Hey all. I'll spare you the sordid details of the various health conditions I've inherited. Suffice it to say that after much research and consultation, I'm convinced that trying a Vitamin K2 (MK-4) supplement is a good idea for me. I'm aware of all of the great dietary sources, but said afflictions limit my options.
The only thing I'm unconvinced about is how much to take. For my current state (5'9", 175lbs, strong, active, paleo, some underlying inflammation), I've seen recommendations that run from 120mcg to 45g per day. That seems like a huuuge variation. My primary motivation is the prevention of atherosclerosis and other cardiac nasties.
If you take K2, where do you lie on the dosage spectrum and why?
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I think this is one of the better ones to take: http://www.amazon.com/Carlson-Labs-Vitamin-K2-caps/dp/B001PBQR82/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1326313159&sr=8-2
However I think it's unwise to take that much of any fat soluble vitamin every day. A good protocol would be to take that every day for a week when you first start out to charge up your stores a bit and then drop down to 2-4 times per month. That a deficiency is bad doesn't make any positive amount good.
If someone has come across a human regulatory mechanism for K2 whereby the body purges excess, I'd be interested in seeing it. As of now, I'm unaware of one. D3 has one in the skin that is UVB-dependent of course, but since K2 always comes from diet, it would make sense that there would be one. Even so, I'm not certain that such a thing (should it exist) is designed for massive doses.
I have 35 years of alternative health behind me and research nutraceuticals as my profession.
45 mcgs is preventative, 90 mcgs is shown to reverse calcification from soft tissues and deposit it in the bones.
I take Life Extension D3, K2, Iodine supplement at 2 a day.
Here are 2 videos you will find interesting. Starts in German
One drop (1mg) per day of http://www.amazon.com/Thorne-Research-Vitamin-k2-liquid/dp/B000FGWDTK/
Vitamin K2 MK4 works synergistically with Vit D3 to efficiently move calcium into the bones.
Quoting the Quilt "Vitamin D3 basically allows us to absorb Calcium better but Vitamin K2 tells that calcium what tissue to go to."
I also use Vitamin Research Products K2 MK4. Each cap has 15mg and I take two/day. I take 50,000/day D3 during the winter. VRP periodically runs order 2 of the same product and the order is 50% off.
I use the Life Extension "Super K with Advanced K2 Complex". It has 1MG K2-MK4, 100mcg K2-MK7, and 1MG of K1. Honestly I don't know whether it is sufficient or not but I am not sure recommended daily minimums, maximums, etc... have been established for K2, nor do I believe anyone has established any upper level toxicity.
I don't regularly supplement. I do however eat lots of eggs. Its my understanding that the yolks of the eggs contain a substantial amount of K2. Recently I have moved north.. Far north. To Alaska. I feel like I might need to start considering a supplement to counteract my lack of sunlight. I used to receive a daily dosage but now the only time I'm in the sun, I'm so bundled up that I no longer feel the warmth from the sun.. The obvious answer would be suck it up and brave the cold.. But I was wondering if someone could recommend a food that might help in this situation..
This study showed Vitamin K2 MK-7 does work. I started eating Natto (fermented soybeans) which provide 1100 mcg per 3+ oz. serving. I'm eating a half serving for now, but will increase to a full serving after a week with no adverse reaction.
While the K2 will distribute calcium appropriately, to your bones and teeth, when it removes it from soft tissue like the vascular walls, it is eliminated from the body in conjunction with Vitamin A as waste. (It doesn't move from arteries to bone).
The recommendation is 180-200 mcg Vitamin K2 MK-7 per 1000 IU Vitamin D3.
I take 5mg. The Carlson brand is what's easiest for me to get. A long time ago Stephan Guyenet suggested that 1mg ought to be the supplementary dose because that's about the max anybody could reasonably expect to get in a day through food. Also, at 1mg or above, you ought to notice some improvements in your skin.
Anyway, it was just easier to keep taking the 5mg, though I might try those 1mg drops eventually. It seems like it might be advantageous to take a few mg throughout the day rather than 5mg all at once- supposedly it only lasts 4 hours in your blood stream.
MK7 is supposed to last longer, but I don't know proper dosages for that, nor do I know if it is as effective. I know K1 supplementation was downright unpleasant- I've tried it alone, and much later tried that previously mentioned Life Extension product. K1 makes my teeth feel strange, makes my body react unpleasantly to alcohol, and gives me a weird wired feeling. Probably just me though.
I do not take K2 but I have enjoyed reading about it on Free The Animal here.
