building on what Missi said, I'm finding both home-made full-fat yogurt and water kefir very soothing to my stomach and GI tract re: the GERD/LPR issues--I think I've suffered both as I've had all symptoms listed for both.

1) But even with yogurt and water kefir in my daily menu, I still have trouble if I eat/drink calories much after 3 pm. I've settled on an IF program that is either 1 large meal at mid-day or a yogurt/fruit/kefir grain "dessert" breakfast at mid-day followed by a meal an hour or two later. I am asking for trouble if I eat in the evening, no matter what food I try.
2) I have to avoid white potatoes. If I eat a French fry, my stomach keeps popping it (and stomach contents) back up into my esophagus. Okay, message received and understood.
3) I lost my gallbladder some years ago so even at mid-day, if I eat a large fatty meal I need to supplement with bile salts, and sometimes acid, to avoid having food still in my stomach in the evening. If it gets out of my stomach, I am symptom free; if it's still there, I have problems.

I don't know where you stand with the above, but I hope it helps to have the info.

1
46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 07, 2011
at 06:46 PM

I recently looked around the net for GERD advice during an episode and came across quite a few comments saying yogurt to have worked wonders, even saying the GERD returned when they didn't eat the yogurt. I've added a little bit per day back in (a glopping teaspoon of plain greek yogurt, no sugar) and I'm feeling better, so despite it not being paleo (a touch of primal I suppose) I'm going to keep eating it.

46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 11, 2011
at 11:43 PM

update: So much for the yogurt idea, GERD is back again, and I had the yogurt this morning. Unfortunately it has actually flared up only since going Paleo 2 weeks ago, before that I had been doing well with it. I ate similar to Paleo before, the only difference now is dropping starches (mostly just a little daily bread) and not eating the occasional cheese. Much as I'm otherwise loving Paleo, the not being as hungry and weight loss especially, I gotta wonder, is it the Paleo diet?

46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 11, 2011
at 11:47 PM

add: oh, and I also stopped eating nightshades a few days ago too.

1
E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 07, 2011
at 05:29 PM

Raydawg,

When you say reflux, are you referring to GERD or LPR (or the dreaded combo)? I've removed all dairy from my diet months ago, so it is doubtful that the issue lies there. Unfortunately (gather around children, it's "Real Talk"), I am a highly stressed person as of right now--no more panic attacks, but still stressed. Between college finals (graduating semester), health issues (LPR), and a relationship in which I've no * clue where I stand half the time, I am under a lot of stress. The thing is, several months ago, I had LPR and GERD that progressively became better (to the point the GERD is non-existent) over time. Eventually, my LPR episodes went down to 1-2 times a day (for a few minutes) to a few times a week...then...BAM! Finals, relationship (it feels like one but not really she's been rather cold it seems AHHHHHH!! Okay...got that out of my system ahem), and of course when the LPR comes back I throw that into the worry cocktail. In addition, my sleep patterns have been way off as of late.

Here's my question (in addition to that whole litany of other inquiries): Can residual cortisol/adrenal issues cause this? I say residual, because the frequent urination and panic attacks are gone. Is there a high probability my LPR is caused by (or greatly aggravated to the point of being uncontrollable by paleo, supplements or what have you) all this stress I'm having as of late?

Good news: School will be over soon, so that's one stress factor nipped.

1
96440612cf0fcf366bf5ad8f776fca84

(19463)

on December 07, 2011
at 03:58 PM

Mine (reflux) took about a month to clean up, and it didn't happen until I also removed dairy.

Frequent urination + anxiety points to adrenal/cortisol issues. You'll need to get these fixed. Holy Basil (aka Tulsi Tea) can help a bit with this. Removing the caffeine will help some.

There's a recent podcast here that addresses adrenal issues. A lot of this is how you view things.

If you have reflux at night, this is likely the source of your stress, if so, it'll be a bit of a catch-22.

E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 07, 2011
at 05:31 PM

I didn't want to fit all of my reply into this tiny looming box, so I'll use this to say thank you so much for the advice...and see below for my follow-up.

1
E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 07, 2011
at 07:18 AM

Forgot to add a few details:

1.) Tested for the H. pylori bug. Negative.

2.) The bitters are supposed to do the same job as HCL pills (acid production).

3.) I stay away from nightshades, too.

0
E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 08, 2011
at 10:40 PM

Hey me with a "D", (Don...in case anyone didn't get--you know what, nevermind.)