I take 15mg daily by Vitamin Research Products. Several reasons: I sun bathe almost daily and I used to have trouble with intermittent bruising. A nice lady on a different forum said she attributed K2 for improving her "turkey" neck. I have loose skin under my chin from age and weight loss that I'd love to see tighten up with a pill!
I get my K2 by taking a vitamin D3 Plus. 5000 IU of D3, includes 800 mcg of K2, 225 mg magnesium, 12 mg zinc, and 3mg boron.
IF YOU TAKE HIGH DOSES OF VIT D YOU HAVE TO TAKE HIGH DOSES OF VIT K--OTHERWISE VIT D DIRECTS CALCIUM TO SOFT TISSUE (SO CARDIOVASCULAR--ATHEROSCLEROSIS PROBLEMS)--WITH HIGH K CAN EVEN REDIRECT THIS INCORRECTLY DEPOSITED CALCIUM OUT OF THE SOFT TISSUE, AND INTO BONE. IF HIGH D, OR FOR REDIRECTING CALCIUM, ANYWHERE FROM 1 T- 15 MG IS RECCOMENDED--JAPANESE STUDIES SHOW 15 MG GOOD TO STOP AND SOMEWHAT CORRECT OSTEOPOROSIS
For a down-to-earth dose of mk-4 K2, buy thorne's liquid D3/mk-4 drops. One drop has 100 mcg of K2. Try to take half a drop for 50 mcg, which is on the high side of what is possible through diet alone.
I'm taking the Thorne K2 drops at 15mg per day. As for why, the truth is I haven't the foggiest idea what a good dose is for supplementing, especially for someone who chronically hasn't gotten nearly enough and wants to bring serum levels up, and it's what the package says is a dose.
I have to say, though, since I started taking it, I barely get sick at all. I've been through most of the common cold season, three times thought I was about to come down with something, and then the feeling went away in about 36 hours, before it ever got serious.
Is that true about needing a lot of vitamin k if you take a lot of vitamin D? That sucks, because k supplementation is so expensive. Maybe I'll just start taking less vitamin D...I take a lot as of now.
Sorry I don't follow the paleo diet but I try to keep the principles in mind, & i found this when searching how much K2 to take. I don't know how much vitamin K2 I get from diet, I'd guess not too much because I don't eat the amount of meat of the paleo diet, and none of the rich sources.
EGOOD'S answer made me pause and ponder what I'm taking. I'm currently taking Vitamin K2 (45 mcg) and D3 (50000) in one capsule by ortho molecular. I'm over 60 and definitely don't want artheroclerosis as my mother and possibly grandmother both had this. It sounds like I'm taking too much vit D3. I was just about to order another bottle, but will wait until further reading. Any suggestions anyone for someone my age?
I have been taking one per day of Nature's Life MK4 5000mcg (5mg) for a few months now. My (double) bottle pack is almost up and I will be backing off a bit kinda like what Travis suggests. Maybe taking like 1 or 2 pills per week instead of daily.
The only K2 I've been able to get hold of from my local health shop is Solgar K2 mk 7, from Natto. Isa this going to work OK? The info on the label says each pill provides 130% RDA, so I am having 2 per day until my cold goes away.
I also eat quite a number of free range eggs per week - today I had two in an omelette.
Also, I've lost the links I had to what exactly K2 DOES - I had read a load about it and made a note to myself that it was a must have, but why??!!
After online research revealed that there is no consensus on whether mk4 or mk7 is better, I ended up with Life Extension's Super K, which has both.
I take one a day.
I take Carlson 5mg k2 every morning with my cod liver oil and some extra D. I also try to have some raw grassfed Gouda too because it has the mk7 and mk4.
Anecdotally, I was off it for 2 months and got back on it and 3 weeks later my breastfed 13 month old started sprouting his molars. He was about due for them anyway but I remember his other teeth coming in last year a few weeks after I started the clo and k2 regimen. I got my teeth really late as a toddler I think I only had my bottom two at 12 months.
I'm taking the dosage that Travis takes, don't remember what it is, but he can tell ya. I don't remember why I'm taking it, just that he made a convincing argument, so after I internalized the info, I guess I no longer needed to keep the argument in mind. it's a combo capsule, with D3.
As for Kameron's question about the cold, I don't think paleo hurts a bit, if anything it helps, and there have been some cold nights here in Minnesota when I'm going hatless and coatless like a kid again. I do think I'm eating more fat with the colder weather. I guess I just recommend eating fat.