This story pretty much parallels my own. I cannot speak for you or anyone else, but I think that "fine tuning" is needed in our paleo diets. I think the best analogy is that our digestive systems are like poor foundations of bridges in that they're run-down, moments from falling apart, but so long as we don't mess with the normal flow of traffic, everything's fine. Once we start tinkering, well..."sh*t happens" for lack of a better phrase. I'd highly suggest you give this a shot (I'm going to start tomorrow!). Also, let's do ourselves a favor and try to get our stress under control, okay? I'm not saying you have no reason to be stressed (I know I certainly do!), but even if we want to heal, shooting our cortisol levels through the roof and triggering adrenal fatigue seems like a rather ass-backwards approach. Hang in there!

http://www.primal-palate.com/2011/07/reflecting-on-year-of-paleo-what-fk-is.html

0
Ea55e74c1ca497e748f9e00934181cea

(183)

on December 08, 2011
at 06:50 PM

Jon

I barley have it under control but it appears I am worse with coffee tea and diet anything. I also felt much better 20# ago, I am 6' 220 now and turning to Paleo to lose more weight so I can get off the medication. I also found a greens drink to work well, I use Controlled Labs Greens. My LPR was brought on by stress and has never left, caffine seems to not help at all but I sometimes need it to get through the day. I really just need to eat better and get in better shape. I have been on and off Paleo at times, feel better on it when eating more greens.

0
E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 08, 2011
at 02:04 AM

To Nance and Missi:

If you prescribe to the notion of hypochloridia and bacterial/parasitic infection in your gut flora (not saying it's not a valid theory, I'm just saying it depends on which way you fall) then it is not the dairy helping your acid reflux but rather the probiotics present in the yogurt and kefir (kefir, to my knowledge is also supposed to have anti-fungal and anti-bacterial properties). Therefore, it is plausible that there is an imbalance of gut flora (this is where I think my chronic stress comes into play as it disrupts gut flora http://paleodietlifestyle.com/you-and-your-gut-flora/). Since I'm taking a probiotic, I would assume I'm covered on that front (high quality one, too--10 billion + L. bac ect.). Plus, I'm allergic to dairy...so, yeah, haha.

To Don:

So are you saying that you've got it under control for the most part, and that it is only brought on by certain triggers? You say you've gained weight, and to me that sounds as much a sign of stress as anything. I really believe reflux is exacerbated by stress more than we can imagine (and most doctors will admit). I can attest that my IBS acts up in conjunction with my reflux (no reflux, no IBS). I've even experienced BMS (burning mouth syndrome) once from...well, I'll skip over that to save face haha--but still it happened. My mouth felt like it was on fire. Heck, I've got muscle twitches and cramps from stress (probably magnesium deficiency as well, but I'm working on that aspect). One week my blood pressure was sky high, next week (acupuncture and meditation) it's near perfect (for whatever perfect measures on blood pressure). I'm fairly certain at this point, that stress can do whatever the hell it wants to your body. And I know, people like you and I may not think we're stressed, but that doesn't mean we aren't. If I can offer some hope to you it would be this, my LPR was getting better to the point of almost being gone at one point (a little dry mouth in the morning was all, which could be a variety of things). Then when the stress piled on, it comes roaring back.

E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 08, 2011
at 04:27 AM

To Nance, Sorry for that! That was more of me thinking...err...typing out loud in hopes to figure out a plausible answer. That's amazing to here about the water kefir! Could you please give me some more info? I really no little about it (as far as brands, if there are any or how to make it, side effects ect.). Any help would be much appreciated! Oh, and before I forget, how long have you used the water kefir? Do you feel (or have you read) that you'll be able to taper off it (or stop cold turkey) at any point? Thanks again, for the help paleo people!

E8dd83fe24a0879d8b16ab4ca92b72dd

(1307)

on December 08, 2011
at 04:27 AM

*know little about

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 03:35 AM

By the way, I forgot to mention that since I started drinking the water kefir my pulse, which has been fast my entire life, slowed down and is now around my age--64. It was mid-to-high 70s before.

46bee6b93ee79082ea1094f26c2da5a4

(837)

on December 08, 2011
at 02:16 AM

Yes, I figure it's about the probiotic in the yogurt.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 03:30 AM

@Jon, I'm not sure I understand your question. I agree the good effects I've experienced are from the water kefir. In fact, before drinking water kefir for a month I had a lifelong intolerance of yogurt. That said, my GI tract has been spooky quiet since I started daily use of the water kefir and, later, the yogurt.

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 07:01 PM

Here's another link, about making "fruit soda" with your water kefir. That's what I do; it's naturally low-to-not-sweetened without artificial chemicals: http://wellnessmama.com/2261/how-to-make-water-kefir-soda/

96bf58d8c6bd492dc5b8ae46203fe247

(37227)

on December 08, 2011
at 06:57 PM

@Jon, I've been doing the water kefir for about 5 weeks. I started with small daily doses as it's much more powerful than yogurt. You can buy dairy kefir at supermarkets but I don't know how "live" it is. I haven't seen water kefir available commercially--you buy a starter culture, or get one from a friend, and make your own. Because you're feeding a live culture, it needs to be a daily routine although if you must you can rest them in the fridge occasionally. Here's a link to basic info: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-t9C7PoBRc

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